Is your church in danger?

Is your church in danger?

Posted in the Blue Ridge Forum

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Orion

United States

#1 Nov 6, 2017
Churches can be endangered by foes without, such as by the crazed Texas shooter, but also by foes within. One of the latter varieties comes from those who wish to turn the focus away from sound doctrine to entertainment ... the Rick Warren model of doing church. Many churches have already fallen prey to this foe. Is your church in danger? Here are some some signs to look for:

Change in music to a contemporary rock style.
Removal of hymn books; eliminating the choir.
Replacement of organ and piano with heavy metal instruments.
Repetitive singing of praise lyrics.
Dressing down to casual and informal attire.
Eliminating of business meetings, church committees, council of elders, board of deacons, etc.
The pastor, or a new leader with a few assistants, usually four, takes charge of all church business.
A repetitive 40-day Purpose Driven Church study program stressing psychological relationships with each other, the community, or the world, begins.
Funded budgeted programs are abandoned, or ignored, with ambiguous financial reports made.
Sunday morning, evening, and/or Wednesday prayer meetings are changed to other times; some may even be eliminated.
Sunday School teachers are moved to different classes, or replaced by new teachers more sympathetic with the changes being implemented.
The name “Sunday School” is dropped and classes are given new names.
Crosses and other traditional Christian symbols may be moved from both the inside and outside of the church buildings. The pulpit may also be removed.
In accordance with Dr. Warren’s instructions, new version Bibles are used; or only verses flashed on a screen are referenced during regular services.
Purpose Driven Church films, purchased from Saddleback, precede or are used during regular services.
The decor, including the carpets, may be changed to eliminate any resemblance to the former church.
The word “church” is often taken from the name of the church, and the church may be called a “campus”. Denominational names may also be removed.
An emphasis on more fun and party sessions for the youth.
Elimination of altar calls or salvation invitations at the close of the services.
The elimination of such words as “unsaved”,“lost”,“sin”,“Hell”, “Heaven” and other Gospel verities from the pastor’s messages.
The reclassification of the saved and lost to the “churched” and the “unchurched”.
The marginalizing, or ostracizing, of all who are not avid promoters of the new Purpose Driven Program.
Closed meetings between the pastor or chosen staff members without any reports made to the general membership.
Open hostility to members who do not openly embrace the new program, or who may have left for another church.

IF YOU SEE ANY OF THESE SIGNS, TAKE ACTION. I post this as a concerned Baptist, but other churches are in danger as well.

JamesR

Blue Ridge, GA

#2 Nov 6, 2017
Orion wrote:
Churches can be endangered by foes without, such as by the crazed Texas shooter, but also by foes within. One of the latter varieties comes from those who wish to turn the focus away from sound doctrine to entertainment ... the Rick Warren model of doing church. Many churches have already fallen prey to this foe. Is your church in danger? Here are some some signs to look for:

Change in music to a contemporary rock style.
Removal of hymn books; eliminating the choir.
Replacement of organ and piano with heavy metal instruments.
Repetitive singing of praise lyrics.
Dressing down to casual and informal attire.
Eliminating of business meetings, church committees, council of elders, board of deacons, etc.
The pastor, or a new leader with a few assistants, usually four, takes charge of all church business.
A repetitive 40-day Purpose Driven Church study program stressing psychological relationships with each other, the community, or the world, begins.
Funded budgeted programs are abandoned, or ignored, with ambiguous financial reports made.
Sunday morning, evening, and/or Wednesday prayer meetings are changed to other times; some may even be eliminated.
Sunday School teachers are moved to different classes, or replaced by new teachers more sympathetic with the changes being implemented.
The name “Sunday School” is dropped and classes are given new names.
Crosses and other traditional Christian symbols may be moved from both the inside and outside of the church buildings. The pulpit may also be removed.
In accordance with Dr. Warren’s instructions, new version Bibles are used; or only verses flashed on a screen are referenced during regular services.
Purpose Driven Church films, purchased from Saddleback, precede or are used during regular services.
The decor, including the carpets, may be changed to eliminate any resemblance to the former church.
The word “church” is often taken from the name of the church, and the church may be called a “campus”. Denominational names may also be removed.
An emphasis on more fun and party sessions for the youth.
Elimination of altar calls or salvation invitations at the close of the services.
The elimination of such words as “unsaved”,“lost”,“sin”,“Hell”, “Heaven” and other Gospel verities from the pastor’s messages.
The reclassification of the saved and lost to the “churched” and the “unchurched”.
The marginalizing, or ostracizing, of all who are not avid promoters of the new Purpose Driven Program.
Closed meetings between the pastor or chosen staff members without any reports made to the general membership.
Open hostility to members who do not openly embrace the new program, or who may have left for another church.

