Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Courier-Journal

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

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“I'll think about it.”

Since: Nov 07

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#112119
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text> Syria? Here's what I'd do...
Make them cease fire, Move the children out temporarily...
Another interesting fantasy from you. And you would do this HOW?
Call the Pres immediately! I'm sure he would love your input.
Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text> (Women are smart enough to leave on they're own, but choose to stay)
How dare you decide what someone half the world away is capable of.

Since you have never been an uneducated, impoverished, Middle Eastern female, I'm going to try to forgive your abyssmal ignornace.

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

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#112120
Sep 1, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
You were speaking of the BOM before, now we're moving to the Old Testament? Which debate table are we sitting at?
Gah... it's all mind candy. What difference if it's peppermint, butterscotch or horehound flavored? Go ahead - hike your chair up to the table and serve yourself a plateful.
but then

Manchester, KY

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#112121
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope not a moralist in the least, Not a Moral aspect to my position, no religious aspect, no touchy feely poor little children aspect... I am Against Unjustified homicide of Human Beings... I don't think we should kill off large populations to save the planet, We should not go out on the weekend for a night of frolic and shoot people in the head.... I place Human Life above all other life forms... Not for any haughty moral reason, just because I am Human and Humans make the rules... If Dogs made the rules then they would get to say dogs are above all other live forms...
Now I would have Zero argument if the US Justice system through the legal process of constitutional valid law sets a date and say Human Life begins at a specific date certain... Before that abortion would not be homicide and if someone kills a fetus in a DUI crash or by kicking a woman in the belly he would only be charge with a bodily injury, assault or what ever the appropriate charge would be and never charge with Homicide... And all prisoners that are in prison for killing a fetus younger than date set have all charges and sentences dropped and expunged from their records concerning homicide...
Until then I stand by my view that any and all homicides should individual require legal justification before the courts including everyone involved in the conspiracy to commit the homicide, Including financial providers... To me it is no difference that to receive money from someone so you can hire a hit man to kill someone... Under some circumstances that might be deemed Justifiable but should be before the courts on each individual event to be justified...
There is such a thing as killing in self defense. If someone is endangering your life you can kill them and not even be charged in some cases.

I am sure you agree that a woman should have the right to save her own life by having an abortion, at any stage, if it comes down to it.
Yes and Amen

Richmond, KY

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#112122
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Get over yourself... You made a blanket statement and it was wrong.. I only point to the facts of the matter and you cannot dispute those facts with rational argument and fall to calling me "thick"... At that point I figured any rational debate was over and I won so then I reserved the option of poking you with a stick... Your dogmatic adherence to your position and falling to ad hominem attack places you far closer to the religious zealots than I have ever been...
Oh SNAP!

“I'll think about it.”

Since: Nov 07

central Florida

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#112123
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>Reality? Yes!
You are going to die... Hope you get better than you deserve!
LOL! I have done nothing of which I am ashamed so guilt doesn't bother me.
I deserve a well-earned rest from this world and this body ...and will get one.
Nothingness. Sweet oblivion.
It's always tempting to say "I'm going to miss existance because it is so fascinating" but there won't be any *me* to miss anything.

You can't frighten me with your myth.
sistaNoneYaBiz

London, KY

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#112124
Sep 1, 2013
 

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but then wrote:
<quoted text>
There is such a thing as killing in self defense. If someone is endangering your life you can kill them and not even be charged in some cases.
I am sure you agree that a woman should have the right to save her own life by having an abortion, at any stage, if it comes down to it.
After 24 weeks, there's really NO excuse to even reference the word abortion.

Such would then become life saving procedures, not killing ones.

For decent folks anyway.

