Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#202 Jun 17, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Randy: It is all about Authority. Who did Jesus leave the Authority too? A book that anybody can decide on their own what Jesus taught that has created 30,000 churches, from writings produced 2000 years ago, with the originals gone, and with almost 30,000 translations across the world? You even like one of those that 1 Jewish man created 3 years ago by himself.
Do you believe that you know the fullness of the truth and that you can lead all to heaven?
OR you believe it doesn't matter what we believe, only that Jesus died for our sins and if we live a good life heaven is ours?
I believe Jesus when he gave the Keys to Peter and he told the Apostles to go start his Church which is the pillar and foundation of Truth, that is his Bride, that binds and looses, forgive sins or retains them? Whoever hears his Church hears him.
I believe the historical proof that the CC is the Church Jesus started because it it the only one for 1500 years and longest lived organization in the history of the world.
With all of the sinners in the Church over those 2000 years, God would have destroyed it if was not his Church.
Matthew chapter 10. Do we stand yoked to Jesus Christ? Who is yoked to Him AND abides in His word. These are the important questions to answer. Has the RCC exampled His word in such a way throughout the centuries? If not, then who has? But what really matters today for us is if we do those things and find ourselves in the number that Revelation says are those who overcome till the end through His Testimony from heaven, keeping the commandments of God, and overcoming the adversary by in the ways He declared?

And I'm to be lead to believe the Pope leads me in those things when he has been including those that Christ has not included in His group of friends and family? I don't think so.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#203 Jun 18, 2013
BW: "He said upon this rock, not upon you Peter - there is a difference"

18 And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church,* and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
19
l I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven.* Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

Okay. He just names Simon, Peter, the first person in in recorded history to have that name. You know that had to be important,.

And then according to you , he says You are Peter and upon me I will build my Church. Bizarre.

Did he give the keys to himself too?
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#204 Jun 18, 2013
He has all the keys - Jesus that is.

Look at the subject Jesus was teaching, and how this relates to Himself. Also note other places in Scripture that speak of the 'rock'- going back into OT Scripture.

The theme is Him, not Peter - His words, not Peters words, except as he was abiding in the commandments and teachings of the Lord and relating the same things he (Peter) was first taught by Jesus. see the great commission and acts 3:22,23.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#205 Jun 18, 2013
Additionally, look at the teachings and prayer of Jesus from John 13-17.

As the Father said:'Hear Him'(speaking of His only begotten Son).
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#206 Jun 18, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
He has all the keys - Jesus that is.
Look at the subject Jesus was teaching, and how this relates to Himself. Also note other places in Scripture that speak of the 'rock'- going back into OT Scripture.
The theme is Him, not Peter - His words, not Peters words, except as he was abiding in the commandments and teachings of the Lord and relating the same things he (Peter) was first taught by Jesus. see the great commission and acts 3:22,23.
So is this your interpretation??

I am going to name you Rock and tell you I am giving you the Keys, but this is just to confuse the Catholics for the first 1500 years. When Father Luther invents Sola Scriptura , everybody will figure out the slight of hand.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#207 Jun 18, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
what did Jesus say is the pillar and foundation of truth?
2 Peter 1:19-21
19 And so we have the prophetic word confirmed,[a] which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; 20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation,[b] 21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God[c] spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.

This was your man Peter according to you the first pope so what think ye now.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#208 Jun 18, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
You did not answer the question on how the Bible was created. you quoted verses from the Bible .
I believe all those verse and everyone in the Bible
Why is the Epistle of Barnabas not in the Bible. What about the Shepherd of Hermas? The Gospel according to Hebrews? The Apostolic Constitutions? Pauls Epistle to the Laodiceans? The Doctrine of the Twelve Apostles?
All of these and hundreds more were being circulated in the 1st, 2nd and 3rd Centuries.
Why did 1st John and Revelation make the bible and the ones above didnt?
try reading an entire post. Its in the first as to How the people knew the letters were inspired of God. It was not how the Bible as we know it was put together.

You do agree the bible is the word of God dont you? Or is the word of the RCC?

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#209 Jun 18, 2013
Mike will acknowledge the Bible as from God but a product of the “the Church.” He also will insist that the Bible is incomplete. I will be the first to say: it’s not easy arguing/debating with Catholics if you take the road of history. They clearly have history on their side far as THEIR CHURCH goes. It- their history is well documented and cannot be refuted. It’s a well recorded example of apostasy. They have well recorded their turn from true Christianity… Popes, Rosary beads, Hail Mary’s, etc.- all additions to the faith once delivered.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#210 Jun 18, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
try reading an entire post. Its in the first as to How the people knew the letters were inspired of God. It was not how the Bible as we know it was put together.
You do agree the bible is the word of God dont you? Or is the word of the RCC?
You just cannot say it can you.'I refuse to tell you how the Bible was created because it affects what I believe" or "I have no clue how the Bible was created."

Which one?

