Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Courier-Journal

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

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#111815
Aug 27, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>BTW, poor example here of the cop. If I have been pulled over, then I am likely to be guilty of something. So you are changing the paradigm unfairly.
In the cases here, some theists are being over the top offensive to us, so again, the cop analogy is off.
But I have already acknowledged much language that is offensive is not the way one should go.
So I changed it later. You walk into a restaurant and see a cop having dinner. Go use some profanity in front of him. Tell us what happens.

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#111816
Aug 27, 2013
 

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sarah b wrote:
<quoted text>I'm not the smartest person but logically, I feel atheist are the minority but right. We don't know but really if a GOD is so cruel and the people that believe are going to heaven, not trying to be rude but... You curious, so whatever, and the rest are the last people I want to spend eternity with. I know that sounds bad but the things I think are so wrong Christians seem to not care about. You know like everyone in the world, starving children, or the fact that so many people in our own country are hurting. I mean really?, it's the pour single mothers fault our country is messed up but let employees strike against mcds. Then screw them those jobs belong to our kids. Honestly your Jesus would have been a liberal and that fact you don't give a crap about taking care of his land or the starving children in it makes you an ax hole.
I'm not sure where this is coming from or even if I understood all that you said, but it sounds like you are assuming I don't help others around me?

“Question, Explore, Discover”

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#111817
Aug 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Please support your claim
Sure.

1887 Edmunds-Tucker Act

"The act disincorporated both the LDS Church and the Perpetual Emigration Fund on the grounds that they fostered polygamy. The act prohibited the practice of polygamy and punished it with a fine of from $500 to $800 and imprisonment of up to five years. It dissolved the corporation of the church and directed the confiscation by the federal government of all church properties valued over a limit of $50,000. The act was enforced by the U.S. Marshal and a host of deputies."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmunds%E2%80%93...

In 1890, 3 years later, the Mormon Church leader amazing had a revelation that they should stop practicing polygamy.

Of course they didn't. But by gosh in 1904 they did.

Now don't get me wrong here. I don't really care if you practice polygamy or not and I don't think the government had much business banning it or seizing church property, personally.

But it is funny how the LDS buckled when sh*t got real in the wallet.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

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#111818
Aug 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
This is rationalization.
With this mentality is along the lines of the different meanings of the words I hate you.
Think about the difference between you saying to your child with a sober tone "I hate you", and a teenage girl in her best valley girl voice "you have pink nail polish too? I hate you" giggle giggle.
Are you saying that when I say "god dammit" I am hurting you like I might hurt a child by saying "I hate you"?

Surely you have heard the phrase a few times. And since I am an atheist it really is a meaningless thing for me to say anyway.

I assure you it is harmless.

Since: Aug 13

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#111819
Aug 27, 2013
 

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As an atheist, and a previously homeschooling parent, I personally taught my son about world religions - but from an academic POV. We looked at the anthropological and sociological impacts of faith and religion (which are in fact different animals), as well as the psychological. When my son was at a Catholic HS, his RE teacher was astounded an atheist child had a good grasp of the Bible, and also the Torah and the Qur'an. He was able to debate various points of view when the Bible was discussed in class, and the teacher was impressed that he knew more than many of his Catholic classmates who had been brought up in the Church. To him, it was simply an academic subject - it certainly didn't take belief in God for him to get good grades in this class.

IMO, however, Religious Education as a subject should be totally left out of public schools. Let the families and churches of the students teach their children faith in their own time, not the taxpayers'.

As for religious schools - my son has been bullied in them for being atheist - to the extent that he had to leave two schools due to it apparently being okay to torment and bully a child for not believing in God. And teachers did this, not just children. So anyone who thinks that having religious education in schools makes them better is deluded.
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

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#111820
Aug 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
So I changed it later. You walk into a restaurant and see a cop having dinner. Go use some profanity in front of him. Tell us what happens.
I watched this on t.v. quite some time ago that showed a police officer issueing a ticket to a speeder. When the officer handed the ticket to the driver he began cursing and screaming like a nut, ripped up the ticket in front of the officer and threw in on the ground, all the while still cursing. The police officer, at no point, ever raised his voice and calmly told the driver he would also issue him a ticket for litering if he did not pick up every torn piece of paper he just threw on the ground, which of course the driver did. The officer never advised the driver to refrain from cursing at any time. After the driver picked all the torn pieces up, the Cop told him he was free to go and have a nice day! The irate driver drove off.