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

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#112125
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope not a moralist in the least, Not a Moral aspect to my position, no religious aspect, no touchy feely poor little children aspect... I am Against Unjustified homicide of Human Beings... I don't think we should kill off large populations to save the planet, We should not go out on the weekend for a night of frolic and shoot people in the head.... I place Human Life above all other life forms... Not for any haughty moral reason, just because I am Human and Humans make the rules... If Dogs made the rules then they would get to say dogs are above all other live forms...
Now I would have Zero argument if the US Justice system through the legal process of constitutional valid law sets a date and say Human Life begins at a specific date certain... Before that abortion would not be homicide and if someone kills a fetus in a DUI crash or by kicking a woman in the belly he would only be charge with a bodily injury, assault or what ever the appropriate charge would be and never charge with Homicide... And all prisoners that are in prison for killing a fetus younger than date set have all charges and sentences dropped and expunged from their records concerning homicide...
Until then I stand by my view that any and all homicides should individual require legal justification before the courts including everyone involved in the conspiracy to commit the homicide, Including financial providers... To me it is no difference that to receive money from someone so you can hire a hit man to kill someone... Under some circumstances that might be deemed Justifiable but should be before the courts on each individual event to be justified...
The majority of legislators do not listen to the majority of their constituents - much less represent them. Going with the argument that government and legislation is right because it's "the peoples' will" falls somewhere between wishful thinking and flat out bogus.
"We want to rip down your house and build a convenience store. Here's $20,000, get out."
"Well, the supreme court says that eminent domain domain by corporations is for the public good, let me grab my hat and keys."
Yes and Amen

Richmond, KY

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#112126
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
So I hear the GOP was absent from the list of speakers at the Washington mall anniversary MLK event. They were invited but declined.
Would you take your Dog to a Pig show???
None of them had ANYTHING good to say about How Good the Blacks have it today... they just want to increase hate!
Martin wouldn't have came either!
sistaNoneYaBiz

London, KY

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#112127
Sep 1, 2013
 

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aWitchintheWoods wrote:
<quoted text>
Another interesting fantasy from you. And you would do this HOW?
Call the Pres immediately! I'm sure he would love your input.
<quoted text>
How dare you decide what someone half the world away is capable of.
Since you have never been an uneducated, impoverished, Middle Eastern female, I'm going to try to forgive your abyssmal ignornace.
How dare a potus of the U.S. decided him shoulf be an infliciter of punishment on ANY ONE.
Sick in the head bas-tard.
Yes and Amen

Richmond, KY

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#112128
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>The main point is, it is what I got from the bible and thus I have no reason to be jealous of YaA.
But if you wish to prove me wrong, then go for it. Show where it says I must believe in the Jesus and follow what he says to have salvation?
John the Baptist saying
"Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world!"
And then...
EVERYTHING Jesus says!
SistaNoneYaBiz

London, KY

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#112129
Sep 1, 2013
 

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ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Gah... it's all mind candy. What difference if it's peppermint, butterscotch or horehound flavored? Go ahead - hike your chair up to the table and serve yourself a plateful.
Do duh plate comes with stalker judge it napkins to wipe duh chit up with?
SistaNoneYaBiz

London, KY

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#112130
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>Would you take your Dog to a Pig show???
None of them had ANYTHING good to say about How Good the Blacks have it today... they just want to increase hate!
Martin wouldn't have came either!
Yea, even some of his own were referencing that!

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#112131
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't see any evidence of this soul thing... My position is on a point of law... a fetus by definition is a Human Being in that if someone kicks a woman in the belly and kills her fetus as 3 weeks gestation they can be arrested, prosecuted, and convicted of homicide... Unjustifiable Homicide is the killing of a human being by another human being... Therefore the fetus by definition is a human being... So I am against the unjustified homicide of Any human being so I am Pro Life with the caveat of Legal Justification...
I disagree with your position on this because it seems like using a blunt tool to take care of a delicate problem.

Man kicks pregnant woman and kills fetus, man should be charged with some form of manslaughter or possibly murder. I agree. It is not his right to terminate that pregnancy.

Woman walks into Planned Parenthood and has an abortion. It ain't your business, nor mine. It was her body and the potential person growing inside her was 100% her possession from top to bottom.

I don't see a problem with this. The clear difference here is the choice of the woman, not the definition of what a human being is. That only becomes relevant when her right to choose has been taken away, then we can clearly say that the kicker has killed a human being.

