Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 Full story: The Courier-Journal 131,858

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

Full Story
SistaNoneYa

London, KY

#112146 Sep 1, 2013
Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>Doesn't matter...
IF their holy book says to lie, and kill people...
you get Ft Hood, Boston, 9/11....
List goes on!
They all read from the same book...
Search for pictures of Muslims celebrating the towers coming
down on 9/11...
God is God, and I'm sure He doesn't want us to kill each other
UN-Justified!
Yer preaching to the chior YaA.

Discernment is a wonderful thing.
SistaNoneYa

London, KY

#112147 Sep 1, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Not in My culture, in some cultures it's considered rude and as crass to draw a picture of Mohomid with a bomb on his head, Glad I don't live in such a culture....
It's considered beyond rude in stone age, cultures of anarchy that would rather lob bombs, live in caves and act like totally uncivilized dirtbag rabid animals.

As for NOT living in That kind of dark stone age, uncouth, non-culture of depravity and ignorance-Me too.

Potty mouth.

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Nancy, KY

#112148 Sep 1, 2013
but then wrote:
<quoted text>
There is such a thing as killing in self defense. If someone is endangering your life you can kill them and not even be charged in some cases.
I am sure you agree that a woman should have the right to save her own life by having an abortion, at any stage, if it comes down to it.
I stated clearly I have no problem what so ever with Justifiable Homicide... I have a problem with Homicide for personal convenience.... There may be many reasons to commit homicide that make it justifiable but the one committing the homicide is not the one that should be allowed to determine what is or is not justifiable because some people can justify anything... Chuck Manson thought he was justified in starting a race war by slicing a baby out of a white girls belly.... Some people think they are justified in setting bombs at abortion clinics.... Some people think it's justified to exterminate whole populations to save the earth...

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#112149 Sep 1, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>Stuff like this:

"The Book of Mormon mentions several animals, plants, and technologies for which there is no evidence in pre-Columbian America. These include asses, cattle, milk, horses,[7][8] oxen, sheep, swine, goats, elephants,[9] wheat,[10] barley,[11][12][13][14] figs,[15] silk,[16] steel,[17] bellows, brass, breast plates, chains, iron working,[18] plows, swords, scimitars, and chariots.[19] The Smithsonian Institution has stated that "none of the principal food plants and domestic animals of the Old World (except the dog) were present in the New World before Columbus."[20][21]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_authe...

There is nothing in the BoM that could not have been written by Smith and perhaps a collaborator or two. Nothing in it is inexplicable in that light. And in fact the most rational way to explain it is to say that it was invented by Smith and perhaps a collaborator or two.

It is irrational to assume the book is anything other than that.

Now you can certainly believe otherwise but you are firmly in a minority of intellectual opinion.
Hmmm

http://www.fairlds.org/authors/ash-michael/ar...
SistaNoneYa

London, KY

#112150 Sep 1, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
You are of course wrong in that I can and did speak with my whole opinion and is based 100 percent on the reality I see... With the added aspect of delusional mindset...
And I absolutely have some idea of the other half, You see I have heard the arguments, spoken to the other half and based my view partly due to those arguments....
It should never be in place to be viewed as any sort of easy access birth control means.

Rather a dire measure, for myriads of reasons...really uncalled for after 24 weeks or so though. SHOULD be a totally different perspective after that.

I don't get the depraved femnazi warcry on anything beyond that time frame. Sick in the head stuff then.

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Nancy, KY

#112151 Sep 1, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
The majority of legislators do not listen to the majority of their constituents - much less represent them. Going with the argument that government and legislation is right because it's "the peoples' will" falls somewhere between wishful thinking and flat out bogus.
"We want to rip down your house and build a convenience store. Here's $20,000, get out."
"Well, the supreme court says that eminent domain domain by corporations is for the public good, let me grab my hat and keys."
I don't disagree that our present government and some of it's laws are crap... But We The People elect it and We the People get the Government We Deserve... I much rather have a flawed government that can be voted out than no government or one that can't be voted out...

Start a grass roots movement and get enough people on your side and you can attempt to get those laws changed... Oh wait One of the issues another grass roots org has is to reform the eminent domain laws and go back to a Constitutional Governance where the Individual has more freedom from such liberal ideas as Eminent Domain... The Very policies that places Individual Power in the hands of the Government you adore is why it's used by the government you abhor...

