Bible study rules for public schools proposed

There are 20 comments on the Feb 10, 2010, The Courier-Journal story titled Bible study rules for public schools proposed. In it, The Courier-Journal reports that:

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Courier-Journal.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#108462 Jul 19, 2013
curious wrote:
The tantalising proof that belief in God makes you happier and healthier
By Tom Knox
Posting articles from The Daily Mail will not get you very far. It is the British version of The National Enquirer.

What I find so funny about this is that none of it supports the god hypothesis. What you have is evidence that social cohesion and stability correlates with health and longevity. I think this has been demonstrated scientifically. If you dig into the numbers you'll find, for example, that among those who do the best most of them are married. In older couples that are married there is more religiosity and church attendance. The social cohesion and the support of a loving partner are what leads to the better health.

Where exactly does god actually fit into that equation?

I think this is a problem that atheists have to deal with over time. It has been a huge topic of debate for many years. How do the non-religious foster more community? It is hard. With religious people you have a built-in, captive audience. You have strong social ties and the desire to remain in good standing socially leads to cohesion. Among the godless we don't have that benefit.

And again...that says nothing about god. God could be fiction or reality and either way the story would be the same.

I realize 99% of what I just said is lost on you but I'm actually posting it for my own benefit. I happen to enjoy the topic very much.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#108463 Jul 19, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope, not in the 'slightest'.
At approximately 7:09 PM, Zimmerman called the Sanford police non-emergency number to report what he considered a suspicious person in the Twin Lakes community. Zimmerman stated, "We've had some break-ins in my neighborhood, and there's a real suspicious guy." (SPOTTED) He described an unknown male "just walking around looking about" in the rain and said, "This guy looks like he is up to no good or he is on drugs or something." Zimmerman reported that the person had his hand in his waistband and was walking around looking at homes. On the recording, Zimmerman is heard saying, "these assholes, they always get away." (PROFILED)
About two minutes into the call, Zimmerman said, "he's running." The dispatcher asked, "He's running? Which way is he running?" The sound of a car door chime is heard, indicating Zimmerman opened his car door. Zimmerman followed Martin,(CHASED) eventually losing sight of him.(LOST) The dispatcher asked Zimmerman if he was following him. When Zimmerman answered, "yeah," the dispatcher said, "We don't need you to do that." Zimmerman responded, "Okay." Zimmerman asked that police call him upon their arrival so he could provide his location. Zimmerman ended the call at 7:15 p.m.
After Zimmerman ended his call with police,(FOUND) a violent encounter took place between Martin and Zimmerman,(CONFRONTED) which ended when Zimmerman fatally shot Martin 70 yards (64 m) from the rear door of the townhouse where Martin was staying.
Personally I suspect that Zimmerman acted far too aggressively that night. I don't believe he was out to kill, though. I think he was genuine in his intentions but he made a lot of dumb mistakes. First of which: carrying a gun.

There was a lot of stuff he could have done differently and none of us would even be having this conversation.

But he didn't deserve a murder wrap. I actually changed my mind on this after really digging into the evidence.

However, among those who support Zimmerman you're going to find a religious zeal regarding the right to defend oneself and this zeal dovetails with their worship of guns. I've ran into that a bunch. I swear, Zimmerman could have accidentally killed ten people that night by shooting and missing his target and these people would STILL back him up and still claim it's a good idea to walk around with a gun on your hip like it's 1880 at the OK Corral.
uuummm

London, KY

#108464 Jul 19, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
Posting articles from The Daily Mail will not get you very far. It is the British version of The National Enquirer.
What I find so funny about this is that none of it supports the god hypothesis. What you have is evidence that social cohesion and stability correlates with health and longevity. I think this has been demonstrated scientifically. If you dig into the numbers you'll find, for example, that among those who do the best most of them are married. In older couples that are married there is more religiosity and church attendance. The social cohesion and the support of a loving partner are what leads to the better health.
Where exactly does god actually fit into that equation?
I think this is a problem that atheists have to deal with over time. It has been a huge topic of debate for many years. How do the non-religious foster more community? It is hard. With religious people you have a built-in, captive audience. You have strong social ties and the desire to remain in good standing socially leads to cohesion. Among the godless we don't have that benefit.
And again...that says nothing about god. God could be fiction or reality and either way the story would be the same.
I realize 99% of what I just said is lost on you but I'm actually posting it for my own benefit. I happen to enjoy the topic very much.
Very good points! And, it seems, believers still don't get what atheist believe or I should say don't believe!

