Bible study rules for public schools ...

Bible study rules for public schools proposed

There are 174715 comments on the The Courier-Journal story from Feb 10, 2010, titled Bible study rules for public schools proposed. In it, The Courier-Journal reports that:

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Courier-Journal.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#112454 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>That is a huge if. I would say that never happened due to the idea these people were not convinced of Moses' god. The story shows the only plausible event being a leader murdering non believers. It is exactly like Muslims killing Christians. And until you and your kind learn this, please do not expect Muslims to stop killing Christians. Both superstitions are hypocritical, and you demonstrate how Christianity justifies murder for having diversity in religious beliefs.
I am sure the Muslims who murder Christians are doing so in the belief of building a strong nation. You see, they are anti secularism, and against religious freedom, just as the bible is.
They were convinced at the time,(they even built an altar to Him along the way) but not being in God's presence, once hardship hit, they abandoned Him quickly. That's why I call them weak.

I don't expect Muslim extremists to stop killing Christians any more than I expect communists to stop hating the US.

Christians have not been charged to kill others with opposing beliefs. We don't justify murder because we are told not to murder. The people of the Old Testament lived under different laws than Christians today, but very similar to other civilizations that existed at the time. It wasn't uncommon for civilizations to kill anyone that threatened their way of life, any outsider.
Countries weren't setup back then with international rules.
Known Fact

Orlando, FL

#112455 Sep 5, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
God didn't inspire crap... That was the inspiration of men, mainly poorly educated goat herders and fishermen, to give them control of the masses that were less educated than they were...
Uses the bible to validate the stories of the bible is like using Ann McCaffy's book "Dragons of Pern" to Validate thread fall and dragons eating fire rocks to breath fire....
Where or what is your proof?
You have absolutely no idea what you are saying! Did you know the Apostle Luke was a doctor and the Apostle Paul was an attorney? Moses was a leader of some 3 million Israelites? David and Solomon were kings and many were prophets who stated accurate prophecy into the future even down to our day!
Known Fact

Orlando, FL

#112456 Sep 5, 2013
HELP PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND ...
That an approved relationship with God is possible only through Jesus Christ.
That deliverance from sin and death is possible only through faith in Jesus Christ.
That God’s will is for all to acknowledge Jesus as Lord, not merely by calling him Lord but by keeping his commandments.
That what the Bible says about Jesus Christ is true but that much of what Christendom teaches about him distorts the facts.
curious

Winter Garden, FL

#112457 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>I can admit that it is my opinion that no god exists. Now can you admit your claims are just opinion? I was simply trying to make a point to someone who has not been able to understand previous posts on the subject. I see you avoided the point all together once again and just divert. Diversion is needed for the delusion.
No , my claims are not based on my opinion , as you well know and as I have often stated.
Therefore I will not admit as accurate your erroneous claim.
Known Fact

Orlando, FL

#112458 Sep 5, 2013
THE PROPHET JEREMIAH
Why could Jeremiah be confident that what he prophesied would occur?(Jer. 1:17; 7:30; 9:22) He was a man of faith who had studied the Scriptures and knew that Jehovah is the God of true prophecy. History testified to Jehovah’s ability to foretell events that seemed impossible from a human standpoint, such as the liberation of Israel from bondage in Egypt. Jeremiah was familiar with the Exodus account and with the words of one eyewitness. Joshua had reminded fellow Israelites:“You well know with all your hearts and with all your souls that not one word out of all the good words that Jehovah your God has spoken to you has failed. They have all come true for you. Not one word of them has failed.”—Josh. 23:14.
Why should you continue to give attention to the prophecies Jeremiah presented? First, because he had justifiable confidence in the reliability of Jehovah’s words. Second, because some of God’s pronouncements through Jeremiah are now being fulfilled, and you will yet see the fulfillment of others. Third, because the sheer number of announcements that Jeremiah made in God’s name, as well as the vigor with which he made them, marked him as an extraordinary servant of God.“Even in the company of the prophets, Jeremiah towers as a giant,” notes one scholar. Jeremiah was recognized as such a powerful figure in God’s dealings with His people that when Jesus was speaking, some who heard him believed that he must be Jeremiah.—Matt. 16:13, 14.
Like Jeremiah, you live at a time when crucial Bible prophecies are being fulfilled. And like Jeremiah, you need to maintain confidence in the truthfulness of God’s promises.(2 Pet. 3:9-14) How can you do that? By continuing to build your trust in the absolute reliability of God’s prophetic Word.
THIS IS NOT BASED ON BLIND FAITH!
Known Fact