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Nancy, KY

#112152 Sep 1, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
I disagree with your position on this because it seems like using a blunt tool to take care of a delicate problem.
Man kicks pregnant woman and kills fetus, man should be charged with some form of manslaughter or possibly murder. I agree. It is not his right to terminate that pregnancy.
Woman walks into Planned Parenthood and has an abortion. It ain't your business, nor mine. It was her body and the potential person growing inside her was 100% her possession from top to bottom.
I don't see a problem with this. The clear difference here is the choice of the woman, not the definition of what a human being is. That only becomes relevant when her right to choose has been taken away, then we can clearly say that the kicker has killed a human being.
If this leads to some weird situation that perhaps evades consideration and we can all mostly agree that it requires special treatment then we can amend our laws to deal with it. That's the hard part of governing 300+ million people...it ain't easy.
Now, I do accept that there is an issue with suffering here that needs to be addressed. I feel like if we can demonstrate clearly, with solid science, that a fetus is "conscious" and capable of experiencing pain and suffering then the rights of the mother to abort might need to be limited. I think that is reasonable, from a moral perspective. The problem is our ability to detect it is limited. We can give it a window of a few weeks in which consciousness begins, realistically...I think its between 24-28. And nearly all abortions are actually done prior to that window anyway.
Complex topic. We've hit this one a few times on this thread, I think. Nobody agrees and I doubt they ever will.
I understand your view just disagree with it... If Man kicks woman in belly and can be charged with Homicide then the Human Being in her belly is just that a Human Being... And All Human Beings have a Constitutional Right to Life... And the Homicide of Any Human being is My business...

I have heard all the rationalizations ever given for a womans right to choose... But I stand by my view that one anyone is given the standing of Human Being they also gain the constitutional protections of a Human being...

A fetus is or is not a Human Being... Once it is given standing as a Human Being then Homicide of it should be individual justified in a court of law...

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Nancy, KY

#112153 Sep 1, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
I replied to Q on this but basically it's the woman's choice. Ultimately it has to be the woman's choice since she is the only person who necessarily has to endure the rigors of pregnancy and have her life permanently altered as a result.
The man can walk away, as many do. Laws requiring him to do anything at all cannot match what the woman is required to do.
And there are a host of other arguments in support of the right to choose, such as the reduction of poverty and crime.
The main thing is to be sensitive of suffering, both of the woman and potential child. And that's the really hard part.
By your reasoning then maybe we should let the woman choose to retroactively kill her 12 year old or her 10 kids by 8 baby daddies... Since "there are a host of other arguments in support of the right to choose, such as the reduction of poverty and crime."

And heck that woman didn't really understand the suffering she and her kids would be going through 12 years down the line when the father up and splits and leaves them on the street...

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Nancy, KY

#112154 Sep 1, 2013
SistaNoneYa wrote:
<quoted text>
It's considered beyond rude in stone age, cultures of anarchy that would rather lob bombs, live in caves and act like totally uncivilized dirtbag rabid animals.
As for NOT living in That kind of dark stone age, uncouth, non-culture of depravity and ignorance-Me too.
Potty mouth.
And you don't see the hypocrisy in calling me a name aimed directly at me that I may considered an insult, uncouth, non-cultured but want me to give a rats ass that god dammit might bother your self assumed fanaticism....
stuck in a lodi

Pikeville, KY

#112155 Sep 1, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand your view just disagree with it... If Man kicks woman in belly and can be charged with Homicide then the Human Being in her belly is just that a Human Being... And All Human Beings have a Constitutional Right to Life... And the Homicide of Any Human being is My business...
I have heard all the rationalizations ever given for a womans right to choose... But I stand by my view that one anyone is given the standing of Human Being they also gain the constitutional protections of a Human being...
A fetus is or is not a Human Being... Once it is given standing as a Human Being then Homicide of it should be individual justified in a court of law...
Fetal Homicide is currently recognized in 38 states in some form or another. For instance Kentucky...Ky. Rev. Stat.§ 507A.010 et seq.(2004) define "unborn child" as a member of the species Homo sapiens in utero from conception onward, without regard to age, health or condition of dependency. The laws define fetal homicide in the first, second, third, and fourth degrees. These laws do not apply to acts performed during any abortion for which the consent of the pregnant woman has been obtained or for which the consent is implied by law in a medical emergency.(2004 HB 108)NOTE:: These laws do not interfere with the womans right to choose abortion!
stuck in a lodi

Pikeville, KY

#112156 Sep 1, 2013
Q: you know damn well Y is not arguing that point. so why are you pretending to be so patois.
"Q wrote"
By your reasoning then maybe we should let the woman choose to retroactively kill her 12 year old or her 10 kids by 8 baby daddies... Since "there are a host of other arguments in support of the right to choose, such as the reduction of poverty and crime."

And heck that woman didn't really understand the suffering she and her kids would be going through 12 years down the line when the father up and splits and leaves them on the street...

