10 Pro-Gun Myths, Shot Down

10 Pro-Gun Myths, Shot Down

Posted in the Bellefontaine Forum

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Since: Oct 10

Lucas, OH

#1 Jan 31, 2013

Since: Oct 10

Lucas, OH

#2 Jan 31, 2013
The teatards won't touch this with a 10 foot pole

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#3 Jan 31, 2013
I love myth 1!!!!!

Myth #1: They're coming for your guns.
Fact-check: No one knows the exact number of guns in America, but it's clear there's no practical way to round them all up (never mind that no one in Washington is proposing this). Yet if you fantasize about rifle-toting citizens facing down the government, you'll rest easy knowing that America's roughly 80 million gun owners already have the feds and cops outgunned by a factor of around 79 to 1.

No one knows the exact number of guns but they know feds and cops are outgunned by a factor of 79-1. How do they know that if they don't know the number of guns in America?

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#4 Jan 31, 2013
Myth #2: Guns don't kill people—people kill people.
Fact-check: People with more guns tend to kill more people—with guns. The states with the highest gun ownership rates have a gun murder rate 114% higher than those with the lowest gun ownership rates. Also, gun death rates tend to be higher in states with higher rates of gun ownership.

HAHA. If you look at the chart it shows Wyoming and Montana at the top like the most murders happen in those two states because there is lots of guns in that state

Wyoming actually had 11 homicides and Montana had 30. It's a disproportion number because the population is low, but so is the homicide rate!(compared to California with 2392 Homicides and Texas with 1364)

This website if hilarious!!!!!

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#5 Jan 31, 2013
Myth #3: An armed society is a polite society.
Fact-check: Drivers who carry guns are 44% more likely than unarmed drivers to make obscene gestures at other motorists, and 77% more likely to follow them aggressively.
• Among Texans convicted of serious crimes, those with concealed-handgun licenses were sentenced for threatening someone with a firearm 4.8 times more than those without.
• In states with Stand Your Ground and other laws making it easier to shoot in self-defense, those policies have been linked to a 7 to 10% increase in homicides.

Source please?

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#6 Jan 31, 2013
Myth #4: More good guys with guns can stop rampaging bad guys.
Fact-check: Mass shootings stopped by armed civilians in the past 30 years: 0
• Chances that a shooting at an ER involves guns taken from guards: 1 in 5

There are a couple of major problems here with arguing that armed civilians don't stop mass shootings. One is that when armed civilians are present, they often stop mass shootings before they can become mass shootings.

But here are a couple.

– Mayan Palace Theater, San Antonio, Texas, this week: Jesus Manuel Garcia shoots at a movie theater, a police car and bystanders from the nearby China Garden restaurant; as he enters the movie theater, guns blazing, an armed off-duty cop shoots Garcia four times, stopping the attack. Total dead: Zero.

– Winnemucca, Nev., 2008: Ernesto Villagomez opens fire in a crowded restaurant; concealed carry permit-holder shoots him dead. Total dead: Two.(I’m excluding the shooters’ deaths in these examples.)

– Appalachian School of Law, 2002: Crazed immigrant shoots the dean and a professor, then begins shooting students; as he goes for more ammunition, two armed students point their guns at him, allowing a third to tackle him. Total dead: Three.

– Santee, Calif., 2001: Student begins shooting his classmates — as well as the “trained campus supervisor”; an off-duty cop who happened to be bringing his daughter to school that day points his gun at the shooter, holding him until more police arrive. Total dead: Two.

– Pearl High School, Mississippi, 1997: After shooting several people at his high school, student heads for the junior high school; assistant principal Joel Myrick retrieves a .45 pistol from his car and points it at the gunman’s head, ending the murder spree. Total dead: Two.

– Edinboro, Pa., 1998: A student shoots up a junior high school dance being held at a restaurant; restaurant owner pulls out his shotgun and stops the gunman. Total dead: One.

Since: Oct 10

Lucas, OH

#7 Jan 31, 2013
The Higher Primate wrote:
Myth #3: An armed society is a polite society.
Fact-check: Drivers who carry guns are 44% more likely than unarmed drivers to make obscene gestures at other motorists, and 77% more likely to follow them aggressively.
• Among Texans convicted of serious crimes, those with concealed-handgun licenses were sentenced for threatening someone with a firearm 4.8 times more than those without.
• In states with Stand Your Ground and other laws making it easier to shoot in self-defense, those policies have been linked to a 7 to 10% increase in homicides.
Source please?
Hey irrational gun nut, the sources are on the webpage..hope you don't shoot your toe off

“You can feel it in your guts ”

Since: May 09

Trump is completely NUTS!