IF YOU SEE ANY OF THESE SIGNS, TAKE ACTION. I post this as a concerned Baptist, but other churches are in danger as well.

You are right about there being danger within, but I am also concerned the danger without. It seems to me every church needs to appoint six or more men to be security officers. These men should be trained and armed. If that had been the case in Texas, those in the pew would not have been sitting ducks. Those in law enforcement would be ideal for this job.
MaryMary

United States

#3 Nov 9, 2017
JamesR wrote:
<quoted text>

You are right about there being danger within, but I am also concerned the danger without. It seems to me every church needs to appoint six or more men to be security officers. These men should be trained and armed. If that had been the case in Texas, those in the pew would not have been sitting ducks. Those in law enforcement would be ideal for this job.
It is safer to just watch church at home on my tv. If I dont like what I see I can just turn the channel.
Get the message

United States

#4 Tuesday Oct 30
MaryMary wrote:
<quoted text>

It is safer to just watch church at home on my tv. If I dont like what I see I can just turn the channel.
Maybe so, no distractions from other people you can focus on the message. If you hear and absorb, that's the main thing.
Kumbaya

Ellijay, GA

#5 Tuesday Oct 30
Question..Is it true you must pay to secure a place in Heaven? If the person next to me contributes more than me, will he or she be treated any different than me upon reaching Heaven? Is it okay for the Pastor to wear high end suits, imported Italian leather shoes, drive a high end car such as a BMW, own and wear expensive jewelry, raid the coffers at will to maintain a lifestyle of luxury, dine in fancy food eating establishments, etc? And I didn't even bring up the wife! Wake up people and smell the crap once and for all, stand up to the biggest con job ever in the history of Mankind. Don't believe me, try following your self proclaimed 'Holy Man' and simply watch what he does when away from the church. I rest my case!!!
Deepriverwoman

Blue Ridge, GA

#6 Wednesday Oct 31
MaryMary wrote:
<quoted text>

It is safer to just watch church at home on my tv. If I dont like what I see I can just turn the channel.
No.... Most are crooks
FBC

Blue Ridge, GA

#7 Wednesday Oct 31
Orion wrote:
Churches can be endangered by foes without, such as by the crazed Texas shooter, but also by foes within. One of the latter varieties comes from those who wish to turn the focus away from sound doctrine to entertainment ... the Rick Warren model of doing church. Many churches have already fallen prey to this foe. Is your church in danger? Here are some some signs to look for:

