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Al A Baster

Nicholasville, KY

#22 Nov 23, 2013
Fud wrote:
<quoted text>
Because the bible at best is fiction.
The Bible is a collection of stories over several thousand years to illustrate that we all fall short.

I find nothing wrong or fictional with the greatest commandment in the Bible which all other laws are based on... loving myself, loving others as I love myself and loving The Creatator of Life within me.

Huh

Buford, GA

#23 Nov 24, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
<quoted text>
The Bible is a collection of stories over several thousand years to illustrate that we all fall short.
I find nothing wrong or fictional with the greatest commandment in the Bible which all other laws are based on... loving myself, loving others as I love myself and loving The Creatator of Life within me.

Really? And all this time I thought Loving God came first. How could I have missed this little gem of yours.
Al A Baster

Dawsonville, GA

#24 Nov 30, 2013
Huh wrote:
<quoted text>
Really? And all this time I thought Loving God came first. How could I have missed this little gem of yours.
I don't know. How could you have you missed this little gem of mine? Could it be that you are hung up on religious performance? I have known many church flakes who say they love God, but hate Blacks and other races. According to scripture if you don't love people first, then you sure can't love God.

“If anyone says,‘I love God,’ but hates his brother, he is a liar; for whoever does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen.”...

While I can’t say that I hated anyone particularly, this reading challenged me. I knew that I loved God with all my heart, but people?

Well, people are mean and obnoxious. They reject you and treat each other terribly. Loving God is a lot easier than loving people. Religious people say "God is love" and people are annoying. They hate people of other religions, gays, or whatever.

How could it be possible that I couldn’t truly love God unless I also loved people? The only order that matters is that God loved us first when were unloveable.
Just a thought

Commerce, GA

#25 Dec 1, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't know. How could you have you missed this little gem of mine? Could it be that you are hung up on religious performance? I have known many church flakes who say they love God, but hate Blacks and other races. According to scripture if you don't love people first, then you sure can't love God.
“If anyone says,‘I love God,’ but hates his brother, he is a liar; for whoever does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen.”...
While I can’t say that I hated anyone particularly, this reading challenged me. I knew that I loved God with all my heart, but people?
Well, people are mean and obnoxious. They reject you and treat each other terribly. Loving God is a lot easier than loving people. Religious people say "God is love" and people are annoying. They hate people of other religions, gays, or whatever.
How could it be possible that I couldn’t truly love God unless I also loved people? The only order that matters is that God loved us first when were unloveable.
Very good. God loves us and forgives us for our sins because he is God and we are of the flesh. We were created in his image but not his greatness.
Al A Baster

Cleveland, GA

#26 Dec 1, 2013
Just a thought wrote:
<quoted text>Very good. God loves us and forgives us for our sins because he is God and we are of the flesh. We were created in his image but not his greatness.
Just-a-thought, you are on a roll. I would like to take it to the next level.
As I'm sure you agree, humans have the capacity to make free choices which is part of being made in the image of God. The problem is many humans choose to rebel against the Creator. We bear the scars of sins both against us and of our own choosing, and we show the effects of sin morally, socially, mentally, and physically.
The good news is that when God redeems an individual, He begins to restore the original image of God. Through Christ, a “new self" is created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness (The image of Jesus Christ). That redemption is only available by God’s grace through faith in Jesus Christ as our Savior from the sin that separates us from God. Through Christ, we are made new creations in the likeness of God (2 Corinthians 5:17).

“Our Cause Isn't Lost”

Since: Jan 11

Blairsville, GA

#27 Dec 1, 2013
Personally, as a Christian, I think God may be quite displeased with the sparring upon this site invoking his name. Thus, I hesitate to comment upon clearly provoking baiting and malevolence.

Nonetheless, Christians do have a mission inspired by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ to spread the Word of Salvation through His amazing grace.

What is unique about the God of Abraham, the Triune God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) is that he granted his creation – Man – with freewill.

Therefore, any of us may decide to accept Him and the Salvation He provides us through Jesus Christ, or we may reject Him entirely. That choice can only be made by each individual personally, and only each individual in and of themselves.

Accordingly, our Christian mission to the individual, and those who haven’t heard and had the opportunity to accept or reject that Word of Salvation, stops upon that knowledge of the individual(s) being offered, but unmistakably rejecting God – Salvation.

Certainly a Christian should always, by way of example, lead a moral, exemplary Christian life, constantly spreading the Word of God. But, we have no right to force, badger, or demand anyone accept what God Himself does not.

