Separation Of Church And State
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#42 Jul 15, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
Wait a minute - I understand that Catholics must believe they support the ONE true church while Protestant churches may be less convinced that there can only be ONE interpretation of the Bible.
But Mormons literally and openly commit adultery by "marrying" multiple people - that's one of the commandments! Isn't that sort of lifestyle as un-Christian as a homosexual lifestyle?
How can you respect Mormons but not gays?
Seems to me that you like to place people in a box. If a gay person does things that are good like say helping at an accident scene I can respect that but I cannot respect an aberrant lifestyle. There are things that christians do that I cannot respect. I respect you but if you are in a homosexual relationship, I cannot respect that part.

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#43 Jul 16, 2013
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
Seems to me that you like to place people in a box. If a gay person does things that are good like say helping at an accident scene I can respect that but I cannot respect an aberrant lifestyle. There are things that christians do that I cannot respect. I respect you but if you are in a homosexual relationship, I cannot respect that part.
I DON'T like putting people is a box - but that is the only way to vaguely refer to groups of people.

Am I wrong that Mormons support polygamy? Isn't it true that many Mormons legally marry one person and then have "married" relationships and families with another person or even a few more people. That's just straight up Adultery. It's not ILLEGAL (like homosexuality in not illegal) but it's certainly forbidden by the Bible. It's right in the 10 Commandments - the Bible couldn't be anymore clear about it.

Why doesn't this disgust you the way that homosexuality does? You (I think it was you..) posted a link to describe how everyone's insurance rates would increase to compensate for all the diseases that homosexuality allegedly causes. What about all of the welfare benefits that your tax dollars produce that goes towards large families that Mormons create but obviously cannot afford?

I'm just totally surprised that you can be against allowing homosexuals to marry, but have no problem with Mormons having multiple sexual relationships outside of their already legal marriage.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#44 Jul 16, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
I DON'T like putting people is a box - but that is the only way to vaguely refer to groups of people.
Am I wrong that Mormons support polygamy? Isn't it true that many Mormons legally marry one person and then have "married" relationships and families with another person or even a few more people. That's just straight up Adultery. It's not ILLEGAL (like homosexuality in not illegal) but it's certainly forbidden by the Bible. It's right in the 10 Commandments - the Bible couldn't be anymore clear about it.
Why doesn't this disgust you the way that homosexuality does? You (I think it was you..) posted a link to describe how everyone's insurance rates would increase to compensate for all the diseases that homosexuality allegedly causes. What about all of the welfare benefits that your tax dollars produce that goes towards large families that Mormons create but obviously cannot afford?
I'm just totally surprised that you can be against allowing homosexuals to marry, but have no problem with Mormons having multiple sexual relationships outside of their already legal marriage.
Laws of Nature

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#45 Jul 16, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Laws of Nature
Are you saying that polygamy happens in nature but homosexuality does not? That is not true.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#46 Jul 16, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
I DON'T like putting people is a box - but that is the only way to vaguely refer to groups of people.
Am I wrong that Mormons support polygamy? Isn't it true that many Mormons legally marry one person and then have "married" relationships and families with another person or even a few more people. That's just straight up Adultery. It's not ILLEGAL (like homosexuality in not illegal) but it's certainly forbidden by the Bible. It's right in the 10 Commandments - the Bible couldn't be anymore clear about it.
Why doesn't this disgust you the way that homosexuality does? You (I think it was you..) posted a link to describe how everyone's insurance rates would increase to compensate for all the diseases that homosexuality allegedly causes. What about all of the welfare benefits that your tax dollars produce that goes towards large families that Mormons create but obviously cannot afford?
I'm just totally surprised that you can be against allowing homosexuals to marry, but have no problem with Mormons having multiple sexual relationships outside of their already legal marriage.
I don't know where you got that idea, I am totally against multiple marriages and so is the mormon church. I admit that they took a long time to change their position on this. The mormons who do this usually do so underground-hidden from the public.