Of course it is the written Word of God. The Catholic Church said it was and you agree with that.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#211 Jun 18, 2013
JesusCreed wrote:
Mike will acknowledge the Bible as from God but a product of the “the Church.” He also will insist that the Bible is incomplete. I will be the first to say: it’s not easy arguing/debating with Catholics if you take the road of history. They clearly have history on their side far as THEIR CHURCH goes. It- their history is well documented and cannot be refuted. It’s a well recorded example of apostasy. They have well recorded their turn from true Christianity… Popes, Rosary beads, Hail Mary’s, etc.- all additions to the faith once delivered.
The Church, not my Church.

If Apostasy happened, we only need to talk sports. God is a myth.
Dave P

Nicholasville, KY

#212 Jun 18, 2013
Apostasy is a fact. Randy pointed that out clearly. Catholicism has recorded the apostasy very well.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#213 Jun 19, 2013
Dave P wrote:
Apostasy is a fact. Randy pointed that out clearly. Catholicism has recorded the apostasy very well.
apostasy is the total repudiation of the Christian faith

If God let his Church go into apostasy, there is no God.

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#214 Jun 19, 2013
The Catholic Church "fell away" from what was written. You will not find your rosary beads, hail Marys, etc., in scripture. Our mediator is Jesus NOT MARY - NOT A CATHOLIC POPE OR PRIEST. This is nothing but a falling away from the truth- apostasy. Your error is GREAT because it denies Jesus and replaces Him with a man who supposedly can remit sins. We don't need confession to any man- we can come boldly to the throne of grace and there Jesus forever intercedes for those who are His.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#215 Jun 19, 2013
JesusCreed wrote:
The Catholic Church "fell away" from what was written. You will not find your rosary beads, hail Marys, etc., in scripture. Our mediator is Jesus NOT MARY - NOT A CATHOLIC POPE OR PRIEST. This is nothing but a falling away from the truth- apostasy. Your error is GREAT because it denies Jesus and replaces Him with a man who supposedly can remit sins. We don't need confession to any man- we can come boldly to the throne of grace and there Jesus forever intercedes for those who are His.
Great to see we are on the same page. Through the years I have failed to see this. Thanks to Mike I can see it now.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#216 Jun 19, 2013
JesusCreed wrote:
The Catholic Church "fell away" from what was written. You will not find your rosary beads, hail Marys, etc., in scripture. Our mediator is Jesus NOT MARY - NOT A CATHOLIC POPE OR PRIEST. This is nothing but a falling away from the truth- apostasy. Your error is GREAT because it denies Jesus and replaces Him with a man who supposedly can remit sins. We don't need confession to any man- we can come boldly to the throne of grace and there Jesus forever intercedes for those who are His.
Who gave you authority to speak for God?
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#217 Jun 19, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Who gave you authority to speak for God?
Scripture!
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#218 Jun 19, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
So is this your interpretation??
I am going to name you Rock and tell you I am giving you the Keys, but this is just to confuse the Catholics for the first 1500 years. When Father Luther invents Sola Scriptura , everybody will figure out the slight of hand.
You have read some of Luther's accounts of his ventures to the RCC headquarters, haven't you? And wasn't it the corruption he witnessed, the evils that prevailed in the name of God's Son, that offended his very soul, that he posted his list? Men of the truth seek the light and truth of God. These men exist everywhere and in all perversions of the truth, and God raises up men that will react when they see the lies. Martin Luther was the checkpoint of the RCC, but because he saw some good to repent to do does not mean that he saw everything that needed repentance. But he did identify some gross errors and tried to make the CC repent of the evils. Even in the Mormons there have been men of truth that paid the price to be cast out of fellowship because of the truth. In fact, one of my favorite quotes came from such a man, who was called on the carpet and lost his leadership role in the LDS Church because he told the truth on them and merely wanted others to know the REAL truth on some matters lied about by their historians. The quote, from a KSL interview before the meeting was:'I don't know how to repent of the truth.'

Such are the true men of God.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#219 Jun 19, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
BW: "He said upon this rock, not upon you Peter - there is a difference"
18 And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church,* and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
19
l I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven.* Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”
Okay. He just names Simon, Peter, the first person in in recorded history to have that name. You know that had to be important,.
And then according to you , he says You are Peter and upon me I will build my Church. Bizarre.
Did he give the keys to himself too?
Upon Peters confession that Jesus is Lord. "You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God."

That confession is the faith once delivered to all. Fight the good fight of the faith. "Take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made your good confession in the presence of many witnesses".

The Church is built upon faith in Christ which is the bedrock of the true church. Not faith in Mary-not faith in the pope and not faith in Peter.

Said another way, Jesus is the founder of the church, for those who trust in him. "So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers," If any of these twist the scripture they are none of his.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#220 Jun 19, 2013
'Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.' Imagine the providence of God that this is in both Matthew 4:4 AND Luke 4:4. Chance alone? I doubt it.

'It must needs be that all things written of Me be fulfilled.'(paraphrased Luke 24:44)
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#221 Jun 19, 2013
Martin Luther was merely recognizing one of the hundreds of truths that Y'shua taught - 'Sola Scriptura' does not find its origin in Matin Luther, but Master YHWH Y'shua (Jesus Christ).

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