City workers pay cuts

[Vote M Out]

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories...

As little as 3 months ago, didn't Lowery say publicly that they were in great financial shape? Now the workers get their salaries cut 3 percent. Which of the 9 council members gave him blank checks and a green light to spend the city into financial ruin? The elected officials that support this budget should be thrown out of office in the next election. It's very likely that the announced state audit will probably uncover many questionable spending tactics deployed by this bunch. What's next? The workers losing health care benefits and their pensions? Looks like it's time for a change to politics as usual out there. Vote the bums out!

[Please]

It sounds like Florissant is the only city cutting their employees wages. I wonder if Ferguson, Hazelwood, Berkley, Jennings, St. Louis county or any other city in north county are are cutting their employees salaries by 3%? I'm sure that these other cities are going through the same economic problems as Florissant. I guess things like Golf courses, Fountains, Fireworks displays,take home cars, body guards, parades and Valley of the Flowers weekend are more important than the employees and their families. After all these things are more important and necessary.Hope the people of Florissant enjoy them because the employees are paying for them with their salaries. This pay cut is shameful. Maybe the Mayor will tell another story about a councilmen being a cage fighter and we can all laugh. Why doesn't this councilmen fight for the people who make the city run day to day. The Mayor, City council and the Residents should support these city employees because with out them there is no city. Florissant has hit an all time low.

[other cities]

I have been told that most other cities and the county did not give many raises in this decade when florissant was getting raises every year. and that much of the water company sale money went to pay for salaries including raises and also avoided any employee cut backs. I was told that what happened this year was to roll back one 3% raise. they get to keep the other raises they got that many other cities did not get during this decade. they also get to keep the one time 3% non permanent bonus they got last year. not pleasant but better off than employees in many other cities during this downturn and cutbacks of employess has been mostly by attrition.

[Blue Flu]

Anyone else see a big out break of the Blue Flu?

[scared]

They are too scared to ever walk out. I worked with them and they are all afraid of their own shadows.

[MDH 303]

scared wrote:

They are too scared to ever walk out. I worked with them and they are all afraid of their own shadows.

B.S.!!
Scared? Who's scared? I don't see your name or DSN by your post.
The men and women of the FPD are anything but scared! Yes, there has always been intimidation, but one must remember; these folks have families and responsibilities. They cannot just throw it all away in hope of a better deal. If you truly were one of us, maybe you should support the current force, not defame them!
"walking out" as you put it, would only alienate them from the community, which appears to be supporting them in this issue.
I hate to see this and hope the administration finds another way.

[Appropree Eight]

Where's the damn audit? It's time for full disclosure of the runaway train of fiscal mismanagement! STOP THEM NOW! Hold these elected officials accountable for their actions! Don't sit on your rear ends in the next election cycle. They work for you dammit. How about reducing their salaries? What kind of concessions are they making? They are the highest paid elected officials in the whole damn county! Come on people WAKE THE HELL UP! What they are about to do to the employees is a total outrage and is totally unacceptable. Superfluous pork in the budget = employees giving back 3 percent of their wages back. And what for? To pay for some more wasteful crap that the city doesn't need or can't afford? How in the hell does this kind of regression do anything to stimulate the economy? What kind of message does that send to people in an area that the city has hopes of annexing? I'd vote no, wouldn't you?

[Pethead]

I was impressed to see all of our guys and gals in blue at the City Council meeting. I was very disappointed that Andrew Podleski couldn't get a second on discussing the budget.

The fact that no one asked to suspend the rules to have dialogue with the officers representative like they do with issues they want to discuss. One would believe the Mayor would be supportive of our police officers, since he spent so many years in the ranks of law enforcement. It looks like the Mayor has turned his back on the officers and the residents of Florissant in exchange of his own personal well being.

If the police officers get a pay cut, I hope they stay with the department. We have so many good officers that have helped me when my family and I needed them. Hopefully they'll stick around for what I can see as a new administration in 2011.

[water company]

without sale of water co there would not have been any raises or very small raises from 2000 to 2008 compared to most cities without a casino. so florissant employees are still way ahead because they get to keep all but one permanent raise. so it was a good decision to sell water co and it allowed city to continue to give raises for several years.

