Does Protestantism Lead to Atheism.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#21 Oct 24, 2013
Dave P wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L ist_of_heresies_in_Catholicism
Anyone care to agree with their assessments?
Scrolling through the lists I noticed it was primarily the infallible Ecumenical Councils of the Catholic Church and a few Popes that dealt with all of these heresies through the centuries. I failed to find the Church of Christ denomination helping out in any way.
Dave P

Wallingford, KY

#22 Oct 24, 2013
Antinomianism Any view which holds that Christians are freed by grace from obligations of any moral law. St Paul had to refute a charge of this type made by opponents because of his attitude to the Mosaic Law (Romans 3:8)

Ebionites A Jewish sect that insisted on the necessity of following Jewish law and rites,[19] which they interpreted in light of Jesus' expounding of the Law.[20] They regarded Jesus as the Messiah but not as divine.

Free Spirit Mixed mystical beliefs with Christianity. Its practitioners believed that it was possible to reach perfection on earth through a life of austerity and spiritualism. They believed that they could communicate directly with God and did not need the Christian church for intercession.

Jansenism A branch of Catholic thought which arose in the frame of the Counter-Reformation and the aftermath of the Council of Trent (1545–1563). It emphasized original sin, human depravity, the necessity of divine grace, and predestination.

Christian Zionism Belief that the ingathering of the exiles (Jews) in Israel is a prerequisite for the Second Coming of Jesus. This belief is primarily, though not exclusively, associated with Christian Dispensationalism.

Good starting list of heresies.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#23 Oct 25, 2013
Annoying Proxy wrote:
Here is a link Barnsweb shared sometime ago. This an ex-Pharisee and he explains what a Pharisee really is, the following of oral tradition and sometimes changing it along the way, just as do. They are the modern day Pharisees. The teaching is long and he does not believe Christ is the Messiah. He does seem to be knowledgeable of the Jews. Notice how Catholic practice parallels Pharisee practice. Who should know what a Pharisee is better than a Pharisee?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =tddCNY6U77YXX#
The written word from God was given to us for a reason by God. Rebellious man wants his own way and downplays the God given word to us and replace it with their own oral laws and man made traditions. Anyone can see who that is among us today. Does anyone think God went to the trouble to bring us his word in written form only to have it replaced by the words of man? The Catholics do.
You are using BW as a source and he wants to remove Paul from the Bible. Great example of what I was talking about.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#24 Oct 25, 2013
Dave P wrote:
Antinomianism Any view which holds that Christians are freed by grace from obligations of any moral law. St Paul had to refute a charge of this type made by opponents because of his attitude to the Mosaic Law (Romans 3:8)
Ebionites A Jewish sect that insisted on the necessity of following Jewish law and rites,[19] which they interpreted in light of Jesus' expounding of the Law.[20] They regarded Jesus as the Messiah but not as divine.
Free Spirit Mixed mystical beliefs with Christianity. Its practitioners believed that it was possible to reach perfection on earth through a life of austerity and spiritualism. They believed that they could communicate directly with God and did not need the Christian church for intercession.
Jansenism A branch of Catholic thought which arose in the frame of the Counter-Reformation and the aftermath of the Council of Trent (1545–1563). It emphasized original sin, human depravity, the necessity of divine grace, and predestination.
Christian Zionism Belief that the ingathering of the exiles (Jews) in Israel is a prerequisite for the Second Coming of Jesus. This belief is primarily, though not exclusively, associated with Christian Dispensationalism.
Good starting list of heresies.
Making my point for me. All first Protestants were Catholics. Protestantism came out of the Catholic Church. A heresy.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#25 Oct 25, 2013
William wrote:
"I'd say the whole concept of "sola scriptura" or "bible alone" the idea that ANYONE can just pick up the bible and read it for themselves has not only splintered Protestantism, but is actually a tool that Atheists use all the time."
Sort of like pointing out the rampant sexual perversions amog the officialdom of the Catholic church, coupled with it's wild spending on house renovations in Germany, can lead to atheism?
Glass houses, man.
Quickly change the subject. How many times did go somewhere else on Sunday because you did not like what you heard?
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#26 Oct 25, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would the apostles especially Paul write letters of instruction and encouragement to the early church if in fact they had through apostolic succession given each church the pillar of truth? We know elders had been installed in each of those groups. It makes no sense that the written letters of corrections would be needed if apostolic succession had occurred. The fact is that false doctrine appeared when RCC fabricated it.
Also if the Apostolic succession had been in the early church why did the Revelation indicate that those groups were failing, you know those seven churches that no longer exist? Now it must be that Christ failed in establishing the church as catholics view it but the Pope did not.
Christ never failed. The Church is the longest surviving institution in the history of the world.