My point is... this guy was using profanity in almost every word and yet the cop did nothing...So what do you think would happen?
The liberal use of profanity is not breaking any laws that I'm aware of
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

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#111821
Aug 27, 2013
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
I found it.... here it is... Funny as hell!
SistaNoneYa

Manchester, KY

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#111822
Aug 27, 2013
 

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aWitchintheWoods wrote:
<quoted text>
Though no one referred to you, you simply HAD TO assert your "manhood," didn't you?
Please put it back in your pants so I can stop laughing.
I kept my self protection in my Catholic good girl knee socks, you clueless, stupid ignowitch.
SistaNoneYa

Manchester, KY

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#111823
Aug 27, 2013
 

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havent forgotten wrote:
this was to that silly sista person. Maybe it could be a female trying to be a macho type too. unfortunately too many females now try to act that way. if people are going to imitate the worst behavior of the other gender, I think I would prefer a gorgeous male willing to look like a sex object - preferably on a tv or movie screen or a magazine cover or something equally distant. though not Scott Brown, who is neither gorgeous nor sexy. <quoted text>
No...that was REALITY of keeping safe on the STREETS.

Going to and from honest, ethical, decent AND MORAL above the table WORK...in the REAL WORLD, not your make believe, rather perverted sounding one.
SistaNoneYa

Manchester, KY

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#111824
Aug 27, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>You did not address my main point. The class is favored over all other religions, thus is in direct defiance of the Constitution. Being an elective does not take it out of favoritism.
My post was a rebuttal to prayer in schools, not the main topic of this thread and you butted in. So get the facts straight.
Prayer in school is being protested by many secular Christians and other faiths, but of course you are in denial of this fact.
But even if atheists were the only ones offended, what does it matter? Is the constitution protecting the majority or the minority?
I personally opposed prayer in school when I was still a Christian. I was a secular Christian. Do you know what secularism is? It is the way of our founders. It is what our country is based upon in the realm of religion.
So you admit, you got distorted off topic by the hyped hysteria.

There's hope for you still then.

Do you know what the Constitution is, and comprehend it(including the Ammendments)?

If so, Did you notice it being breached yet AGAIN this week?

Disgusting.
SistaNoneYa

Manchester, KY

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#111825
Aug 27, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Again, broad stoke accusations with no evidence. The post you responded to has nothing to do with what you just said.
And did I ever claim the bible had no wisdom in it? Nope. So I am not sure who you are talking to.
Did I claim to avoid the bible? Nope.
Do I think claiming, illness is due to demon infestation, is a dangerous thing to do? Yes.
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>So Jesus (your Christ) is your role model. So you follow the role model that treats ailments as a demon infestation?
I hope you use modern knowledge and history to determine your philosophy instead of blindly following some if the ignorant things Jesus said in the bible.
Some illness do give the appearances of being seriously evil.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#111826
Aug 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I backed away from almost everything I believed at one time and investigated tons of different religions as open minded as I knew how. I sought truth for years. I'm not opposed to challenging my own beliefs and have done so several times. And I don't always find every answer that I seek. Of course my current religion has origins that are newer than most so it is easy to find concerns. Some have quick answers, some have unsettling answers, and some have no straightforward answer. But faith is not science. I don't expect there to be a test with data filled conclusions for everything. The Holy Ghost does exist and one of His main purposes is to bring us peace when we need it. Another purpose is to confirm God's gospel truths. Once I decided to study the doctrine of the LDS church, I did not find what I expected to find. Having my mind made up that it was a cult, I had no intentions of this investigation taking long at all. Instead I found answers that made sense that filled in the gaps that I thought existed in the Biblical interpretations of other denominations. I found that the Spirit was strong when I pressed to learn more. To make a long story short, I still did not want to join the church because of what I had always heard, and because my family thoroughly disapproved.
I do feel like I took what you call an outsiders test. Including researching Islam. So I answer based on what I have learned and experienced. I am firm in my faith, as you should expect by now, so maybe my answers appear that I am closed off to other suggestions. But that is not the case. So though I can't always answer everything that challenges my religion, or sometimes things look bad in the church's history, that doesn't change that the doctrine I believe in has proven itself much closer to what I think God intended, than anything else I have studied.
I only conclude you refuse to take the outsiders test is due to your constant refusal to do so in specific posts I make.
I have been specific about them and now you cite your life long ago as if you are done testing.
As I said, one must constantly be taking the outsiders test. Their is no end to it. If you skip questions, you are only cheating yourself and the test fails.