[nepotism]

One correction Pethead. The mayor didnt turn his back on all the cops. He made damned sure his boy got his Major promotion right before the budget was announed. Sonny will stay around. You should see all the lawyer fees from the city lawyer Hessel you paid for, to find the loopholes the mayor finagled and laws he ignored. You paid for it again and again and again. Lowerys and Hessels employers are making out like fat cats.

[Mark]

I am sure there are many of us today who made decisions one or two years ago, that purchased a new home, boat, motorcycle, took an expensive trip, did major work on their home, lent money to a friend/family, eat out three or four nights a week, and in general spent money needlessly in comparison to today’s economical times. This of course is 20/20 hindsight. I/we have all made spending decisions that I/we TODAY regret or wish “to undo”, but cannot. I know there are a lot of things I would have done differently in 2007, knowing what I know now. Apparently my “crystal ball” was on the fritz, like many others, a few years ago.
Wrong or bad decisions from a few years ago do not solve our shortage of income problems today. Monies spent in history are gone. City leaders and our selves “the general public” must learn from our mistakes. This education is valuable to city leaders and our selves, starting today and for the future.
There are only a few possibilities as to how to manage the budget shortfall immediately. Cutting a percentage from salaries is one way, or eliminating jobs such as all other institutions/businesses are doing. Pfizer as an example just cut 600 jobs in St. Louis and other municipalities are also cutting jobs/services. Another means of immediate cutting COST pertains to community services. Cutting services affects a lot, and it touches many residents. Regardless of who the elected officials are, one thing is for sure, elected officials prefer to take the path of least resistance, that should not seem strange to voters.
Another thing we as residents/voters need to realize, is that there are very few if any elected officials equipped or knowledgeable of how to make cuts. Very few leaders have the experience of having to make cuts. As you know, cuts/reductions are very unpopular and until recently has never had to happen to this magnitude.
What I think needs to happen, is that the city needs to acknowledge what they have learnt and how they are going to apply this knowledge for the benefit of us citizens in the future. I am not only interested in next year’s budget but as well as future budgets and reserves. How do we take this unwanted experience and grow, how are we going to become a better community because of this negative experience, and what do we have to look forward to with everyone working together. Mark

[florissant1]

other cities wrote:

when florissant was getting raises every year.

WRONG Florissant was NOT getting raises every year.

[William L]

Mark wrote:

How do we take this unwanted experience and grow, how are we going to become a better community because of this negative experience, and what do we have to look forward to with everyone working together. Mark

Answer: By seeing to it that there are many new faces on the dais starting sooner than later. Everyone, as you say, will need to "work together" to make that happen. Those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

[Pethead]

Mark, the City wasn't having a budget crisis this year when they accepted the responsibilities and expenses involved in taking receivership of the Behlmann-Zykan Nature Lodge At Sunset Park? That was an expense the City doesn't need. It reminds me of the time Oprah Winfrey gave 1000 Pontiacs to audience members who needed cars but couldn't afford them. Then reality set in and the majority of the audience couldn't afford the tax and licenses.

I understand and realize you say your crystal ball was on the fritz. But what about the Wizard of Lies or someone from his administration should have had some foresight in building a structure last year that was understood was to become City property, since it was built on City owned property. No one knew the economic climate when the plans were drawn up? If you think this economy just went bad in 2009, you're listening to the Mayor too much. The economy has been in a recession since early 2007. That was the same year the Mayor was bragging about how financially stable the City was because of himself.

Now we see the Mayor digging in between the sofa cushions at City Hell scrounging around for loose change. And all he can come up with is cutting salaries. "I think $400 is too much to charge for rent at the Nature Lodge, I think it should be more like $200."
That was a quote from the Mayor when Mr. Lee was announcing rental rates at the new Lodge. Doesn't the Mayor get it yet? No one will love him more by having the lowest rental prices on all of our facilities?

I mentioned to the Mayor that I thought disposing of the golf course would reduce spending and bring in the initial revenue. But in his words he said, "it'll never happen."

Where is this mayor and administration's priorities?

[water company]

florissant1 wrote:

<quoted text>WRONG Florissant was NOT getting raises every year.

all but one in last 10 and all but 2 in last 20 I heard.