Change in music to a contemporary rock style.
Removal of hymn books; eliminating the choir.
Replacement of organ and piano with heavy metal instruments.
Repetitive singing of praise lyrics.
Dressing down to casual and informal attire.
Eliminating of business meetings, church committees, council of elders, board of deacons, etc.
The pastor, or a new leader with a few assistants, usually four, takes charge of all church business.
A repetitive 40-day Purpose Driven Church study program stressing psychological relationships with each other, the community, or the world, begins.
Funded budgeted programs are abandoned, or ignored, with ambiguous financial reports made.
Sunday morning, evening, and/or Wednesday prayer meetings are changed to other times; some may even be eliminated.
Sunday School teachers are moved to different classes, or replaced by new teachers more sympathetic with the changes being implemented.
The name “Sunday School” is dropped and classes are given new names.
Crosses and other traditional Christian symbols may be moved from both the inside and outside of the church buildings. The pulpit may also be removed.
In accordance with Dr. Warren’s instructions, new version Bibles are used; or only verses flashed on a screen are referenced during regular services.
Purpose Driven Church films, purchased from Saddleback, precede or are used during regular services.
The decor, including the carpets, may be changed to eliminate any resemblance to the former church.
The word “church” is often taken from the name of the church, and the church may be called a “campus”. Denominational names may also be removed.
An emphasis on more fun and party sessions for the youth.
Elimination of altar calls or salvation invitations at the close of the services.
The elimination of such words as “unsaved”,“lost”,“sin”,“Hell”, “Heaven” and other Gospel verities from the pastor’s messages.
The reclassification of the saved and lost to the “churched” and the “unchurched”.
The marginalizing, or ostracizing, of all who are not avid promoters of the new Purpose Driven Program.
Closed meetings between the pastor or chosen staff members without any reports made to the general membership.
Open hostility to members who do not openly embrace the new program, or who may have left for another church.

IF YOU SEE ANY OF THESE SIGNS, TAKE ACTION. I post this as a concerned Baptist, but other churches are in danger as well.

The Ridge?
Deepriverwoman

Blue Ridge, GA

#8 Wednesday Oct 31
FBC wrote:
<quoted text>

The Ridge?
Big time!
FBC

Blue Ridge, GA

#9 Thursday Nov 1
They sure have siphoned off a lot of young people from many solid Baptist Churches with their entertainment 'religion'. How will these young people stand against the tide of cultural pressures they will be facing as adults with no foundation of belief? Very sad.
STFU

United States

#10 Saturday Nov 3
FBC wrote:
They sure have siphoned off a lot of young people from many solid Baptist Churches with their entertainment 'religion'. How will these young people stand against the tide of cultural pressures they will be facing as adults with no foundation of belief? Very sad.
How does your church feel about you going on message boards slamming other churches?
Hemptown

Blue Ridge, GA

#11 Monday Nov 5
STFU wrote:
<quoted text>

How does your church feel about you going on message boards slamming other churches?
Ezekiel 33:6
STFU

United States

#12 Monday Nov 5
Hemptown wrote:
<quoted text>

Ezekiel 33:6
Nice try, but it doesn't answer the question. Try again.

I've been to some churches who conduct services as described above. Without fail, the message has been bible based, so I'm not sure what your problem is. You don't like the music? Big deal, how does that put anyone "in danger"? I enjoy an updated approach to music, there is no harm in that. It doesn't mean that I don't like and respect the old standards. Surely you're not suggesting only the old hymns can be the only ones heard from now on.

Seems like your time could be better spent doing something useful.
FCHS10

Blue Ridge, GA

#13 Monday Nov 12
STFU wrote:
<quoted text>

Nice try, but it doesn't answer the question. Try again.

I've been to some churches who conduct services as described above. Without fail, the message has been bible based, so I'm not sure what your problem is. You don't like the music? Big deal, how does that put anyone "in danger"? I enjoy an updated approach to music, there is no harm in that. It doesn't mean that I don't like and respect the old standards. Surely you're not suggesting only the old hymns can be the only ones heard from now on.