#8 Jan 31, 2013
The Higher Primate wrote:
I love myth 1!!!!!
Myth #1: They're coming for your guns.
Fact-check: No one knows the exact number of guns in America, but it's clear there's no practical way to round them all up (never mind that no one in Washington is proposing this). Yet if you fantasize about rifle-toting citizens facing down the government, you'll rest easy knowing that America's roughly 80 million gun owners already have the feds and cops outgunned by a factor of around 79 to 1.
No one knows the exact number of guns but they know feds and cops are outgunned by a factor of 79-1. How do they know that if they don't know the number of guns in America?
It's fairly easy to now the number of gun-owners (not guns) if the gun-owners are registered. Also surveys. Nothing mysterious about that.

“You can feel it in your guts ”

Since: May 09

Trump is completely NUTS!

#9 Jan 31, 2013
[QUOTE who------– Mayan Palace Theater, San Antonio, Texas, this week: Jesus Manuel Garcia shoots at a movie theater, a police car and bystanders from the nearby China Garden restaurant; as he enters the movie theater, guns blazing, an armed off-duty cop shoots Garcia four times, stopping the attack. Total dead: Zero.
– Winnemucca, Nev., 2008: Ernesto Villagomez opens fire in a crowded restaurant; concealed carry permit-holder shoots him dead. Total dead: Two.(I’m excluding the shooters’ deaths in these examples.)
– Appalachian School of Law, 2002: Crazed immigrant shoots the dean and a professor, then begins shooting students; as he goes for more ammunition, two armed students point their guns at him, allowing a third to tackle him. Total dead: Three.
– Santee, Calif., 2001: Student begins shooting his classmates — as well as the “trained campus supervisor”; an off-duty cop who happened to be bringing his daughter to school that day points his gun at the shooter, holding him until more police arrive. Total dead: Two.
– Pearl High School, Mississippi, 1997: After shooting several people at his high school, student heads for the junior high school; assistant principal Joel Myrick retrieves a .45 pistol from his car and points it at the gunman’s head, ending the murder spree. Total dead: Two.
– Edinboro, Pa., 1998: A student shoots up a junior high school dance being held at a restaurant; restaurant owner pulls out his shotgun and stops the gunman. Total dead: One.
[/QUOTE]

I noticed most of the examples you gave of people who stopped a mass shooter were either off duty cops are someone affiliated in law enforcement. They might have been successful but many aren't. One case that comes to my mind is when a brave armed citizen attempted to stop an mass shooter wearing a protective vest in a Tyler, Texas, in a parking lot back in 2005. He drew fire from the shooter which unfortunately killed the armed citizen!

If you really believe that more armed citizens will be a cure, perhaps you haven't considered all the problems that this will create making things actually worse---because it opens up a Pandora's Box of new scenarios.

If we think a society filled with armed citizens who picture themselves as wanna-be heroes, we'll end up with people shooting the wrong person because they won't know the bad person from all the good guys who are also trying to stop the bad guy. Instead, there will be bullets flying all over and innocent people will STILL be killed.

There were several gun carrying people in that Aurora Theater mass killing, but it turned out that most of the were scared out of their wits and fleeing for their own lives. Besides that, they were too many rows back to risk taking a shot at the shooter without hitting innocent people. Not everyone is a James Bond or the Rifle Man who can run, do flips and slide across the floor and then get a killing shot in! A woman with a .22 micro revolver in her purse isn't about to run up to a mass shooter welding an AR-15. Just what kind of weapons do people have to carry around not to be out-gunned by a crazy shooter carrying a AK-47 and wearing a Kevlar vest!!
Sweet Baby Jesus

Zanesville, OH

#10 Feb 1, 2013
Hummingbird 4 Real wrote:
<quoted text>It's fairly easy to now the number of gun-owners (not guns) if the gun-owners are registered. Also surveys. Nothing mysterious about that.
If its not so mysterious then why does the article say there is no way to know the exact amount of guns in America? How many gun owners or gun are in Ohio?

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#11 Feb 1, 2013
Myth #5: Keeping a gun at home makes you safer.
Fact-check: Owning a gun has been linked to higher risks of homicide, suicide, and accidental death by gun.
• For every time a gun is used in self-defense in the home, there are 7 assaults or murders, 11 suicide attempts, and 4 accidents involving guns in or around a home.

Did a little googling on this one. While these facts are true Motherjones forgot to add in the factors "linked" to higher risk. These numbers are only true when alcohol is involved or when there is a history of domestic abuse.

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM1993...

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#12 Feb 1, 2013
Myth #6: Carrying a gun for self-defense makes you safer.
Fact-check: In 2011, nearly 10 times more people were shot and killed in arguments than by civilians trying to stop a crime.
• In one survey, nearly 1% of Americans reported using guns to defend themselves or their property. However, a closer look at their claims found that more than 50% involved using guns in an aggressive manner, such as escalating an argument.
• A Philadelphia study found that the odds of an assault victim being shot were 4.5 times greater if he carried a gun. His odds of being killed were 4.2 times greater.

This fact is BULLSHIT because not everyone carrying a gun has a license to do so. People who have been trained to carry a firearm only use their gun when their life is in danger, not an argument. This statistic is all people carrying a firearm licensed or not.