Having said that I am not a fan of mormonism but I can't fault them when the do good things anymore that I would for gays who act right in public. The day is coming and now is raising it's ugly head where evil will be considered good and good will be considered as evil.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#47 Jul 16, 2013
Btw, I don't like catholism, but I strongly stand with them on most moral issues.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#48 Jul 16, 2013
Bobby wrote:
Btw, I don't like catholism, but I strongly stand with them on most moral issues.
Doesnt matter whether you like or dislike is it truth is the Question and I know you dont like I believe it is truth. And we dont have to STAND with them on Moral issues, we stand with Truth on moral issues which is the bible and then really seperates us from them as they stand on the Popes words not truth.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#49 Jul 16, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Doesnt matter whether you like or dislike is it truth is the Question and I know you dont like I believe it is truth. And we dont have to STAND with them on Moral issues, we stand with Truth on moral issues which is the bible and then really seperates us from them as they stand on the Popes words not truth.
I believe you and I have truths we stand together on, neither one of us believes the pope is infallible or that the catholic is the one true church.

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#50 Jul 16, 2013
Funny thing though - I categorize you all as "The Christians" when I have related our conversations to other people. I know that this excludes our sweet Pearl, but she is just one person, so wouldn't you agree that "Christian" is a good way to generalize this group of people? I know that you all are so different and disagree about many things - but the basic principles of Christianity are what you mostly agree about. When I disagree with "you Christians", its about honoring the principles of Christianity - sort of overlooking that some of you don't use instruments in church, some of you go to confessional, some of you pursue religion as a hobby & some of you actually "work" at church.

I really LIKE you people who come on Topix and chat with me - I dislike some of your Christian principles and that is one reason WHY I keep coming back - its not much fun to agree with people - there's not a lot to say about it.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#51 Jul 16, 2013
ASM said: "its not much fun to agree with people"

I think you may have hit the nail on the head:-)

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#52 Jul 16, 2013
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't know where you got that idea, I am totally against multiple marriages and so is the mormon church. I admit that they took a long time to change their position on this. The mormons who do this usually do so underground-hidden from the public.
Having said that I am not a fan of mormonism but I can't fault them when the do good things anymore that I would for gays who act right in public. The day is coming and now is raising it's ugly head where evil will be considered good and good will be considered as evil.
OK then - let's agree that polygamy is un-Christian. Am I correct? Do Mormons agree? If they do then I have been misinformed.

Let me see if I can correctly asses your stance on gay marriage: You do not want gays to be able to legally marry because it will encourage and support public gay communities. You expect these gay groups to grow in popularity and heterosexual people will be lured into a homosexual lifestyle. You are threatened that you will loose your followers to the other team: gays. Is this how you predict things to play out when gay marriage arrives in your town?
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#53 Jul 16, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Doesnt matter whether you like or dislike is it truth is the Question and I know you dont like I believe it is truth. And we dont have to STAND with them on Moral issues, we stand with Truth on moral issues which is the bible and then really seperates us from them as they stand on the Popes words not truth.
What separates is that you do not believe Jesus was not Divine enough to set up a Church that would not fail like he promised. That he really didn't mean that all Christians should be one like he and his Father are.(that unity through diversity crap)

What separates us is that you think Jesus was wrong in creating a Church and not a book. That the Church he created, put the Bible together 350 years after Jesus.

What separates us is that you think that you alone are the pillar and foundation of truth instead of the Church like Paul said.

What separates us is your ignorance of history. The history of Christianity and the Bible.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#54 Jul 16, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
OK then - let's agree that polygamy is un-Christian. Am I correct? Do Mormons agree? If they do then I have been misinformed.
Let me see if I can correctly asses your stance on gay marriage: You do not want gays to be able to legally marry because it will encourage and support public gay communities. You expect these gay groups to grow in popularity and heterosexual people will be lured into a homosexual lifestyle. You are threatened that you will loose your followers to the other team: gays. Is this how you predict things to play out when gay marriage arrives in your town?
Here is what I see that might happen again as a result the homosexual agenda.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...
Dave P