Why is that?
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#27 Oct 25, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
<quoted text>
None of the doctrines that have divided Christianity stem from anything Jesus taught. As you state, it's 'personal interpretation', but I'd call it picking and choosing what any Church - including Catholic - believe. And the doctrinal sources that divide are of Paul - not Jesus Christ - not the OT - not James or Jude - but Paul.
Paul prevents Jews from becoming Christians because the prophecies say the Messiah will cause the Gentiles to keep the Torah. How can they do that when Paul said Torah was nailed to the cross and is the source of death?
Paul prevents Muslims from believing as they see Paul as denying the very commandments of God and that those who do such things cannot be of God.
Paul prevents those such as Jefferson from becoming Christians because even Jefferson noted Paul taught against what Jesus taught.
Paul prevents unity in the Christian churches because they find confusion to know what Paul taught - he was all over the place, and they don't think to suspend their belief in his words long enough to study what it was Jesus taught!
But will there be time for Christians to repent of Paul? I submit they are incapable to repent of his errors. It's so much easier to just say the prayer to trust in Jesus and not have to repent to do whatever He taught and be submissive to the King.
Who said: "Bring those servants of mine who did not want me to reign over them and slay them at my feet."?
and
"Why do you call Me 'Lord', and not do what I say?"
Only the Church has the fullness of the Truth. All other communities pick and choose to differentiate from the Church and each other.

As they continue to splinter and pick less and less truths, fence standing Chrisians start thinking that sense everybody thinks differently on what the word of God means it must mean there is no God.

Those high Church Prots are closer to the Truth. As you go down the list to the lowest Church Prots they have less.

Remember high and low Church is a Protestant term that got from the Catholic Mass. We have a high Mass like at Easter and Christmas and other times.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#28 Oct 25, 2013
From a Protestant Blogger Joe Carter. "First Things"

An intriguing claim that I think has a lot of merit:

The historical debate about the genealogy of modern atheism continues amongst historians and theologians, blaming various figures such as Duns Scotus, Francisco Saurez, the deists, René Descartes, and many others. I don’t doubt that some of these figures may have contributed in one way or another, but I remain persuaded, at least for the moment, that the main culprit is really Martin Luther.

Now, I say this as a convinced Protestant. I agree 100% with Luther’s sola scriptura. But I think it was probably the cause of atheism. To boil it down: Luther raised the possibility of a Christianity not founded on Papal (or at least clerical, in Councils) primacy, but based on the individual scholar/Christian reading the scriptures for themselves. Unfortunately, those who agreed with Luther on this starting point failed to present a unified front on several of the important issues in theology and ethics, with the result of the (in)famous fragmentation of Protestantism. This fragmentation became (at least perceived to be; see below) violent with the Wars of Religion, with the result that philosophers started to look for a grounding for politics and ethics outside of any kind of theology. This led to a distinctively modern kind of foundationalism, which, combined with a judgment that there was no good evidence for Christianity, led to atheism.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#29 Oct 25, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
<quoted text>
False doctrine preceded the RCC - it started with the false apostle.
Show the evidence Paul was an apostle from anyone in the NT other than Paul. If Paul alone testifies to himself, by the standards Jesus taught - Paul is a liar.
A doubter will read what BWs says and he would assume all Christians are crazy. No true Christian God would allow this kind of stuff.
William

Eastaboga, AL

#30 Oct 25, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Quickly change the subject. How many times did go somewhere else on Sunday because you did not like what you heard?
At least as many times as you did. How do you like your new synagogue home? Better art, architecture, and music than the Baptists, that's for sure. And no incessant whining about pianos either.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#31 Oct 25, 2013
William wrote:
<quoted text>
At least as many times as you did. How do you like your new synagogue home? Better art, architecture, and music than the Baptists, that's for sure. And no incessant whining about pianos either.
Once. To fullness of the Truth with historical proof. You probably changed like most Prots, you disagreed with leadership or the parking lot was better in the new one.

Didn't get your feet muddy on a rainy day.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#32 Oct 25, 2013
Even though this guy is a little conservative for me, he explains things well.

William

Eastaboga, AL

#33 Oct 25, 2013
Well as long as you are happy with it and the Lord is happy with it, that is really all that matters for you.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#34 Oct 25, 2013
William wrote:
Well as long as you are happy with it and the Lord is happy with it, that is really all that matters for you.
Unlike Protestantism, the Church is also concerned about the collective Body of Christ than just the " personal relationship" with Jesus" like Prots have whatever each of them thinks that means.

We should one like the Father and Son are so the world can see it.

Protestantism has done just the opposite, leading to the increase of non believers
Dave P

Grayson, KY

#35 Oct 25, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Making my point for me. All first Protestants were Catholics. Protestantism came out of the Catholic Church. A heresy.
Perhaps you are right- perhaps much if not all of protestantism is heresy. Look at all the belief systems, Calvinism, dispensationalism, hundreds of different bodies. This isn't what God desires.
William

Eastaboga, AL

#36 Oct 25, 2013
Religion as a whole has led the charge into atheism. When people see the greed, sexual misconduct, and arrogance of clergy, it resonates strongly in the thought process for signing up.

Religion is business, and business is struggling. That is why your church just tapped a guy to lead it because he is from one of the few growth areas for Catholicism left on the planet.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#37 Oct 25, 2013
The Church has 'struggled' for 2000 years. With Jesus' promise, it will survive.

Everybody should take a Western Civ. course.
William

Talladega, AL

#38 Oct 25, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
Everybody should take a Western Civ. course.
At a Catholic school?

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#39 Oct 25, 2013
William wrote:
<quoted text>
At a Catholic school?
I took my Western Civilization courses at a Methodist College along with Old and New Testament. Those and Art History courses set me on the path to the Catholic Church and escape from the CofC.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#40 Oct 25, 2013
I loved all my history classes at the state university. The prof for my Western Civ class was a Jew. This evangelical dude sat on the front row and tried to change what he and book said.

His expertise was the Catacombs. Had written multiple books on them.

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