Since: May 10

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#789 Jul 29, 2014
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Show me the Bible in the Bible.
Is the Bible the Word of God or not?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#790 Jul 29, 2014
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Show me the Bible in the Bible.
infidel writers—e.g., Celsus (mid-second century) and Porphyry (early fourth century)—quoted profusely from the Scriptures in their vain attempts to discredit Christianity. How did they come to have access to the sacred writings if these documents were so scarce and so expensive in those days, as to be beyond the grasp of almost everyone?

Since: Sep 13

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#791 Jul 29, 2014
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>Is the Bible the Word of God or not?
It is not the only Word of God but it is the inerrant written Word of God and was created in the late 4th Century by the Church.

Your book is missing 7 books of the OT that the Church included in the Bible in the late 4th Century.

Are you a Lutheran. You accept his personal decision to throw those 7 books out . He wrote his own Bible , but his buddies realized what a nut job he was and he let go of that project.

Since: Sep 13

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#792 Jul 29, 2014
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>infidel writers—e.g., Celsus (mid-second century) and Porphyry (early fourth century)—quoted profusely from the Scriptures in their vain attempts to discredit Christianity. How did they come to have access to the sacred writings if these documents were so scarce and so expensive in those days, as to be beyond the grasp of almost everyone?
Please give me the source where Celsus had access to scriptures. He probably learned like the rest by oral teaching, Tradition.

No UPS or FedEx copy stores back then.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#793 Aug 2, 2014
HEATH - 72 wrote:
<quoted text>
The Vatican is a house of cards that God will bring down on that great Day.
You've been warned.
www.roysecitycoc.org
Heath, isn't the real issue that there is only one LORD, faith and baptism? One who came from heaven to show and tell us the truth that God desires all men to repent and do the will of God? And this is in accord with the promises and covenant God made with Abraham?

Since this is true, and we know Jesus is the faithful witness of God, the One through whom all nations would be blessed, just as God covenanted with Abraham and his descendants -

Did Paul actually nullify the true eternal covenant of God in his accounts of the promise of God to Abraham by faith, thereby twisting the actual eternal covenant of God to manufacture a 'new' covenant that is in opposition to the eternal covenant? "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

Take a moment and study this. I think you may find it extremely interesting:

http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/component/conte...

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#794 Aug 4, 2014
Barnsweb wrote:
<quoted text>
Heath, isn't the real issue that there is only one LORD, faith and baptism? One who came from heaven to show and tell us the truth that God desires all men to repent and do the will of God? And this is in accord with the promises and covenant God made with Abraham?
Since this is true, and we know Jesus is the faithful witness of God, the One through whom all nations would be blessed, just as God covenanted with Abraham and his descendants -
Did Paul actually nullify the true eternal covenant of God in his accounts of the promise of God to Abraham by faith, thereby twisting the actual eternal covenant of God to manufacture a 'new' covenant that is in opposition to the eternal covenant? "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."
Take a moment and study this. I think you may find it extremely interesting:
http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/component/conte...
You really have a hard time understanding Paul don't you. Peter, our first Pope, said you would.

Since: May 10

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#795 Aug 4, 2014
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
It is not the only Word of God but it is the inerrant written Word of God and was created in the late 4th Century by the Church.
Your book is missing 7 books of the OT that the Church included in the Bible in the late 4th Century.
Are you a Lutheran. You accept his personal decision to throw those 7 books out . He wrote his own Bible , but his buddies realized what a nut job he was and he let go of that project.
created???? by whom do you claim creation of the word of God?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#796 Aug 4, 2014
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
You really have a hard time understanding Paul don't you. Peter, our first Pope, said you would.
Show where it says Peter was the Pope.:)

Since: Sep 13

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#797 Aug 4, 2014
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>Show where it says Peter was the Pope.:)
The verse after it said the Bible was coming to be the sole rule of faith and right before it said it said once saved always saved.

But he did change Simon's name to Rock and built his Church on him. Gave him the keys to the kingdom.

My book said he said gave all authority to some men and none to a book.

Since: Sep 13

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#798 Aug 4, 2014
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>created???? by whom do you claim creation of the word of God?
That book you bought at he bookstore is a knock off of the one created about AD 390 by the Church led by the HS. It did not exist before then.

For about 6 or 7 books that made it, there were a lot of 'horse trading" at the council. If you vote for the Shepherd of Hermas and the Didache, I will let you have 2nd Peter and Philemon.

The Church existed 350 years before the Bible and at least 10-15 years before any words that eventually made the bible was written and about 60 years before the last words that was considered worthy to be in the Bible.

The Church decided what books were the written words of Gods.

Why is Mark and Luke in the Bible and not the Gospel of Thomas. Thomas was an Apostle and Mark and Luke was successors.