Nicholasville, KY

#55 Jul 16, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
I DON'T like putting people is a box - but that is the only way to vaguely refer to groups of people.
Am I wrong that Mormons support polygamy? Isn't it true that many Mormons legally marry one person and then have "married" relationships and families with another person or even a few more people. That's just straight up Adultery. It's not ILLEGAL (like homosexuality in not illegal) but it's certainly forbidden by the Bible. It's right in the 10 Commandments - the Bible couldn't be anymore clear about it.
Why doesn't this disgust you the way that homosexuality does? You (I think it was you..) posted a link to describe how everyone's insurance rates would increase to compensate for all the diseases that homosexuality allegedly causes. What about all of the welfare benefits that your tax dollars produce that goes towards large families that Mormons create but obviously cannot afford?
I'm just totally surprised that you can be against allowing homosexuals to marry, but have no problem with Mormons having multiple sexual relationships outside of their already legal marriage.
\

You are wrong that Mormonism supports polygamy. Those that do so are minority, extremist, and breaking the law or skirting around it. One of the factors of Utah being admitted into the Union was the ending of polygamy as church practice and doctrine. Just because it's on TV doesn't make it the "norm". I have mormon family- polygamy was a running joke for them.

Who said polygamy doesn't "disgust" us as homosexuality does? Disgust isn't the right word for this. You are saying we hate gays-NOT TRUE. The major difference FOR NOW- homosexuality is being pushed and flaunted as ok and acceptable, and many want Christians to accept it; many want to force God to accept it. Judging from the responses the television shows about polygamy are getting, in 10-15 years who knows? I might have five wives, if I could find someone to have me.(JUST JOKING)

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#56 Jul 16, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Doesnt matter whether you like or dislike is it truth is the Question and I know you dont like I believe it is truth. And we dont have to STAND with them on Moral issues, we stand with Truth on moral issues which is the bible and then really seperates us from them as they stand on the Popes words not truth.
I just have a hard time separating Catholics from Protestants. Its the basic Christian principles that concern me - it makes no difference if you honor the Pope or follow strict Catholic rules - its the fact that you ALL allow your religion to determine your opinion of people outside of your religion - that is part of Christianity. You think that a homosexual lifestyle is a sin and you learned that at church.

I told some friends I have been chatting with "The Christians" and they say: WHY are you doing that? What a incredible waste of time - you are banging your head against a wall - Christians will never accept homosexuality not matter how long any of us argue. I don't ever expect any of you to convince me to withdraw my support of homosexual lifestyles - what's the point in arguing about it?

I really think its the ARGUING I like - being able to vent my opinion to people who will challenge me to continue applying logic to my own ideas. I never accept anyone's opinion as facts - but I like to take their opinion into consideration and challenge other people to apply logic to their ideas as well. People complain about Topix but I think this stuff is so much FUN. You "Christians" are fun to talk to. Anyone not having fun needs to quit coming back.

I have invited some posters to visit this forum and participate in our discussions. I don't know if they will accept my invitation, but be aware if they do.. they are like me in their disagreement with your Christian principles - but they are also really great people who enjoy arguing and venting their opinion. All in good fun though. Please don't imagine that I'm organizing an attack on Christianity - I wanted to share these discussions with my friends.

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#57 Jul 16, 2013
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
Here is what I see that might happen again as a result the homosexual agenda.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...
No - Bobby, you do NOT believe this. You do not believe that God will send someone to tell certain people to flee and then destroy all the places where people are sinning. You would NEVER offer your daughter to rapists under ANY circumstances. You really don't believe this will happen.

I mean, don't get mad because I'm telling YOU what YOU believe like I can read your mind - but you are not saying what you mean. How can you apply this story to current times? This sort of stuff doesn't REALLY happen.

Suppose I had two house guests - ANY two (equal right visiting)- and someone or a mob of people knocked on my door and demanded that I turn over my guests to be raped. WHAT? I think I would shut the door, call the police and know for sure that if those people break into my house to do what they intend to do, God is not going to protect me from it. That Bible story is completely out of touch with reality.