Lets say that he is right and believing in God can make you the happiest person in the world.(And it can, been there.) But once you have spent years looking at the evidence and reading the Bible and studied the matter and suddenly realized that there is no evidence for a God and certainly not the one invented in the Bible, how do they expect you to believe? You cannot force yourself to believe something that you deeply feel is wrong, no matter how much better it would make you feel if you could. It is like they still do not understand that others really do not believe in god. They still seem to think that those people are just denying god but deep down in their hearts they know he is real and just do not want to obey so they say they do not believe. Trust me. It is totally devastating to diligently search for the truth and find the something you were not even looking for in the first place!

It is very hard to live in small town USA and be an atheist or agnostic. You lose your support network, sometimes even your family. People in my area tend to think that if you are an atheist you are somehow evil and that you worship satan. Of course they don't understand that you do not believe in satan either!

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Somerset, KY

#108465 Jul 19, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
Personally I suspect that Zimmerman acted far too aggressively that night. I don't believe he was out to kill, though. I think he was genuine in his intentions but he made a lot of dumb mistakes. First of which: carrying a gun.
There was a lot of stuff he could have done differently and none of us would even be having this conversation.
But he didn't deserve a murder wrap. I actually changed my mind on this after really digging into the evidence.
However, among those who support Zimmerman you're going to find a religious zeal regarding the right to defend oneself and this zeal dovetails with their worship of guns. I've ran into that a bunch. I swear, Zimmerman could have accidentally killed ten people that night by shooting and missing his target and these people would STILL back him up and still claim it's a good idea to walk around with a gun on your hip like it's 1880 at the OK Corral.
Without that Gun he might very well be in the morgue... We cannot know what would have happened if he Didn't have the side arm and Martin continued to beat him.. Every thing he did was just as I have been told to do when on neighborhood watch when I lived in Michigan by the Police... Report any one or any thing suspicious and keep an eye on them until police arrive...

Why do so many seem to think having a Legally Carried gun is what causes a person to die... When in many More cases having a Legally carried gun keeps the carrier Alive... If someone Legally Carrying shoots a bad guy think of it as Saving a Good Guys Life....

“I'll think about it.”

Since: Nov 07

central Florida

#108466 Jul 19, 2013
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey Quant,you are still the funniest guy..witchinthe woods and her aliases run a distant second,Although,He/It /She is more touched in the head than you are.
You and the witch and her brew have shed some light on my family history with which I was not familiar.
I have been called a scoundrel,a cad,a bounder,a perpetrator of academic fraud and an SOB,but never have I been called the son of a star...
I will be dipped in doodoo.
Of the quasar and the super nova,we will call them Adam and Eve,
Which one was the female and which was the male,,,or was this a sexless encounter....
Two stars having sex....Under the stars...
Sounds like Liz Taylor and Richard Burton.....
You pervert you...
What will you think of next?
And the poor befuddled Witch took it all in,hook.line and broomstick
It's ok, honey. We know you don't understand but maybe someday you will.

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#108468 Jul 19, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
Personally I suspect that Zimmerman acted far too aggressively that night. I don't believe he was out to kill, though. I think he was genuine in his intentions but he made a lot of dumb mistakes. First of which: carrying a gun.
There was a lot of stuff he could have done differently and none of us would even be having this conversation.
But he didn't deserve a murder wrap. I actually changed my mind on this after really digging into the evidence.
However, among those who support Zimmerman you're going to find a religious zeal regarding the right to defend oneself and this zeal dovetails with their worship of guns. I've ran into that a bunch. I swear, Zimmerman could have accidentally killed ten people that night by shooting and missing his target and these people would STILL back him up and still claim it's a good idea to walk around with a gun on your hip like it's 1880 at the OK Corral.
I never claimed that GZ was not in fear for his life or that he didn't pull the trigger in self defense. I said that he was the aggressor and that it was his actions of pursuit that culminated with the boy's death. I agree that he isn't a murderer, but he sure as hell wasn't an innocent bystander.
Be careful with that camera, Q. Some paranoid upstanding citizen might think that a biker taking pictures is suspicious enough to run you off the side of a mountain.