Since: Feb 12

Roseville, CA

#112157 Sep 1, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I only worship one God. He is the Father of us all, including Jesus Christ. I worship Jesus Christ as well because He is the Son of God and atoned for my sins and made it possible to return to our Father in Heaven. The Holy Ghost I do not worship, but commune with frequently. He is the Spirit that has the responsibilities to witness to all that Jesus is the Son of God and that God lives, as well as confirm gospel truth to us, and comfort us.
Jesus was a spirit before coming to earth and gaining His physical body, just like you and me. One cannot be exalted unless he has a physical body, as Jesus demonstrated. And since all those that are saved will be joint heirs with Christ, it only makes sense that we can be exalted too if we follow all the commandments and repent of our sins.
You misunderstand the last quote. Flesh and bone alone can't enter Heaven, but we all will be resurrected which means we receive our bodies back (glorified). This means our spirit and body can go to Heaven.
I don't see the case that you attempted to show evidence that the Holy Spirit talk about in the bible is a person. I know that the bible personifies the Holy Spirit to make the case for the trinity or because it is a gift or power being given one so therefore is rendered uppercase. See how spirit is use in this case, one spirit is evil and small caps and other spirit is good in uppercase.

1 Corinthians 2:12

What we have received is not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may understand what God has freely given us. See how the word spirit can be personified without claiming it is a person.

What is freely given is a gift or power to understand God. The word spirit can be translated either in Caps or no Caps depending on the scholars theology and beliefs. It is subjective and not emphatic enough to claim that the Holy Spirit is a person.

4151 pneśma – properly, spirit (Spirit), wind, or breath. The most frequent meaning (translation) of 4151 (pneśma) in the NT is "spirit" ("Spirit"). Only the context however determines which sense(s) is meant.

[Any of the above renderings (spirit-Spirit, wind, breath) of 4151 (pneśma) is always theoretically possible (spirit, Spirit, wind, breath). But when the attributive adjective ("holy") is used, it always refers to the Holy Spirit. "Spirit" ("spirit") is by far the most common translation (application) of 4151 (pneśma).
http://biblesuite.com/greek/4151.htm

The biblical evidence of no flesh in heaven is very emphatic. Can you show evidence that will contradict the following?

1 Corinthians 15:50
What I am saying, dear brothers and sisters, is that our physical bodies cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. These dying bodies cannot inherit what will last forever.

Flesh and bones living in Heaven please show biblical evidence that supports that claim.
Nephilim

Somerset, KY

#112158 Sep 1, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand your view just disagree with it... If Man kicks woman in belly and can be charged with Homicide then the Human Being in her belly is just that a Human Being... And All Human Beings have a Constitutional Right to Life... And the Homicide of Any Human being is My business...
I have heard all the rationalizations ever given for a womans right to choose... But I stand by my view that one anyone is given the standing of Human Being they also gain the constitutional protections of a Human being...
A fetus is or is not a Human Being... Once it is given standing as a Human Being then Homicide of it should be individual justified in a court of law...
Wouldn't that be kind of be like saying sex should be illegal because it's the same thing as rape and the only difference between sex and rape is the woman giving permission? If a guy kicks a pregnant woman and she was going to keep the baby then yeah, he should be charged. If the woman was on her way to the abortion clinic and told the judge that, then the guy probably wouldn't be charged with murder.

You mentioned mothers killing their 12 year olds but on the other side, are we going to try and make it illegal to masturbate since sperm is a potential life? Both sides of that reasoning just seems way out in left field to me.

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#112159 Sep 1, 2013
The whole point of the issue..
not the best idea to invite people for a funeral to your home and point your guns at them when they come to the door..

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#112160 Sep 1, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand your view just disagree with it... If Man kicks woman in belly and can be charged with Homicide then the Human Being in her belly is just that a Human Being... And All Human Beings have a Constitutional Right to Life... And the Homicide of Any Human being is My business...
I have heard all the rationalizations ever given for a womans right to choose... But I stand by my view that one anyone is given the standing of Human Being they also gain the constitutional protections of a Human being...
A fetus is or is not a Human Being... Once it is given standing as a Human Being then Homicide of it should be individual justified in a court of law...
Like I said many times, its a messy topic. A fetus is clearly a human being. But if it has no consciousness then there is no person yet. It is still biologically a part of the mother's body and should be hers to maintain or terminate per her will. Not per your will or mine. That is a clear, logical, and moral stance to take on this issue.

We don't simply allow the definitions of words dictate how we treat each other.

Also, in another post you suggested that my logic would allow a mother to murder her kids at age 11 or more. That's silly. I never said anything to that effect and I find the idea repugnant. Once a child is born it is fully invested with all the rights we grant to any other human being.