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#58 Jul 16, 2013
Dave P wrote:
<quoted text>\
You are wrong that Mormonism supports polygamy. Those that do so are minority, extremist, and breaking the law or skirting around it. One of the factors of Utah being admitted into the Union was the ending of polygamy as church practice and doctrine. Just because it's on TV doesn't make it the "norm". I have mormon family- polygamy was a running joke for them.
Who said polygamy doesn't "disgust" us as homosexuality does? Disgust isn't the right word for this. You are saying we hate gays-NOT TRUE. The major difference FOR NOW- homosexuality is being pushed and flaunted as ok and acceptable, and many want Christians to accept it; many want to force God to accept it. Judging from the responses the television shows about polygamy are getting, in 10-15 years who knows? I might have five wives, if I could find someone to have me.(JUST JOKING)
Keep that joke going and you'll end up with less than one wife.

OK then - I am the one who related polygamy to homosexuality because I couldn't see how you could support one and not the other - since they are both sinful. I get aggravated at others who want to claim that legal same-sex marriage would lead to legalized polygamy. I can see now how you can find those two things related - you are concerned that the world is methodically legalizing sin. Hmm.

I apologize for re-enforcing the stereotype that Mormons support polygamy. I understand how stereotypes can be passed off as fact - and that sometimes, stereotypes are facts - after you watch "Sister Wives", be sure and tune into "Buckwild". I do not dip snuff, but I can't vouch for everyone around here.

We are in disagreement about how to describe your feelings towards gays. You want to co-exist peacefully and you don't want to encourage any homosexual activities. But you are not peacefully co-existing if there is a Christian inspired law that prevents gays from being allowed to have their legal homosexual lifestyle - the Christians have gone too far by determining how non-Christians can live. Why can't Christians peacefully co-exist by removing the ban of gay marriage?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#59 Jul 16, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
What separates is that you do not believe Jesus was not Divine enough to set up a Church that would not fail like he promised. That he really didn't mean that all Christians should be one like he and his Father are.(that unity through diversity crap)
What separates us is that you think Jesus was wrong in creating a Church and not a book. That the Church he created, put the Bible together 350 years after Jesus.
What separates us is that you think that you alone are the pillar and foundation of truth instead of the Church like Paul said.
What separates us is your ignorance of history. The history of Christianity and the Bible.
Yes these maybe what separates us but that does not prove your right and I am wrong.

Truth is always going to separate things, and without the word of God there is no truth.

Here is what Christ promised to bring about truth and its not the church. He also said the Spirit of Truth would last forever.

16 I will ask the Father, and He will give you another [b]Helper, that He may be with you forever; 17 that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you.

Either Christ was lying or the Apostles had the entire truth, not the church the apostles.

17 Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth.

Now answer this simple question. Was the church that God allowed mankind to be added to at Pentecost perfect and without error?

I await your answer.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#60 Jul 16, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
No - Bobby, you do NOT believe this. You do not believe that God will send someone to tell certain people to flee and then destroy all the places where people are sinning. You would NEVER offer your daughter to rapists under ANY circumstances. You really don't believe this will happen.
I mean, don't get mad because I'm telling YOU what YOU believe like I can read your mind - but you are not saying what you mean. How can you apply this story to current times? This sort of stuff doesn't REALLY happen.
Suppose I had two house guests - ANY two (equal right visiting)- and someone or a mob of people knocked on my door and demanded that I turn over my guests to be raped. WHAT? I think I would shut the door, call the police and know for sure that if those people break into my house to do what they intend to do, God is not going to protect me from it. That Bible story is completely out of touch with reality.
It's clear to me that you do not understand the scripture about this, homosexuality was the norm in those cities, they did not want the daughters, they were planning to rape the men/angels of God. Lot saw these men/angels as holy and was fearful for them, he did not understand they were there to destroy the city and had the power to do so.

There was no law enforcement they could call upon that would defend them or protect them as you seem to think-it was a lawless city. If you live long enough you may see that happen in your city.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#61 Jul 16, 2013
And just as it happened in the days of Noah, so shall it be in the days of the coming of the Son of Man:were eating, they were drinking, they were marrying and giving in marriage,until the day Noah entered the Ark and the flood came and destroyed them all.It was the same as happened in the days of Lot...( luke 17)

Jesus warned us that the end of days would be just as it was in the time leading up to the flood and also as in the last days of Sodom and Gommorah.

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