Now may I ask, does your family refuse to listen to the Holy Ghost? If not, then why are they not getting the memo?
SistaNoneYa

Manchester, KY

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#111827
Aug 27, 2013
 

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stuck in a lodi wrote:
<quoted text> He's already said that ... Remember, He said god told him Obama was the Anti-Christ.
Are there any impeachment papers yet? Impeach the anti-Christ!

(and a few other INEPT commie-regimish, Constitutional breaching, nation dividing, race-baiting, non law abiding THUGS as well!)

"BRING THE TROOPS HOME"

NO MORE (jihad for suckers) WARS!!!
SistaNoneYa

Manchester, KY

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#111828
Aug 27, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
You may be a very nice person and very sincere. But I don't understand half of what you post.
Who is "derwood"?
Snark (@ the television sitcom level Mentality)-for Darwin.

Because those now wayyyyy outdated, ignorant third grade level Ape pictographs should be ILLEGAL.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#111829
Aug 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Fully agree, because you aren't God and should not determine if a person should die or not. Now if you decided to build billions of little robots and had them become self-aware and a couple hundred of them liked the idea of the terminator movies and decided to arm themselves and wipe you out, or destroy all your plans for them, I would understand you pulling their power source.
Again, the OT laws were instituted after the people became so wicked that they could not live the higher laws so the lesser, more carnal laws were given, and punishments instituted. God also decided to let them have kings and judges because they could not live the higher laws. He had Moses allow divorce as well because they couldn't live marriage properly.
The NT brought back the higher laws and Jesus taught us to leave the judging of sin to God. So that's why we no longer practice eye for an eye.
First, it makes no logical sense that people of those times could not follow the philosophy you follow now.

Now lets keep in mind, humans learn by example.
So this tale being in the bible is highly likely to be teaching one to murder in mass. We know by history it has happened. We know by reading the bible Moses took it upon himself to have troops kill the innocent kids and women many times.

You have your apologetics down pretty well, but it still does not cut the mustard with reality.

If I was all powerful and a robot builder, I would not need to murder my robots, I would just reprogram them with my words as I did the first time.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#111830
Aug 27, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I certainly see your point, but in the case of the flood, God made the judgment. In 9/11, Bin Laden judged.
A friend of mine made a point to me one time that made me think. Since we believe that Jesus is the Jehovah of the OT, he said that he could see how Jesus matured from the OT to the NT. He was a jealous God in the OT, and forgiving in the NT. He has a point too.
So the mass murdering god that was jealous like an immature person is now all grown up and has learned how to be moral? Then the god is far from the being I would look to for moral perfection. I would follow no mass murderer, even if he found the error of his ways. But as you claim, the murders were moral in his eyes.

And of course Bin Laden follow the example of his god, as one should know, this is human nature. Evidently you and your god have not learned this basic lesson. I say you both still need a bit more growing up.

Maybe what your god did should not be told, as it will be imitated.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#111831
Aug 27, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I never said it was moral, I said I can understand God's anger.
And I can kinda picture the Far Side comic I saw one time when you say you condemn Him.
It was a picture of God in front of a control panel with a screen that showed a guy walking under a piano being lifted. His finger was about to push a big butting that said "Smite".
I kinda picture Him having to take 10 breaths when some one says what you did. Then going: No, I'm calm. I'm not going to do it.
Haha
Well seeing as how Deuteronomy says to make the decision for murdering unbelievers into your own hands, I can see why you get a chuckle out of this.

God made the bots and is pissed he programmed them poorly so he drowned everything. Nuts.

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#111832
Aug 27, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>First, it makes no logical sense that people of those times could not follow the philosophy you follow now.
Now lets keep in mind, humans learn by example.
So this tale being in the bible is highly likely to be teaching one to murder in mass. We know by history it has happened. We know by reading the bible Moses took it upon himself to have troops kill the innocent kids and women many times.
You have your apologetics down pretty well, but it still does not cut the mustard with reality.
If I was all powerful and a robot builder, I would not need to murder my robots, I would just reprogram them with my words as I did the first time.
Something I find curious is that god doesn't really tell people what to do prior to Moses. I mean, there some things he says but mostly it seems to be implied. I don't remember there being much said about what specifically drove him to kill every man, woman, and baby in the world with the flood. I know it says he was not pleased with humans but what exactly had they done? And when did god give them specific commandments not to do those things?