If this leads to some weird situation that perhaps evades consideration and we can all mostly agree that it requires special treatment then we can amend our laws to deal with it. That's the hard part of governing 300+ million people...it ain't easy.

Now, I do accept that there is an issue with suffering here that needs to be addressed. I feel like if we can demonstrate clearly, with solid science, that a fetus is "conscious" and capable of experiencing pain and suffering then the rights of the mother to abort might need to be limited. I think that is reasonable, from a moral perspective. The problem is our ability to detect it is limited. We can give it a window of a few weeks in which consciousness begins, realistically...I think its between 24-28. And nearly all abortions are actually done prior to that window anyway.

Complex topic. We've hit this one a few times on this thread, I think. Nobody agrees and I doubt they ever will.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#112132
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EmpAtheist wrote:
I am pro choice.... But I understand the concern depending what you feel is important between a possible soul and when a fetus receives it... A nervous system and when it receives it... When it is technically a human... Or maybe just the idea that it will eventually become a thinking breathing human being.
I'm interested in what everyone thinks in detail.
I replied to Q on this but basically it's the woman's choice. Ultimately it has to be the woman's choice since she is the only person who necessarily has to endure the rigors of pregnancy and have her life permanently altered as a result.

The man can walk away, as many do. Laws requiring him to do anything at all cannot match what the woman is required to do.

And there are a host of other arguments in support of the right to choose, such as the reduction of poverty and crime.

The main thing is to be sensitive of suffering, both of the woman and potential child. And that's the really hard part.

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#112133
Sep 1, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course He had reason to create us. Just like the reason we have children: to continue our species and have joy with a family. We are His children. We know our children are going to mess up, a lot, but that doesn't keep us from having children. We know they will be exposed to even more crap than we were exposed to, but we choose to have children anyway. I'm not sure where your logic is in that statement.
Why is my position irrational just because you can't refute it, or understand it?
You are God's child, whether you accept it or not.
Your position is irrational because you posit a magical being that you cannot demonstrate to be true. If your position was tentative I would not find you irrational. If you said "I hope there is a god" then I could accept that. But "There is a god, whether or you accept it or not" is irrational. You have not demonstrated the truth of it.

Also, as we discussed before, the parent analogy is not accurate. God is perfect, we are far from perfect. But no parent is perfect. Kids are humans that come from humans. We have the DNA to demonstrate it.

Again, where is god's DNA? Show me that, then we can talk.

I'll go out on a limb here and say that your particular version of god is...weird. I've encountered a ton of theology and this idea that god is physical, has a body, is imperfect...is not standard. At all. You are arguing for a magical entity that is not all powerful. And I think that is going to be the hardest possible version of god for you to justify. Such a god would by all measures of logic leave some kind of trail we could follow to discover it.

And not a faith trail. I'm talking about hard evidence. Show me that.

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Since: Dec 11

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#112134
Sep 1, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Wasn't about politics, it was about furthering the church and building Zion in preparation for the return of Jesus Christ. Plural marriage served its purpose at that time and was no longer necessary. Nor do I think the majority could practice it without lust interfering (my opinion).
It isn't that surprising to me that they had to move away from persecution and set up house in the middle of a desert, and still people jacked with them. It's pretty similar to Moses' story. God could have killed all the Egyptians and let the Hebrews stay there and kick their feet up in homes already built. God doesn't have a history of handing things over to the saints with no effort of their own. Again I think it is because they wouldn't appreciate it as much.
Oh, I totally agree that Mormons were persecuted by the mainstream religious community (everyone else, basically). I don't think they should have had their stuff taken away or put in jail for plural marriage or any of that nonsense.

But I do think you are willfully ignoring the glaringly obvious fact that "revelations" seem to be meaningless and powerless in the face of political/legal assault. And I think that stands as strong evidence that god is not real and "prophets" are full of crap.