Winchester, KY

#112459 Sep 5, 2013
Known Fact wrote:
HELP PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND ...
That an approved relationship with God is possible only through Jesus Christ.
That deliverance from sin and death is possible only through faith in Jesus Christ.
That God’s will is for all to acknowledge Jesus as Lord, not merely by calling him Lord but by keeping his commandments.
That what the Bible says about Jesus Christ is true but that much of what Christendom teaches about him distorts the facts.
Prove IT!
curious

Winter Garden, FL

#112460 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Your last sentence tells it all. You refuse to take the test because you think it is the devils work.
Religion figured out that if it tells you the opposing views are the work of the devil, avoid it. Textbook brainwashing technique.
The outsiders tests I take show your god is not likely to exist. Of course it cannot prove a god exists, but it shows your god is immoral and not likely to be true.
Science shows many of the claims of the bible are false.
The world was never flooded and killed all men and animals. It just did not happen. So I conclude your bible is not all true.
I could go on and on with such examples, as I have been for the past year or so on this very thread. Have you not been paying attention?
You took your outsiders test and concluded there is no God.

I , on the other hand took God's test and based on His many positive responses God convinced me of his existence.
No more need be said.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#112461 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>What is "wicked" about worshiping a golden calf? Your statement is anti freedom of religion.
If you worshipped a golden calf in America, would you call that person "wicked"?
Maybe your god is a devil if he is so evil as to murder people just for worshiping something other than himself.
But then again, that would be assuming devils exist.
The Bible is a book about our Father in Heaven and the dealings of a group of people with Him. Keep the context in mind. Do you really think the God that created us approves freedom of religion? I hope you don't think this. So why would you expect His prophet to be cool with them worshipping something they created instead of the God that created them and delivered them recently from bondage? This wasn't America. There was no democracy there.

You seem to fail the outsider test here because you can't fathom that if there is a creator, He might get mad if you worship a statue of something else.
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

#112462 Sep 5, 2013
SistaNoneYa wrote:
<quoted text>
Case challenging 'Pledge of Allegiance' reaches Massachusetts' highest court
Published September 01, 2013
FoxNews.com
A Massachusetts atheist couple’s challenge to the required recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in school – specifically the phrase,“under God”– will reach the state’s highest court this week.
Religion News Services, or RNS, reports Massachusetts’ highest court, the Supreme Judicial Court , will consider Doe v. Action-Boxborough Regional School District on Wednesday, which is expected to rule whether the pledge violates students’ rights.
The verdict may reverberate around the nation.
Notably, the suit, which was lodged by attorneys for an anonymous atheist couple, will reportedly mark a departure from similar and previous challenges to the pledge – and the “under God” phrase – which have in the past reached as far as the U.S. Supreme Court.
In this case, plaintiffs’ lawyers, according to RNS, will argue compulsory recitation represents an injury to the state’s equal rights laws, or the guarantee of equal protection for all concerned under those laws.
As RNS notes, such legal maneuvering borrows a page directly from the recently successful campaign lodged to legalize same-sex marriage, which made a similar and successful argument, also before the state’s Supreme Judicial Court.
The defendants – represented by the Becket Fund for Religious Liberty – reportedly won the first round of the much-watched legal tug-of-war in June 2012, when a lower court judge ruled recitation of the pledge did not violate the Massachusetts Constitution, the school district’s anti-discrimination policy or state law.
According to RNS, the oral arguments slated for Wednesday stem from an appeal of that decision.
One thing seems certain – that the higher court’s ruling will have potentially far-reaching implications for school districts, and those on both sides of the issue, around the nation.
Should the court rule in favor of the plaintiffs, Eric Rassbach, deputy general counsel for the Becket Fund, reportedly said,“You would then see a rash of state court lawsuits challenging the pledge all over the country.
“A win for us would completely avoid that unnecessary harm. And it would affirm that it is not discriminatory to have the words ‘under God’ in the pledge.”
----------
Now it's the Pledge of Allegiance. Wahwahwah. Whiney, greedy azz, chickenchit (anonymous) anti-American CommeTIC atheists.
Give 'em one dolluh and fitty five cents to buy some cotton balls for to plug the holes in their ears where the wind whistles through, some tape for their anti-American, CommieTic spewing pieholes, and a nickel so's we can watch them chase their tails like the rabid dogs they are, while trying to find and buy a clue.
I actually don't have a problem with the Pledge being said in school. I deem the Pledge more along the lines of Patriotism or a Patriotic Poem rather than that of a Prayer. You are pledging allegiance to the flag,,,, not a god.
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