Many Christians recognize and understand that there is undeniably a continual spiritual war intensifying between the forces of good and evil, this battle will have a conclusion, and that long anticipated finish, it appears, will start in the not to distant future.

Unfortunately, as that time draws near, many are still in denial, choosing instead to ignore reality, or, as is often seen, simply can’t or won’t make the critical decision of making commitment to having faith in the Almighty God.

Regrettably there are those who, know time is running out. And having chosen, in contrast, acceptance of the religions of Secular Humanists, and/or Theistic or Religious Satanists: they with malevolence attack, mock, and disparage the True God, and those who accept Him.

One final thought. Christians reject sin, not people. We believe we sin, we ask for forgiveness, and by our belief that Jesus Christ as the Son of God, died upon the Cross-for our sins, we receive forgiveness through Him, and consequently, through Faith, Eternal Salvation.

Therefore, those who think, or claim we have hatred for those who commit abominable sin are wrong. Christians have only love for the sinner, and pray for the sinner’s Salvation through repentance of the sin, and acceptance of Jesus as Savior.
Al A Baster

Cleveland, GA

#28 Dec 5, 2013
GA-LAW-FF said:

"One final thought. Christians reject sin, not people. We believe we sin, we ask for forgiveness, and by our belief that Jesus Christ as the Son of God, died upon the Cross-for our sins, we receive forgiveness through Him, and consequently, through Faith, Eternal Salvation."

Do you believe when Christians sin, they should ask for forgiveness again? If one "receives" forgiveness through Him (Christ), why do Christians need to ask for forgiveness over and over again?

“Skin a Floridian”

Since: Aug 09

Hiawassee, GA

#29 Dec 6, 2013
In the beginning thar was a peacefull little county in northern Ga and then the Floridians started move'n in................

“Our Cause Isn't Lost”

Since: Jan 11

Blairsville, GA

#30 Dec 6, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
GA-LAW-FF said:
"One final thought. Christians reject sin, not people. We believe we sin, we ask for forgiveness, and by our belief that Jesus Christ as the Son of God, died upon the Cross-for our sins, we receive forgiveness through Him, and consequently, through Faith, Eternal Salvation."
Do you believe when Christians sin, they should ask for forgiveness again? If one "receives" forgiveness through Him (Christ), why do Christians need to ask for forgiveness over and over again?
Can you be more precise?
Al A Baster

Commerce, GA

#31 Dec 8, 2013
GA-LAW-FF wrote:
<quoted text>
Can you be more precise?
GA-LAW-FF:

You seem to have a grasp of Grace. Perhaps you didn't go to the same church meetings that I have gone to. One message from the pulpit is this. When a Christian sins, he or she must ask for forgiveness every day. Perhaps this teaching comes from the uneducated.

My question is simply: Why does one need to ask for forgiveness over and over again? Put another way, is not trust in our Lord enough? Are sins present, past, and future forgiven?

When I put my trust in Christ for my salvation, ALL of my sins have been forgiven. Past present and future. I do not have to live in fear that when Christ comes or when I die, I might be ‘caught in the act’ of sinning in one form or another.
Just a thought

Canton, GA

#32 Dec 8, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
<quoted text>
GA-LAW-FF:
You seem to have a grasp of Grace. Perhaps you didn't go to the same church meetings that I have gone to. One message from the pulpit is this. When a Christian sins, he or she must ask for forgiveness every day. Perhaps this teaching comes from the uneducated.
My question is simply: Why does one need to ask for forgiveness over and over again? Put another way, is not trust in our Lord enough? Are sins present, past, and future forgiven?
When I put my trust in Christ for my salvation, ALL of my sins have been forgiven. Past present and future. I do not have to live in fear that when Christ comes or when I die, I might be ‘caught in the act’ of sinning in one form or another.
Christ died to free you from your sins but not to give you a free get out of jail card. By asking for forgiveness you are reconfirming your trust and belief in him and showing that you realize the sins you have committed and your willingness to try and correct them. Many will die believing that they are forgiven when in reality they have not truly opened their heart to Christ. Asking for forgiveness is the same as accepting your faults and with his help trying to correct them.