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#13 Feb 1, 2013
Myth #7: Guns make women safer.
Fact-check: In 2010, nearly 6 times more women were shot by husbands, boyfriends, and ex-partners than murdered by male strangers.
• A woman's chances of being killed by her abuser increase more than 7 times if he has access to a gun.
• One study found that women in states with higher gun ownership rates were 4.9 times more likely to be murdered by a gun that women in states with lower gun ownership rates.

This is a domestic violence issued not a gun issue, not even sure why it's a gun myth.

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#14 Feb 1, 2013
Myth #8: "Vicious, violent video games" deserve more blame than guns.
Fact-check: So said NRA executive vice president Wayne LaPierre after Newtown. So what's up with Japan?

I don't agree with this stat. Video games play no part in gun violence.

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#15 Feb 1, 2013
Myth #9: More and more Americans are becoming gun owners.
Fact-check: More guns are being sold, but they're owned by a shrinking portion of the population.
• About 50% of Americans said they had a gun in their homes in 1973. Today, about 45% say they do. Overall, 35% of Americans personally own a gun.
• Around 80% of gun owners are men. On average they own 7.9 guns each.

Hmmmm. Someone twisted numbers again.

In the 1973 survey, 55 percent of Republicans and 45&#8201;percent of Democrats had a gun at home.

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2012-12-19...

But in America, people who snap are a hell of a lot more likely to have a gun close by. The rate of gun ownership in the United States is 89 per every 100 people.

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2012-12-19...

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#16 Feb 1, 2013
Myth #10: We don't need more gun laws—we just need to enforce the ones we have.
Fact-check: Weak laws and loopholes backed by the gun lobby make it easier to get guns illegally.
• Around 40% of all legal gun sales involve private sellers and don't require background checks. 40% of prison inmates who used guns in their crimes got them this way.
• An investigation found 62% of online gun sellers were willing to sell to buyers who said they couldn't pass a background check.
• 20% of licensed California gun dealers agreed to sell handguns to researchers posing as illegal "straw" buyers.
• The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives has not had a permanent director for 6 years, due to an NRA-backed requirement that the Senate approve nominees.

The 40% of private sales number has already been debunked.

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#17 Feb 1, 2013
Awoo wrote:
The teatards won't touch this with a 10 foot pole
I'm not a teatard or a libtard but I touched it. Now what?

Since: Oct 10

Haines City, FL

#18 Feb 1, 2013
Hummingbird 4 Real wrote:
<quoted text>
I noticed most of the examples you gave of people who stopped a mass shooter were either off duty cops are someone affiliated in law enforcement. They might have been successful but many aren't. One case that comes to my mind is when a brave armed citizen attempted to stop an mass shooter wearing a protective vest in a Tyler, Texas, in a parking lot back in 2005. He drew fire from the shooter which unfortunately killed the armed citizen!
If you really believe that more armed citizens will be a cure, perhaps you haven't considered all the problems that this will create making things actually worse---because it opens up a Pandora's Box of new scenarios.
If we think a society filled with armed citizens who picture themselves as wanna-be heroes, we'll end up with people shooting the wrong person because they won't know the bad person from all the good guys who are also trying to stop the bad guy. Instead, there will be bullets flying all over and innocent people will STILL be killed.
There were several gun carrying people in that Aurora Theater mass killing, but it turned out that most of the were scared out of their wits and fleeing for their own lives. Besides that, they were too many rows back to risk taking a shot at the shooter without hitting innocent people. Not everyone is a James Bond or the Rifle Man who can run, do flips and slide across the floor and then get a killing shot in! A woman with a .22 micro revolver in her purse isn't about to run up to a mass shooter welding an AR-15. Just what kind of weapons do people have to carry around not to be out-gunned by a crazy shooter carrying a AK-47 and wearing a Kevlar vest!!
There is no information on the web which indicates there was anyone in the audience or Aurora theatre had guns. Matter of fact the theatre was a gun free zone. Also, even if someone is wearing a kevlar vest, a bullet will temporarily stun them, perhaps stopping them from shooting. You have a vivid imagination but you knowledge of guns and engaging is very limited indeed...and everything you have suggested so far is not evidenced based, its all opinion based and frankly, based on what your knowldge base of guns seems to be that opinion is not very well founded.
Sweet Baby Jesus

Zanesville, OH

#19 Feb 2, 2013
Hummingbird 4 Real wrote:
There were several gun carrying people in that Aurora Theater mass killing, but it turned out that most of the were scared out of their wits and fleeing for their own lives.
What? Seriously? Armed people in that theater? Do you get your information from the voices in your head or what?

Ever your friends on the left will call you a liar on this one.

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#20 Feb 4, 2013
Hummingbird 4 Real wrote:
One case that comes to my mind is when a brave armed citizen attempted to stop an mass shooter wearing a protective vest in a Tyler, Texas, in a parking lot back in 2005. He drew fire from the shooter which unfortunately killed the armed citizen!
Mark Wilson has been widely credited as heroic for his selfless actions, which are believed to have caused Arroyo to cease his attack and flee the area without murdering his son.

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