#112463 Sep 5, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I threaten my kids with toys taken away or time out, no iPad or TV time, etc.
God doesn't get involved with every detail that happens on earth. He lets us choose and intervenes when He is humbly asked, or if it is necessary to fulfill His plans. This is why He gave us the Holy Ghost. So we can receive personal revelation regarding ourselves and our families to know how to act when we are uncertain or afraid.
Does God say anything about discipline of children? hum, seems I do recall something about sparing the rod and spoiling the child, I don't recall anything of a 'time-out'
lol
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112464 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Oh, so it is supposed to be condescending, like as in a pitchfork mentality? I see a hypocrite.
There's tons of hypocrites every where, every day. Not my problem. I try to live by MOST of the ethical and moral codes I expect of myself.

Grabbing the pitchforks from the hands of the bearers of and turning their own garbage right back around on to themselves included.

So you can that reflection of your own hypocrisy back into your pocket now.
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112465 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>I can agree the Syria case needs to be a UN case, not a United States case. Now can we get back to my questions?
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Take the outsiders test. Would you allow the pledge have Allah to replace god? How about "one nation, under Swaminarayan, indivisible....
Now please learn the benefits of secularism. Maybe our example could lead to the middle east becoming more secularist.
Centuries steeped in cultures of their own...and as we have seen over the past few years and months, they do not like just "secular leaders" as there's been quite a few. Just having "secular leaders" is not going to be the whole of changing anything either. Saddam was secular, when not flip flopping for political reason. Ghadaffi was secular...Assad isn't that far out there (religious extremist wise) and on and on.

What needs to be exampled and propogated is DEMOCRACY...with term limits..via electorial vote processes...and al the procedures that apply with such.
Iran is getting it...but yet...we want to endanger that?

And look what Israel faces EVERY day, from various radical THUG groups. The ONLY democracy in place of any duration in the region, and STILL...

But then, just look at the stupid people here in our own nation that don't even comprehend the concept sometimes.(Especially even LESS so over the past three or four years so it seems!)
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

#112466 Sep 5, 2013
SistaNoneYa wrote:
<quoted text>
I read it differently, verbatim....as in comparing and contrasting literary types and styles, and the influences of on the cultures of the civilized world.
But then some of you clueless atheist paranoid dolts, would probably try and ban ANY discussions on subjects Leonardo Davinci's Last Supper, or Michealangelo's frescos in the Sistene chapel.
Why they really might should consider entrance test for any actual elective types of similar courses. Keep the nothing but igno-whiners of destruction and distraction, OUT of them!!
"OMG, OMG, protest protest, "they're" trying to "brainwarsh dem kids wif religion" OMG OMG.
(idiot, skeered of books igno-dolts.)
I find it quite interesting that you consider anyone who doesn't share your point of view to be clueless, atheist, and paranoid dolts. It only proves to me that you are closed minded and refuse to uphold and acknowledge the first amendment. This bill was pretending to state that it was introduced as teaching bible literacy as an academic course, but then further stated from a supporter: she said the course teaches what the Bible says about accounts of the death and resurrection of Jesus in the New Testament. But "it is left up to the student to decide what to believe," NOTE "TEACHES WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS" These people were trying to introduce the bible as Truth! Not as any mythology class, Literary class, or anything else for that matter.

SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112467 Sep 5, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>I have found no details of the proposal. I have noted none spoken here on topix.
So it looks like the topic is so undefined, the posters have changed the debate.
Now if you have information of the case, please enlighten us with details. So far, you have not.
Most of us have stated a class would not be to off limits if it allowed for historical examinations and other sciences to be allowed to examine the claims of the book. If open discussion of opposing views were allowed.
Look the "case bill" up.

I just copied verbatim, what it REALLY said.

In of which, I never saw anything irrational or illogical to even bother getting a feather ruffled over.
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112468 Sep 5, 2013
stuck in a lodi wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, it appears you read it Wrong! Had the intentions been to introduce it as a literary course, it would have soared through Senate and House and became a reality, but that didn't happen because this was an attempt to teach the bible in Public School. If you want your child to hear the Bible and the "literary" makeup of it. Take them out of Public Schools and enroll them in a Private Christian School, they can discuss the bible and all it's stories to their little heart's content. I don't have a problem with Christian Schools, Vocational Schools, Nursing Schools, because they all serve a specific purpose....and rightly so. Don't expect to get the medical knowledge you need to be a Physician or Nurse in a Christian School, get the picture Sista?? When one tries to introduce Religion into the Public School System, Expect Retaliation, not just from non believers, but those that uphold the Constitution of the United States of America!
Some of the very BEST of the best have been educated a "Christian ideology based schools" fool.

Some History of Yale-
Yale's roots can be traced back to the 1640s, when colonial clergymen led an effort to establish a college in New Haven to preserve the tradition of European liberal education in the New World.
This vision was fulfilled in 1701, when the charter was granted for a school (Pay EXTRA close attention and TRY and read SLOWLY AND comprehend word for word now to this next part)

“wherein Youth may be instructed in the Arts and Sciences [and] through the blessing of Almighty God may be fitted for Publick employment both in Church and Civil State.”

YALE. About/History. YALE.edu
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112469 Sep 5, 2013
stuck in a lodi wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, it appears you read it Wrong! Had the intentions been to introduce it as a literary course, it would have soared through Senate and House and became a reality, but that didn't happen because this was an attempt to teach the bible in Public School. If you want your child to hear the Bible and the "literary" makeup of it. Take them out of Public Schools and enroll them in a Private Christian School, they can discuss the bible and all it's stories to their little heart's content. I don't have a problem with Christian Schools, Vocational Schools, Nursing Schools, because they all serve a specific purpose....and rightly so. Don't expect to get the medical knowledge you need to be a Physician or Nurse in a Christian School, get the picture Sista?? When one tries to introduce Religion into the Public School System, Expect Retaliation, not just from non believers, but those that uphold the Constitution of the United States of America!
and LEARN some actual READING comprehension for a CHANGE!!!

(SO that you might get the actual REAL picture after reading the terms GUIDELINES and REGULATIONS--)

The bill calls for the Kentucky Board of Education to establish GUIDELINES for an elective course on the Bible's literary structure and its influence on "literature, art, music, mores, oratory, and public policy."

Non-sectarian courses about the Bible are already legal in Kentucky - and, according to publishers of Bible curricula, already taking place in some public schools here. But creating state REGULATIONS for them would give them ...

AS in REGULATED, as in RULES to be followed-as in NOT for "recruitment" purposes.

DUH.
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112470 Sep 5, 2013
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
You took your outsiders test and concluded there is no God.
I , on the other hand took God's test and based on His many positive responses God convinced me of his existence.
No more need be said.
HAve you ever noticed the amazing, almost absolute perfect symmetry of work with in Leonardo Davinci's painting of the Last Supper?

----------

Why Is the Composition Remarkable?

First, it is remarkable because the disciples are all displaying very human, identifiable emotions. "The Last Supper" had certainly been painted before. Leonardo's version, though, was the first to depict real people acting like real people.

Secondly, and of major importance -- the technical perspective in "The Last Supper" is incredible. You can see that every single element of the painting directs one's attention straight to the midpoint of the composition, Christ's head. It's arguably the greatest example of one point perspective ever created.