The point I was making with the other post was to say that there are many facets to the conversation and the correlation of reproductive rights and reduction of poverty and crime is a matter of fact.

When you give people the power to control their own futures it is a net good.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#112161 Sep 1, 2013
do whut wrote:
Why are you linking me to Mormon Apologetics?

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#112162 Sep 1, 2013
do whut wrote:
Oh my god, dude. I read through that article. It is a tour-de-force of apologetics. The author makes so many acrobatic mental maneouvers my head is spinning.

He mentions some kind of altar with "NHM" on it in the Old World. Then leads to the possibility that this is in reference to "Nahom" (whatever that is). I assume that's something from the BoM. But why on earth would you make that leap? It is a vague, and very weak idea. And if this is the best you have you are truly desperate.

I also strongly question some of the things this guy says as being factual. I will have to give this a once-over because it reeks of crazy.

In my spare time, that is. And I do NOT have much spare time to debunk Mormon crazy.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#112163 Sep 1, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Different people. Different times. Different laws.
Of course Moses was against freedom of religion. He freed the Hebrews, who were all worshipers of The Lord. It's not like he freed a diverse set of people mixed with different religious backgrounds. This is not the same as Muslims killing Christians. Im not sure how you see it that way. They didn't invade another territory and wage war.
This was a group that all believed the same, and then decided to change when Moses didn't come back for a while. These were some weak people that were ready to change beliefs to whatever whim hit them next. This is why they could not follow the higher law.
You never fail to blow me away with this line of reasoning.

It is EXACTLY like Muslims murdering Christians! Muslims murder anyone who converts from Islam to Christianity. It is(or was) legal in Afghanistan. Bush had to pressure them not to do it once. No invasion need be part of the reason. It is EXACTLY like Moses murdering those who believed DIFFERENT than he.

They obviously did not all worship the same god. If they did, why worship a calf? Learn some history please. The bull (Taurus) was worshiped back in the old times. People tend to worship what they helped them become a civilization. The bull is the animal man domesticated to help him work the fields. I am sure many of the "chosen people" just adopted the gods of the day. This is what people do. They blindly worship the gods of their peers.
Moses was trying to ensure their was no diversity of religion. He did this by murdering those who were different.
Again, if their was no diversity, then why did Moses murder 3,000 men women and children that day?
The laws of your god then, are wrong for today, and they were wrong for the old days. They were just plain immoral and barbaric.

Now lets address your insane reasoning of why their should be different standards in different times.
People of those days had the same brain as humans do today. Do you disagree with this?
So if they had the same mental capabilities of learning, then why did your god not teach them the same as people being taught today?

Just what teachings could the people back then, not be able to comprehend?
I know your god is a poor teacher, as he does not even know the "teach by example" rule of thumb. But is this why he failed to even try to teach the "Chosen people" the new ways?

I bring up the Moses murders to many people who question why I do not believe in the bible. Most do not even know about the murders. When I enlighten them, they really get taken aback. I will even tell them of the textbook Christian apologetic, the one you cite now. They never see it as a logical or moral reason to kill.
Thus it is an unjustified killing in many persons eyes. It is murder in the eyes of many people.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#112164 Sep 1, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Wasn't about politics, it was about furthering the church and building Zion in preparation for the return of Jesus Christ. Plural marriage served its purpose at that time and was no longer necessary. Nor do I think the majority could practice it without lust interfering (my opinion).
It isn't that surprising to me that they had to move away from persecution and set up house in the middle of a desert, and still people jacked with them. It's pretty similar to Moses' story. God could have killed all the Egyptians and let the Hebrews stay there and kick their feet up in homes already built. God doesn't have a history of handing things over to the saints with no effort of their own. Again I think it is because they wouldn't appreciate it as much.
Correct, god does not hand anything over to anyone. If your people want a land, they just have to murder the inhabitants themselves. And they did as the bible tells. It is a book justifying the murder of people in a land to clear it for other people of other superstitions.

The practice continued for the next two thousand years after the bible was written.
People learn by example. Now why does your god not know this?

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#112165 Sep 1, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I spent 3 semesters in Chemistry labs too, and had several biology and physics classes too, but that doesn't make me a scientist.
Sorry, but I've seen your interpretations of Bible stories. Remember?
The scriptures were not meant to be confusing and vague. This was the effect of Satan's influence to confuse people and lead God's children astray. Hence the need for a prophet to clarify and rectify.
So the devil made the bible so screwed up? I have not heard this EXCUSE before. Blame the devil for all problems. Thank god for all good things.
It is a pretty good excuse for the leaders to come up with. It gets them off the hook. Brilliant. Unbelievably people still today are falling prey to this line. Really makes me sad for mankind.

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