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#108469 Jul 19, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Without that Gun he might very well be in the morgue... We cannot know what would have happened if he Didn't have the side arm and Martin continued to beat him.. Every thing he did was just as I have been told to do when on neighborhood watch when I lived in Michigan by the Police... Report any one or any thing suspicious and keep an eye on them until police arrive...
Why do so many seem to think having a Legally Carried gun is what causes a person to die... When in many More cases having a Legally carried gun keeps the carrier Alive... If someone Legally Carrying shoots a bad guy think of it as Saving a Good Guys Life....
What a load of anal retentive NRA BS. WAY, WAY more people die from being shot by family members than chance encounter citizen vs. thug scenarios.
Report and keep your distance. If walking in the rain or looking toward a house were crimes there wouldn't be a soul in the nation without a criminal record. Being a watch captain doesn't make you a trained and official police officer and does not give you any authority to detain a law abiding citizen. Having a carry permit doesn't magically make you a "Good Guy."
well

London, KY

#108470 Jul 19, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Without that Gun he might very well be in the morgue... We cannot know what would have happened if he Didn't have the side arm and Martin continued to beat him.. Every thing he did was just as I have been told to do when on neighborhood watch when I lived in Michigan by the Police... Report any one or any thing suspicious and keep an eye on them until police arrive...
Why do so many seem to think having a Legally Carried gun is what causes a person to die... When in many More cases having a Legally carried gun keeps the carrier Alive... If someone Legally Carrying shoots a bad guy think of it as Saving a Good Guys Life....
I am guessing that if he had not been armed he would have kept his butt in his truck and he nor Martin would be dead.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

Since: Dec 08

Home, sweet home.

#108471 Jul 19, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
The evidence shows that GZ spotted, profiled and chased TM, lost him, found him again and a confrontation ensued.
I heard that story. The jury didn't find it compelling.

.
ChromiuMan wrote:
We will never hear TM's side of the story.
We have witness testimony, we were told Tray acted out of fear of rape; homophobia. That's what Rachel Jeantel claimed:
http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/07/16/3502851...

.
ChromiuMan wrote:
You can edit and confound the story any other way you want - and you usually do. That's why I loathe responding directly to your posts. Have a nice day.
I've cited my sources, what about CM's? Sucks to be wrong, like not having a dad to tell you if you whoop somebody you might get shot.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#108472 Jul 19, 2013
Spaceship earth wrote:
<quoted text>I agree sin is sin. I do not agree about denying God or the holy spirit.

Look this is were I think you understand of this concept is not correct.

Hebrews 10:26
If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left.

The bible explictly say that if you have the correct doctrine of the truth (which all christians sects say they have) including yourself and if you willfully sin then no sacrifice for sins is left.

So the unforgivable sin would be a sin against the TRUTH.

Hebrews 10:26
If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the TRUTH, no sacrifice for sins is left.

John 16:13
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the TRUTH.

If you don't have the TRUTH in the first place then you cannot sin against the Holy Spirit.

This then means the heavy burden is upon those that have the TRUTH and then willfully keep sinning.

Ecclesiastes 5:4-8
4 When you make a vow to God, do not delay in fulfilling it. He has no pleasure in fools; fulfill your vow. 5 It is better not to vow than to make a vow and not fulfill it.

I would like to see what other religious ones think about the understanding of how you can sin against the Holy Spirit, since they are the ones who claim to have the truth.
I agree. That's why I think it is difficult to deny the Holy Ghost. You have to have full knowledge of Him before you can deny Him.

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#108473 Jul 19, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>I heard that story. The jury didn't find it compelling.
.
<quoted text>We have witness testimony, we were told Tray acted out of fear of rape; homophobia. That's what Rachel Jeantel claimed:
http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/07/16/3502851...
.
<quoted text>I've cited my sources, what about CM's? Sucks to be wrong, like not having a dad to tell you if you whoop somebody you might get shot.
I quoted from Wikipedia. The sources are documented.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Tray...
If Martin acted through fear, how does that mitigate (your favorite word) Zimmerman's actions that led to the confrontation? What would you or Q or I have done as teenagers if we were being chased though the dark by a stranger? Flight? Fight? Sheer blind panic? Here's to the good fortune that I for one never had the misfortune of finding out.
curious

Ocoee, FL

#108474 Jul 19, 2013
chance8 wrote:
<quoted text>
<--- because by your rebuttal I can't really tell --->
I was once Agnostic.I did not know if God existed,nor did I care.
If God did exist,I did not want him getting involved in my life,as I felt very capable of handling my affairs without his intervention.
There came a point in my life where I was confronted with a series of problems for which I could not find a solution.
These problems started me in a search for God..
Over a period of time,God revealed himself,as he promised in his word...
I became a believer.
I believe In God,I believe Jesus was sent by God and I believe in the Holy Spirit.
My beliefs are not based on wishful thinking,fear of death,fear of punishment,delusions or any of the other nonsensical reasons attributed by nonbelievers.