[Anon Employee]

For clarification, we only received raises three years since 2001.

other cities wrote:

I have been told that most other cities and the county did not give many raises in this decade when florissant was getting raises every year. and that much of the water company sale money went to pay for salaries including raises and also avoided any employee cut backs. I was told that what happened this year was to roll back one 3% raise. they get to keep the other raises they got that many other cities did not get during this decade. they also get to keep the one time 3% non permanent bonus they got last year. not pleasant but better off than employees in many other cities during this downturn and cutbacks of employess has been mostly by attrition.

[Anon Employee]

We are not too scared, but are too professional to walk out.

Blue Flu wrote:

Anyone else see a big out break of the Blue Flu?

[Soothsayers]

Mark >> Apparently my “crystal ball” was on the fritz, like many others, a few years ago.<<

You got that right! A lot of other people were long ago were pointing out the numerous cases of discretionary spending by Mayor Lowery that were fiscally irresponsible.
The big issue during the 2007 Mayoral election was the irresponsible spending at City Hall by the Mayor with the approval of the council during his 2003-2007 term.
Over 3000 voters saw the problem!
Crystal Ball? Or was it blinders?
There must be a lot of soothsayers in this town!

Mark >> Wrong or bad decisions from a few years ago do not solve our shortage of income problems today.<<

No, they certainly do not. But not making so many bad decisions in the first place sure would have prevented many of the problems.

Mark >> Monies spent in history are gone.<<

And how long did it take you to deduce that gem of wisdom?

Mark >> City leaders and our selves “the general public” must learn from our mistakes. This education is valuable to city leaders and our selves, starting today and for the future.<<

Oh yes, learning from mistakes is valuable education. But from what I can see, the lessons didn't seem to sink in. The "wrong or bad decisions" continue in the present.

Mark >> There are only a few possibilities as to how to manage the budget shortfall immediately. Cutting a percentage from salaries is one way, or eliminating jobs such as all other institutions/businesses are doing.<<

Wouldn't a prudent manager carefully analyze all of the expenditures and classify them and then make adjustments based on the "need" of specific expenditures? I haven't seen much of that. Many excellent suggestions were brought up by many "general public" and the budget just keeps getting slammed through as if the people running the show have it ALL figured out. These are the same people that ran the car into the ditch telling us, "Shut up, we can drive this thing out of the ditch!"

Mark >> Another thing we as residents/voters need to realize, is that there are very few if any elected officials equipped or knowledgeable of how to make cuts. Very few leaders have the experience of having to make cuts.<<

Very few leaders know how to make cuts? Obviously. But I suspect the ones who are not good at controlling a budget and managing the day-to-day fiscal responsibilities in the first place are even worse at making cuts. Yet, that is who is deciding what cuts will be made.
That is why we don't see any real effort to cut things like the "perks" of the higher ups.
When all of the REAL FAT gets cut from the budget first, the hard choices like salary decreases are much more acceptable.

Mark >> I am not only interested in next year’s budget but as well as future budgets and reserves.<<

Hmmmm...NOW suddenly this is apparent? This is exactly what all of the soothsayers (naysayers in Bob-speak) were talking about before the last election! This should have been a concern all along but it wasn't.

Mark >> How do we take this unwanted experience and grow, how are we going to become a better community because of this negative experience, and what do we have to look forward to with everyone working together.<<

Working together? I don't see any "working together". I see the mayor doing things "his way" as usual and the council doing their usual hand sitting.

[have faith]

Blue Flu wrote:

Anyone else see a big out break of the Blue Flu?

I have faith that the good police and employees of our city will do the right thing. Several peopel where I work lost their jobs with layoffs. I would have gladly given up 3% if it would have meant my friends keeping thier jobs and feeding their families.

If there is a "blue flu", I will be sad and disapointed in what I have always though were a fine and outstanding group of employees.

[not so]

florissant1 wrote:

<quoted text>WRONG Florissant was NOT getting raises every year.

Where are you getting your facts? Florissant employees got a 3$ bonus last year, the Police got a 4% raise and others a 3% raise the year before. 4% in 2007 (OK...0% in 2006) 2% 2005, 3% 2004, 4%2003, 4% 2002, 4% 2001, 3% 2000. Shall I go on? If you go back to 1977, there is only 2 years that we did not get a raise. 1992 and 2006.
And in addition, we got a step raise each of these years. I am happy to have a job, and glad they did not have to lay off anyone.
PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU SPEAK.