What Does Last Supper Depict?

"The Last Supper" is Leonardo's visual interpretation of an event chronicled in all four of the Gospels (books in the Christian New Testament). The evening before Christ was betrayed by one of his disciples, he gathered them together to eat, tell them he knew what was coming and wash their feet (a gesture symbolizing that all were equal under the eyes of the Lord). As they ate and drank together, Christ gave the disciples explicit instructions on how to eat and drink in the future, in remembrance of him. It was the first celebration of the Eucharist, a ritual still performed.

Specifically, "The Last Supper" depicts the next few seconds in this story after Christ dropped the bombshell that one disciple would betray him before sunrise, and all 12 reacted to the news with different degrees of horror, anger and shock.

Esaak,S. "The Last Supper' by Leonardo da Vinci". 10 Common Questions About 'The Last Supper' Answered. Art History. About.com . Last accessed 9/5/2013.
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112471 Sep 5, 2013
stuck in a lodi wrote:
<quoted text> I find it quite interesting that you consider anyone who doesn't share your point of view to be clueless, atheist, and paranoid dolts. It only proves to me that you are closed minded and refuse to uphold and acknowledge the first amendment. This bill was pretending to state that it was introduced as teaching bible literacy as an academic course, but then further stated from a supporter: she said the course teaches what the Bible says about accounts of the death and resurrection of Jesus in the New Testament. But "it is left up to the student to decide what to believe," NOTE "TEACHES WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS" These people were trying to introduce the bible as Truth! Not as any mythology class, Literary class, or anything else for that matter.
I have NEVER witnessed ANYONE trying to "force religion" on children in ANY school I've ever attended OR worked at ever.
E-V-E-R.

MOST people have FAR more sense than THAT extremeness.

And I don't slurp up any sort of "she said he said" either.

CITE and Prove your Written SOURCE, or just don't even bother...because I'll just deem it myself as garbage for the TRASH bins.
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

#112472 Sep 5, 2013
stuck in a lodi wrote:
<quoted text>
That has never been in question Jerry. What is in question is whether or not introducing religious classes as an elective in Public School is indeed breaking or defying the Constitution of the United States of America.
SistaNoneYa wrote:
<quoted text>
No that wasn't the issue either.
The issue WAS-(Verbatim)
"The bill calls for the Kentucky Board of Education to establish GUIDELINES for an ELECTIVE course on the Bible's literary structure and its influence on "literature, art, music, mores, oratory, and public policy."
Now, it also includes the mass hysteria Hystronics of the levels of idiocracy of illiterates, as shown very clearly, within this thread-- that has preceeded the original article of subject matter.
Duhhuh.


You are the one saying that I'm wrong Sista, So how about you cite Your Proof and Sources! Prove to me and everyone that the bill in question is now a reality! You can't, because it's not. I don't just comment about something unless I have done research on the matter and have sources and proof to back up my claims....UNLIKE YOU! you get half the story and then run with it as if you know all the details, Clearly you Don't, otherwise this bill would be a reality and a landmark of other suits would follow in every state to allow the same in their Public Schools!
SistaNoneYa

Brodhead, KY

#112473 Sep 5, 2013
stuck in a lodi wrote:
<quoted text> I actually don't have a problem with the Pledge being said in school. I deem the Pledge more along the lines of Patriotism or a Patriotic Poem rather than that of a Prayer. You are pledging allegiance to the flag,,,, not a god.
And btw-YOU have NO idea what I pledge allegiance to, or HOW I pray.

I was referencing and poking fun at a court case ABOUT the Patriotic Pledge of Allegiance and the PROBLEM that SOME (Not all) godless atheists have with it.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion on the Pledge, and the court case referenced, biut you are NOT entitled to say or asssume ANYTHING as far as what ANYONE else thinks. NO one does, Unless they have some sort of explicit interview rights to do so, in correct manner and exact quoted form of (or face LIABLE and Slander charges).

So as far as the rest of YOUR inane, INEPT babble--
I think YOU should just shut your Ignorant mouth posts, when it comes to OTHER things that YOU would have absolutely ZERO, Nada and NO idea about.
Fool.

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