“Our Cause Isn't Lost”

Since: Jan 11

Blairsville, GA

#33 Dec 8, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
<quoted text>
GA-LAW-FF:
You seem to have a grasp of Grace. Perhaps you didn't go to the same church meetings that I have gone to. One message from the pulpit is this. When a Christian sins, he or she must ask for forgiveness every day. Perhaps this teaching comes from the uneducated.
My question is simply: Why does one need to ask for forgiveness over and over again? Put another way, is not trust in our Lord enough? Are sins present, past, and future forgiven?
When I put my trust in Christ for my salvation, ALL of my sins have been forgiven. Past present and future. I do not have to live in fear that when Christ comes or when I die, I might be ‘caught in the act’ of sinning in one form or another.
Many do see forgiveness as you view it. Nevertheless, I think we must agree to disagree upon this issue. Upon which I don’t believe will impact Salvation in many respects.

Nonetheless, there is significant agreement with the excellently stated view of ‘Just a thought’ speaking to the fiat, and/or caveat that one understands and approaches forgiveness within Gods Grace.

Over my lifetime, I have observed and experience friends with differing degrees of understanding relating to forgiveness. Some who mistakenly believe that once forgiven they sin no more and become perfect. Then those who, at one time, I had no doubt that if they had died as we spoke, they instantly would have seen the Glory of God. Unfortunately later the same individual(s) not only fell away of the Lord but cursed Him.

I have no personal revelation with regard to the issue of God’s Forgiveness. And for me, I know I am imperfect and sin more often than any child of God should. So for me, the relevance of need to ask more than once for forgiveness isn’t in question; I feel a constant desire to repent, and seek forgiveness.

For those that see it differently, I make no judgments. That is for God and God alone. And for the individual, a conclusion only they may make.

In short, I think that if we are given the freewill to accept or reject Salvation through Jesus Christ, we are also given the same freewill to change our minds.
Al A Baster

Macedonia, OH

#34 Dec 8, 2013
GA LAW, what is about the original good news that makes you to constantly have to repent and ask for forgiveness? What happens if you forgot to repent, ask for forgiveness, and died? Would you go to heaven?

I really understand. I was once that way, until I found out that Jesus is enough!

The message of the true gospel is deeply offensive to human nature. To understand this, we should first understand what the true gospel is.

Paul states his gospel most succinctly in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4: I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, by which also you are saved ... For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures.

This gospel is offensive to our human nature?

First, the gospel offends our pride. It tells us we need a savior, and that we cannot save ourselves. It gives no credit to us at all for our salvation; it is ALL the work of Jesus for us.

Second, the gospel offends our wisdom. It saves us by something many consider foolish – God becoming man and dying a humiliating, disgraceful death on our behalf.

Third, the gospel offends our knowledge. It tells us to believe something which goes against scientific knowledge and personal experience – that a dead man, Jesus Christ, rose from the dead in a glorious new body that would never die again.
Al A Baster

Macedonia, OH

#35 Dec 8, 2013
Just a thought wrote:
<quoted text>Christ died to free you from your sins but not to give you a free get out of jail card. By asking for forgiveness you are reconfirming your trust and belief in him and showing that you realize the sins you have committed and your willingness to try and correct them. Many will die believing that they are forgiven when in reality they have not truly opened their heart to Christ. Asking for forgiveness is the same as accepting your faults and with his help trying to correct them.
Yes, I have played that get out of jail card, too. But that's not what I'm talking about.

What intrest me is what you said: "Asking for forgiveness is the same as accepting your faults and with his help trying to correct them." What scripture tells us is this... We must live life by the Spirit: the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is NO LAW. Here is the whole text:

Scripture quoted by permission.(NIV Galatians 5)

16 So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. 17 For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law. 19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

“Our Cause Isn't Lost”

Since: Jan 11

Blairsville, GA

#36 Dec 8, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
GA LAW, what is about the original good news that makes you to constantly have to repent and ask for forgiveness? What happens if you forgot to repent, ask for forgiveness, and died? Would you go to heaven?...

The message of the true gospel is deeply offensive to human nature.

First, the gospel offends our pride. It tells us we need a savior, and that we cannot save ourselves. It gives no credit to us at all for our salvation; it is ALL the work of Jesus for us.
Second, the gospel offends our wisdom. It saves us by something many consider foolish – God becoming man and dying a humiliating, disgraceful death on our behalf.
Third, the gospel offends our knowledge. It tells us to believe something which goes against scientific knowledge and personal experience – that a dead man, Jesus Christ, rose from the dead in a glorious new body that would never die again.
Al A Baster wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, I have played that get out of jail card, too. But that's not what I'm talking about.
What intrest me is what you said: "Asking for forgiveness is the same as accepting your faults and with his help trying to correct them." What scripture tells us is this... We must live life by the Spirit: the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is NO LAW. Here is the whole text:
Scripture quoted by permission.(NIV Galatians 5)
16 So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. 17 For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law. 19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
You asked a question, and I offered my thoughts. I invite you to once again read my previously stated belief. I am as firm in by belief, as I am sure you must be in yours.