Oops. You protesters don't believe in apostolic succession. Better throw those books out .

Since: Jan 10

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#799 Aug 4, 2014
Are those who answer the Catholic 800 number infallible?

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#800 Aug 4, 2014
HEATH - 72 wrote:
Are those who answer the Catholic 800 number infallible?
Just need this.

www.vatican.va/archive/ccc/

Please reference any person before 1700 who believed like you.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#801 Aug 4, 2014
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
You really have a hard time understanding Paul don't you. Peter, our first Pope, said you would.
Mike, if this were true you would be able to show me ample quotes from what Peter wrote. There is no doubt Paul is not who he claimed to be - the evidence is overwhelming. Why should I trouble myself with understanding Paul if I can understand Jesus? Who is the greater authority? Whose words must I keep? According to Jesus, it isn't Paul;-)

I understand Paul more than you ever will. I can because I understand what Jesus taught. You don't understand Jesus and cannot hear Him in all things, which is why you lean upon Paul.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#802 Aug 4, 2014
II Peter just proves Paul was not inspired in his writings and that he was also hard to understand. Paul, being the expert in false circular reasoning and nullification of the eternal covenant of God, was one confused and greedy puppy...who was either VERY ignorant of the Scripture or very evil.
Jimmy Crack Corn

Fremont, CA

#803 Aug 4, 2014
The truth hurts. To study history is to cease being Catholic. Read'em and weep.
By the middle of the 4th century, tension began growing between the bishop of Rome and the eastern bishops. A council was called at Sardica (342 A.D.) to try to bring some harmony to the church, but the eastern bishops all abandoned the council, and the western bishops who were left decreed that bishops who had a cause could appeal to the bishop of Rome. About the same time, Athanasius records a letter from Julius I (337-352), bishop of Rome, who asserted that the church at Rome should have been the decider of an issue involving the church at Antioch (Apologia Contra Arianos, Ch. 2, Sect. 35). Thereafter, the bishops of Rome became ever more assertive about their right to have authority over other bishops. Innocent I, the bishop at Rome from 401-417 A.D., argued strongly for the authority of Rome over the other western bishops, though he did not claim any authority over the eastern bishops. He also apparently was ignorant of history as he stated that all Christians in Gaul (modern day France) were due to the apostle Peter and his successors. In fact, the mission to the Gauls was established not by the church at Rome but by the church at Smyrna, when the great Polycarp sent his disciple, Pothinus, to establish a mission to the Gauls. Polycarp was personally trained by the apostle John, not Peter. Ireneus, also a disciple of Polycarp, not Peter, following the martyrdom of the aged Pothinus, became the great bishop at Lyons, France, and aided Rome in fighting off heresy in the Roman church.
It fell to Leo I, the bishop at Rome from 440-461 A.D., to make the first serious claim to the primacy of Rome over all the bishops and to being head over all the churches of the whole world. Of course, his claim did not make it so, as the authority of the bishop of Rome did not extend into the eastern regions of the Roman Empire, nor into Persia, other parts of Asia, or eastern Africa until more modern times. Only in the west did the bishop of Rome begin to exercise more and more control over the bishops of western Europe and western Africa.
As our Orthodox friends will be quick to tell us, the bishop of Rome never held any control over the Eastern Church. The 300,000,000 individuals who follow the Orthodox faith all trace their church back to the apostles themselves and hold to the great church councils, especially to the seven early ecumenical councils beginning with Nicea. At the great councils of the church, there was no hierarchy of control. Rome was always a minority voice in these great church councils. Each bishop from each church held one vote. And not one of these great church councils was held in the West. Although the Roman Church later held church councils, the Orthodox do not accept these councils’ legitimacy as they failed to include bishops from the whole church.
Our Coptic friends also will assert what the Orthodox assert: that their church, which stems from the church at Alexandria, Egypt, was never under the authority of Rome. And the same is true of the Nestorian church; that is, the church of the East outside the confines of the old Roman Empire. Our Armenian brothers and sisters would want us to know that their church also has never been subject to Rome. We do not want to leave out the Ethiopic church, which has never been controlled by Rome. The ancient Thomasan church in southern India was not under the control of Rome, either, until Portuguese explorers arrived in 1498. There are other smaller ancient churches as well that never have held any allegiance to Rome.
Jimmy Crack Corn