This is one of the reasons I don't think the Bible is a very good tool for figuring out what is morally right. God sends far too many mixed messages. One minute he seems to not know what's happening while he's away from Eden, the next minute he's a burning bush, and then he's attacking Moses on the side of the road. Later he's demanding burnt offerings and issuing hundreds and hundreds of mandates. Then he's commanding his people to murder and pillage and steal land.

Then he impregnates a virgin who bears his son...who gets killed for political reasons. And we're supposed to find some kind of consistent and applicable moral code in that jumbled mess somehow.

Isn't it easier to use our brains and our shared sense of ethics to figure out what to do? After all, that's what we do anyway. I don't' care how much a person talks about the spirit of the lord and the holy ghost in the end that person is using his brain to make decisions about what to do. God is not telling him anything.
stuck in a lodi

Elkhorn City, KY

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#111833
Aug 27, 2013
 

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JUST FRED - Humor
An Arizona Highway Patrol officer stops a Harley for traveling faster than the posted speed limit, so he asks the biker his name.

'Fred,' he replies.

'Fred what?' the officer asks.

'Just Fred,' the man responds.

The officer is in a good mood, thinks he might just give the biker a break, and write him out a warning instead of a ticket. The officer then presses him for the last name.

The man tells him that he used to have a last name but lost it.

The officer thinks that he has a nut case on his hands but plays along with it.'Tell me, Fred, how did you lose your last name?'

The biker replies,'It's a long story, so stay with me.' I was born Fred Johnson. I studied hard and got good grades. When I got older, I realized that I wanted to be a doctor. I went through college, medical school, internship, residency, and finally got my degree, so I was Fred Johnson, MD. After a while I got bored being a doctor, so I decided to go back to school. Dentistry was my dream! Got all the way through School, got my degree, so then I was Fred Johnson, MD, DDS. Got bored doing dentistry, so I started fooling around with my assistant and she gave me VD, so now I was Fred Johnson, MD, DDS, with VD.

Well, the ADA found out about the VD, so they took away my DDS. Then I was Fred Johnson, MD, with VD. Then the AMA found out about the ADA taking away my DDS because of the VD, so they took away my MD leaving me as Fred Johnson with VD. Then the VD took away my Johnson, so now I am Just Fred.'

The officer walked away in tears, laughing.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#111834
Aug 27, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
Something I find curious is that god doesn't really tell people what to do prior to Moses. I mean, there some things he says but mostly it seems to be implied. I don't remember there being much said about what specifically drove him to kill every man, woman, and baby in the world with the flood. I know it says he was not pleased with humans but what exactly had they done? And when did god give them specific commandments not to do those things?
This is one of the reasons I don't think the Bible is a very good tool for figuring out what is morally right. God sends far too many mixed messages. One minute he seems to not know what's happening while he's away from Eden, the next minute he's a burning bush, and then he's attacking Moses on the side of the road. Later he's demanding burnt offerings and issuing hundreds and hundreds of mandates. Then he's commanding his people to murder and pillage and steal land.
Then he impregnates a virgin who bears his son...who gets killed for political reasons. And we're supposed to find some kind of consistent and applicable moral code in that jumbled mess somehow.
Isn't it easier to use our brains and our shared sense of ethics to figure out what to do? After all, that's what we do anyway. I don't' care how much a person talks about the spirit of the lord and the holy ghost in the end that person is using his brain to make decisions about what to do. God is not telling him anything.
All persons use their brain to deduce what is right and wrong. But some do not think deeply about it and just follow the herd. Religion is the herd in many cases. Now if that herd always did the moral thing, I might think religion was the way to go, but this is not the case.
No herd always does the right thing, so following any herd to the letter can lead to some moral problems.

And yes, the story of god before the flood is vague as most of the bible is vague. So the lesson of the flood is what? Don't be bad a bad world of people? Vague.

Sounds more like something some religious/political leader told his people so they would follow his orders.
It is a control tool for the dictators.

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