My concern is the issue, you appear to be trying to lecture, is more of a complex theological, and philosophical discussion, and quintessentially only serves to be enigmatic to those who may be lost and sincerely seeking to find the truth, a Faith in Jesus Christ, obtain Forgiveness, and Eternal Salvation.

Being of the Christian Faith I find your posting to be somewhat ambiguous, and have difficulty, myself, in concluding just what message you may actually be intending to advocate.

God’s Grace and the simplicity of our Faith, Forgiveness, and the gift of Salvation are too important to complicate.

Imagine the dilemma of a lost soul, or maybe a new believer immediately facing the complexities of scholarly discussions yet to have settled resolution, and/or in reality not having relevance to those of us who stand firm upon our Faith in Jesus Christ, and the Grace of God.

In closing, I feel, two verses you did not include in you responses are indeed relevant to what I am trying to say here.

Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.

Galatians 5:26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
Al A Baster

Macedonia, OH

#37 Dec 9, 2013
GA-LAW-FF wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
You asked a question, and I offered my thoughts. I invite you to once again read my previously stated belief. I am as firm in by belief, as I am sure you must be in yours.
My concern is the issue, you appear to be trying to lecture, is more of a complex theological, and philosophical discussion, and quintessentially only serves to be enigmatic to those who may be lost and sincerely seeking to find the truth, a Faith in Jesus Christ, obtain Forgiveness, and Eternal Salvation.
Being of the Christian Faith I find your posting to be somewhat ambiguous, and have difficulty, myself, in concluding just what message you may actually be intending to advocate.
God’s Grace and the simplicity of our Faith, Forgiveness, and the gift of Salvation are too important to complicate.
Imagine the dilemma of a lost soul, or maybe a new believer immediately facing the complexities of scholarly discussions yet to have settled resolution, and/or in reality not having relevance to those of us who stand firm upon our Faith in Jesus Christ, and the Grace of God.
In closing, I feel, two verses you did not include in you responses are indeed relevant to what I am trying to say here.
Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.
Galatians 5:26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
I not only imagine the delemma of a lost soul; I was a lost soul. I not only face the complexities of scholarly discussions; I have unsettled resolution. I guess I don't have it all together like all of those "who stand firm in Faith in Jesus Christ" and I won't bother you again with my "ambiguous message" and complexity. Whatever the hey that means! Good by, my friend.

“Our Cause Isn't Lost”

Since: Jan 11

Blairsville, GA

#38 Dec 10, 2013
Al A Baster wrote:
<quoted text>
I not only imagine the delemma of a lost soul; I was a lost soul. I not only face the complexities of scholarly discussions; I have unsettled resolution. I guess I don't have it all together like all of those "who stand firm in Faith in Jesus Christ" and I won't bother you again with my "ambiguous message" and complexity. Whatever the hey that means! Good by, my friend.
You have, it appears taken offense, when none was intended, only forthright discussion expressing my concerns and view.

My point is that a new believer needs time to mature (grow) in the Faith, before the complexities of the theological debates may be fully understood.

The intent wasn’t to suggest that we should stop seeking the knowledge and wisdom to comprehend the most intricate fundamentals of our Faith.
Al A Baster

Macedonia, OH

#39 Dec 10, 2013
GA-LAW-FF wrote:
<quoted text>
You have, it appears taken offense, when none was intended, only forthright discussion expressing my concerns and view.
My point is that a new believer needs time to mature (grow) in the Faith, before the complexities of the theological debates may be fully understood.
The intent wasn’t to suggest that we should stop seeking the knowledge and wisdom to comprehend the most intricate fundamentals of our Faith.
No offense taken.

The five fundamentals:

1. Sola scriptura:“Scripture alone”
2. Sola fide:“faith alone”
3. Sola gratia:“grace alone”
4. Solo Christo:“Christ alone”
5. Soli Deo gloria:“to the glory of God alone”

The five fundamrntals sum my simple faith.

You said, "a new believer needs time to mature (grow) in the Faith, before the complexities of the theological debates may be fully understood." Sounds to complex to me. If that were what my church taught, I would run for the nearest exit, never to return again.

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