You want your religion to be true. But you also want to be a rational person. So you rationalize. If it is embarrassing that the LDS was racist until the Civil Rights movement then they suddenly got a message from god to not be racist anymore...well that's just human error. If plural marriage was god's law until the law of the land said no...then another revelation says no more plural marriage...well that's just a necessity of building "zion". And when someone says an ear healed magically, well that's gods power.

Can you not even concede that we can describe all this stuff very easily with no appeals whatsoever to god or magic?

Racism was rampant in the LDS because it was rampant everywhere anyway. It changed its position when the social pressure became too strong to resist, just like every other institution.

Plural marriage was ended because it became a lethal liability to the further existence of the church itself. It was a rational move to make. You don't need to infer a divine decree.

The ear was never dangling by a shred of skin and it never healed suddenly in moments. People involved were simply mistaken and not remembering it correctly, which is entirely consistent with all psychological research on memory.

Why posit a supernatural element at all?

That's what I mean by "irrational".

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Since: Dec 11

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#112135
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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
You are not able to see that this is not superstition for others. It may be to you, but not to the people that it offends. You obviously missed my point.
No, the world does not need more profanity. It does not need more hate. It does not need more things to steer children wrong or desensitize them. It doesn't need more sex on regular prime time TV. It doesn't need more people that smoke in restaurants while you are trying to eat.
The attitude you have about this subject means you don't care what offends others so you are just going to be offensive wherever you want. This is selfish. If that's what you want to be, no one can stop you. Go for it. I give up.
With this mentality, nudists should have the right to do their thing in Walmart.
My opinion is that people should be considerate of others, and friendly, as this tends to brighten people's day. I believe there should be a broad effort to be nicer to those we come in contact with. Sorry you don't agree.
Well, I already said that I don't actually go around cussing at people. lol, that would be funny.

No, I don't do that. I use a degree of "foul" language consistent with my own style and the company I am with. Among good friends I talk freely and casually. If I'm with an elderly person I am very polite. At work I'm totally restrained in my conversation and I actually get uncomfortable when religion and politics are brought up. I think its inappropriate.

But in an online casual forum the kid gloves are off. If you are offended by what you read, then don't read.

I think the word game threads are dumb so I don't read them. But I don't pop in and say "You're being stupid".
Yes and Amen

Richmond, KY

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#112136
Sep 1, 2013
 

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Spaceship earth wrote:
<quoted text>
Hi LOL, peace be with you also.
"peace be with you also"
This is the part everyone forgets about!

“Question, Explore, Discover”

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#112137
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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I spent 3 semesters in Chemistry labs too, and had several biology and physics classes too, but that doesn't make me a scientist.
Sorry, but I've seen your interpretations of Bible stories. Remember?
The scriptures were not meant to be confusing and vague. This was the effect of Satan's influence to confuse people and lead God's children astray. Hence the need for a prophet to clarify and rectify.
So you can't talk about chemistry or biology or physics? You lack the ability to even have the conversation? Seriously?

And you think the reason the Bible is contradictory, confusing, and all over the map is because the devil did it?

Are you starting to see why this is irrational now?

Also...what kind of wussy does that make god? He has ONE METHOD for reaching us: his word. And he lets a fallen angel f*ck it up? He cast this guy out of heaven and down into hell. Yet he can't seem to stop him from mucking up the eternal Word? Not just once, but over the course of 1000+ years in which the books of the Bible were actually scrawled down?

Weak, weak sauce.

This is called rationalization. Look it up. It is not the same as *being rational*. Folks in the middle ages rationalized burning or hanging witches (they were evil, they cast spells on people, the church is OK with it, etc). Were they being rational?
Yes and Amen

Richmond, KY

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EmpAtheist wrote:
I am pro choice.... But I understand the concern depending what you feel is important between a possible soul and when a fetus receives it... A nervous system and when it receives it... When it is technically a human... Or maybe just the idea that it will eventually become a thinking breathing human being.
I'm interested in what everyone thinks in detail.
What I think... When the sperm hits the egg!
If we didn't make sex our god (we see what sexual depravity reigns in) People would wait for marriage to start a family!

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