Seems like your time could be better spent doing something useful.
You go to your Rick Warren-style entertainment 'church'. I will go where the atmosphere is worshipful and the Bible is preached.
Kumbaya

Ellijay, GA

#14 Monday Nov 12
FCHS10 wrote:
<quoted text>

You go to your Rick Warren-style entertainment 'church'. I will go where the atmosphere is worshipful and the Bible is preached.
You go ahead and attend your church, just make sure you bring your wallet so you can secure a place in heaven. And remember, your so called holly man is counting on you to do just that.$$$$$$$$$ will set you free!
STFU

United States

#15 Monday Nov 12
FCHS10 wrote:
<quoted text>

You go to your Rick Warren-style entertainment 'church'. I will go where the atmosphere is worshipful and the Bible is preached.
You opted not to respond to the content of my post, likely because you have nothing useful to contribute. Typical.
FCHS10

Blue Ridge, GA

#16 Tuesday Nov 13
STFU wrote:
<quoted text>

You opted not to respond to the content of my post, likely because you have nothing useful to contribute. Typical.
You and the attitude you displayed are the reason why so many young people today have so little regard for Christianity and the Church. Why would anyone want to be a part of an organization where people snipe at each other in the manner you do?
STFU

United States

#17 Wednesday Nov 14
FCHS10 wrote:
<quoted text>

You and the attitude you displayed are the reason why so many young people today have so little regard for Christianity and the Church. Why would anyone want to be a part of an organization where people snipe at each other in the manner you do?
Lol, look at the topic and tone of the thread! Don't get mad at me because you can't defend your position!
FCHS10

Blue Ridge, GA

#18 Thursday Nov 15
As I read through the threads in this topic, it appears the person who began it issued a sincere and thoughtful warning. Without controversy, the dangers mentioned are real and relevant to Baptist churches in Fannin and surrounding counties. People need to be aware of these dangers and take action. I will take my marching orders from 1 Peter 5:8-9. Frankly, I don't see your beef. Sister Osteen, as an American, if you are happy in a compromised, feel-good, entertainment-focused church, you have every right to attend that 'church'. Just don't go around sniping at people who want to stay true to the scriptures and follow the old paths. I think the reason you are protesting is because you know something is not right were you are and don't want to admit it. May God work on your heart.
Kumbaya

Ellijay, GA

#19 Thursday Nov 15
FCHS10 wrote:
As I read through the threads in this topic, it appears the person who began it issued a sincere and thoughtful warning. Without controversy, the dangers mentioned are real and relevant to Baptist churches in Fannin and surrounding counties. People need to be aware of these dangers and take action. I will take my marching orders from 1 Peter 5:8-9. Frankly, I don't see your beef. Sister Osteen, as an American, if you are happy in a compromised, feel-good, entertainment-focused church, you have every right to attend that 'church'. Just don't go around sniping at people who want to stay true to the scriptures and follow the old paths. I think the reason you are protesting is because you know something is not right were you are and don't want to admit it. May God work on your heart.
Maybe in time you will finally see 'The Light' and realize you have been deceived by the biggest scam known to mankind. but until you do, we would appreciate it if you refrain from posting lies on this site. Can I get an Amen?
STFU

United States

#20 Thursday Nov 15
FCHS10 wrote:
As I read through the threads in this topic, it appears the person who began it issued a sincere and thoughtful warning. Without controversy, the dangers mentioned are real and relevant to Baptist churches in Fannin and surrounding counties. People need to be aware of these dangers and take action. I will take my marching orders from 1 Peter 5:8-9. Frankly, I don't see your beef. Sister Osteen, as an American, if you are happy in a compromised, feel-good, entertainment-focused church, you have every right to attend that 'church'. Just don't go around sniping at people who want to stay true to the scriptures and follow the old paths. I think the reason you are protesting is because you know something is not right were you are and don't want to admit it. May God work on your heart.
The fact that you feel compelled to come here and post criticisms of other churches (that I am sure you've never attended) tells me all I need to know about you and the quality of your opinions. You can shove that osteen comment where the sun doesn't shine, by the way.

My previous contemporary church was pretty hardcore, certainly bible focused, and was a member of the SBC, as I suspect yours is.

My current church is a traditional church that added a contemporary service. Same church, same pastor, same bible.

Sounds like things aren't great where YOU are, so maybe you need to look at that. Either way, your time could be better spent doing something besides this type of nonsense.

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