Fremont, CA

#804 Aug 4, 2014
CATHOLIC LETS TRY SOME TRUTH.With this backdrop, I return to address the claim that the Roman Catholic Church gave us the Bible.
First, the claim cannot mean that the Roman Catholic Church wrote the Bible. The Roman Catholic Church did not even exist when the Bible was written. The Old Testament was written before the time of Christ and long before the Roman Catholic Church. The New Testament was completely written within 70 years of the death of Christ. Even liberal scholars who challenge the authorship of the books will not date any of the New Testament after around 150 A.D. The early dating for the writings in the New Testament is compelling. For instance, Clement of Rome writes in 97 A.D. to the church at Corinth, Ignatius writes in 107 A.D., Polycarp writes shortly thereafter, and an unnamed disciple writes around 100-130 A.D. Between them, these authors show knowledge of all the books of the New Testament, except 2 John and 3 John and perhaps 2 Peter (some would say that Clement’s allusion to 2 Peter is rather a precursor to 2 Peter). None of the New Testament Scriptures were written by the church at Rome. Even Paul, when he wrote from Rome, did not write from the Roman church, but rather he wrote as an apostle, either by himself or with a couple of other individuals. The Bible was not written by the Roman Catholic Church.

Since: Jul 14

Location hidden

#805 Aug 5, 2014
Jimmy Crack Corn speaks the truth. Good message

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#806 Aug 5, 2014
Jimmy Crack Corn wrote:
CATHOLIC LETS TRY SOME TRUTH.With this backdrop, I return to address the claim that the Roman Catholic Church gave us the Bible.
First, the claim cannot mean that the Roman Catholic Church wrote the Bible. The Roman Catholic Church did not even exist when the Bible was written. The Old Testament was written before the time of Christ and long before the Roman Catholic Church. The New Testament was completely written within 70 years of the death of Christ. Even liberal scholars who challenge the authorship of the books will not date any of the New Testament after around 150 A.D. The early dating for the writings in the New Testament is compelling. For instance, Clement of Rome writes in 97 A.D. to the church at Corinth, Ignatius writes in 107 A.D., Polycarp writes shortly thereafter, and an unnamed disciple writes around 100-130 A.D. Between them, these authors show knowledge of all the books of the New Testament, except 2 John and 3 John and perhaps 2 Peter (some would say that Clement’s allusion to 2 Peter is rather a precursor to 2 Peter). None of the New Testament Scriptures were written by the church at Rome. Even Paul, when he wrote from Rome, did not write from the Roman church, but rather he wrote as an apostle, either by himself or with a couple of other individuals. The Bible was not written by the Roman Catholic Church.
You don't find it strange you are proving your point by quoting Catholics. Bizarre. Do you realize that not 1 Protestant contributed 1 thing to the Bible except to trash 7 books

St Clement's letter to the Corinthians had strong support from some Church leaders to make the Bible.

Sure the Bible was written by the CC. Jesus started 1 Church. He specifically said he would build it on Peter. All writers that wrote things that eventually made the Canon in AD 392 belonged to that Church.

There were hundreds of scriptures being circulated in the Churches. None of the Churches had all of the scriptures that made the Bible. Some had none. Some only had the ones that did not make the Bible

There was only the Catholic Church for 1500 years. Finish the logic.

Who wrote Mark and why is Mark and Luke in the Bible?

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#807 Aug 5, 2014
Barnsweb wrote:
<quoted text>
Mike, if this were true you would be able to show me ample quotes from what Peter wrote. There is no doubt Paul is not who he claimed to be - the evidence is overwhelming. Why should I trouble myself with understanding Paul if I can understand Jesus? Who is the greater authority? Whose words must I keep? According to Jesus, it isn't Paul;-)
I understand Paul more than you ever will. I can because I understand what Jesus taught. You don't understand Jesus and cannot hear Him in all things, which is why you lean upon Paul.
Peter predicted people like you.

Jesus said he created a Church. Do you belong to that one?
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#808 Aug 5, 2014
Mike, are you yet so dull of hearing?

Did Jesus not also say these things?

http://www.onediscipletoanother.org

Does the RCC abide in His word indeed? Completely?

John 14:23,24; "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words, and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father's who sent Me."

John 8: 31,32; "If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."

The Testimony Of Jesus Christ

John 7:16,17; "My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me. If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority."

In this teaching Jesus equates the personal testimony of His truth from God (the gospel of the kingdom) is to be found in our will to do what He said. The mercy of God is evident because it is found in our will to obey, rather than in absolute perfection to do it all. We need to be humble and honest with ourselves and God. As we look into the things of the Lord, to see ourselves through His teachings, that we notice our needs and confess our shortfalls of abiding in whatever He said, so that, as I John 1:9 says, if we confess our sin, God is faithful to forgive. By abiding in the words of Jesus we find both the personal testimony of knowing the gospel of the kingdom of God, and the process of maturing in Christ, that we might "have the mind of Christ" in us, and thereby we also become the light and salt in the world that the Lord said we should be.

John 14:23,24; "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me."

True doctrine is to observe all of the teachings and commandments of Jesus Christ.


Matthew 4:4; 'It is written, "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

John 6:63,64; "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life. But there are some of you who do not believe."

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