My beliefs are based on my actual experiences as I sought God.
They are real,as only I can attest....
Hope this clears it up for you
curious

Ocoee, FL

#108475 Jul 19, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Because she understood it, you didn't.... But then again it's tough for a 3rd grader to understand how a nuclear reactor works also....
Fortunately,I have not regressed mentally to the stage where the illogical makes sense.
That nothing can create something out of nothing does not compute in my world.....

It's like,what came first,the chicken or the egg.
As you know,Scientists claim the chicken came first,as only a chicken is able to produce a chicken egg.
Ok. Where did the chicken come from?
Who created the chicken?

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#108476 Jul 19, 2013
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
Fortunately,I have not regressed mentally to the stage where the illogical makes sense.
That nothing can create something out of nothing does not compute in my world.....
Where did your god come from?
curious

Ocoee, FL

#108477 Jul 19, 2013
Skeptical Spectacles wrote:
<quoted text>
Where did your god come from?
It is my understanding that he always was,is and always will be.
Why do you ask?

Since: Jul 13

Location hidden

#108481 Jul 19, 2013
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
It is my understanding that he always was,is and always will be.
Why do you ask?
If there is a creator being then it would have to have no beginning and no end; otherwise it couldn't make the claims that the christian bible makes.

I can't get figured out which is easier to concieve. A being that has and always will be who created everything...... or........
and I know that there is a scientific jargon for this but basically; there was nothing and the nothing became something and that something became something else.

Both are simple concepts that we can twist into extremely difficult and elaborate happenings but how does logic play into either or neither of them?

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

Somerset, KY

#108482 Jul 19, 2013
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
Fortunately,I have not regressed mentally to the stage where the illogical makes sense.
That nothing can create something out of nothing does not compute in my world.....
It's like,what came first,the chicken or the egg.
As you know,Scientists claim the chicken came first,as only a chicken is able to produce a chicken egg.
Ok. Where did the chicken come from?
Who created the chicken?
We already played the chicken and egg game... it's not regression to not have the intellectual ability to understand complex thoughts.... There is another term for it....

Since: Feb 12

Roseville, CA

#108484 Jul 19, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree. That's why I think it is difficult to deny the Holy Ghost. You have to have full knowledge of Him before you can deny Him.
I misunderstood what you meant in previous post, sorry, now to move on to another area since we agree on the sin against the Holy Spirit.

Do all baptized members of LDS church have full knowledge of God? Do you claim to have full Knowledge of God?

[Speaking in Tongues today]

You said that you believe the gift of speaking in tongues exist today.

What do you think was the purpose of speaking in tongues was used for after Jesus death?

Does anyone in your LDS church speak in tongues today? If so, why would you believe it is real and not fake?

What purpose would speaking in tongues be used for in this modern age?

I don't think there would be any reason for it today.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#108485 Jul 19, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>That's fine, I don't expect my opinion will amount to much for you.

I don't recall ever saying Jesus was a fraud. With figures so obscure and ancient it is really hard to know much about their intentions. We have scant evidence of his existence, let alone his motivations. If he was real then I think it is more plausible to say that he was genuine in his own beliefs and teachings. I'd say the magic attributed to him is mostly added later (read the gospels in the order in which they were actually written and you can see the magic getting more and more fantastical, the claims more and more elaborate...that's how legends grow).

But I can say those things. You can't. If your starting point is "I believe" then from that you can't get to the truth. You have to start with "I want to know". Then you can follow the evidence. And evidence is the clearest path to truth.
He taught that He was the Son of God. This is why He was killed. So if you don't believe He was the Son of God, then you are calling Him a fraud.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#108486 Jul 19, 2013
Spaceship earth wrote:
<quoted text>I misunderstood what you meant in previous post, sorry, now to move on to another area since we agree on the sin against the Holy Spirit.

Do all baptized members of LDS church have full knowledge of God? Do you claim to have full Knowledge of God?

[Speaking in Tongues today]

You said that you believe the gift of speaking in tongues exist today.

What do you think was the purpose of speaking in tongues was used for after Jesus death?

Does anyone in your LDS church speak in tongues today? If so, why would you believe it is real and not fake?

What purpose would speaking in tongues be used for in this modern age?

I don't think there would be any reason for it today.
I do not think that there is a human alive that understands everything about God or the way He thinks. But we are held accountable for the knowledge that we do have. I have learned of many commandments from God and I must, therefore, do my best to obey them, or I would be knowingly sinning.

I believe that the purpose of the gift of tongues is to teach the gospel to others. At the Pentecost I think it was more to prove to people the power of God. This is not its main purpose today.
I believe it is more manifest in being able to learn an entirely different language in a matter of a couple of weeks, to travel to the country that speaks this language and be fully immersed, and be able to teach the gospel of Jesus Christ in their native language.

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