Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Courier-Journal

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

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“pervinco per logica”

Since: Feb 12

Eradicate willful ignorance.

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#100670
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
While I don't disagree with the idea that Modern man may have ties to Africa I do have a problem with attempting to use DNA as a reference source because during the bottle neck as the last ice age ended we lost a good 70 to 80% of the human genome and the remainder is so limited in diversity that assuming a Afrocentric ascension is doubtful....
I think you're oversimplifying things and that's the source of your problem with this. This is much more complex than a most recent common ancestor analysis (which would indeed have lived since the last ice age), and mitochondrial DNA can most certainly be extended beyond that time. Otherwise there would not be a multitude of peer reviewed papers on this subject and we wouldn't be having the conversation. You may want to read some of them before dismissing based on what might be a misconception.

Not to say that fossil evidence isn't essentially conclusive on its own, but both together paint an impressively complete picture.

“There is no god”

Since: Jul 12

War, WV

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#100671
Apr 23, 2013
 
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
ummmm wrote
Things that suddenly occur to you without any basis are generally stupid thoughts you should discard.
The thought that occurred to me,was BASED on the following information that I posted,which I am posting again,
,therefore I had a basis,which you overlooked.
I do not rejoice at your unbelief as that is no cause for rejoicing.
I do rejoice in the belief that I found an answer to my question by searching the Scriptures,thereby,strengtheni ng my Faith.Seek and ye shall find
Atheists believe that God does not exist, if one believes something does not exist,it does not make much sense to debate whether it exists or not.
Although Atheists do not believe in God,they are unable to get that which they don't believe in,off their minds.
Somehow,this entity they claim does not exist( God) has crept into their minds and they can not stop thinking about him.
As a result,they read the Bible,probably more frequently,than many of those who claim to be Christians.
And I asked myself,Why is it that God is on their minds and why do they read the Bible?
Then I read the Bible, where it states;
1 Timothy 2:3-4
3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth
Matthew 19:25-26
25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished, saying,“Who then can be saved?” 26 But Jesus looked at them and said,“With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
and my question was answered.
Thanks for responding to what I posted.It helped answer a question for which I did not have an answer
You are a special kind of stupid arn't you?
When you spout that god condemns something and we say there is no god it is not a debate, we are stating a fact and letting you know that your "faith" has no impact on any one else. Your stupid beliefs do not force us to do or not do something that you claim god wants.
There is no debate, we try to help you with your mental illness but we are not debating with you.
I will pray to the good Lord Satan that you will overcome your mental illness

“There is no god”

Since: Jul 12

War, WV

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#100672
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Not that the origin matters to the context of why humans have different color skin, but the evidence points to Africa first. Now if new evidence is found, then new origins might be claimed. Do you have one shred of evidence Adam and Eve were the first humans?
The oldest human bones and pre-human bones have been found in Africa. Bipedal apes bones millions of years old.
I think the oldest bones of a human like creature outside of Africa is no more than a hundred thousand years old.
But, but it was only 4000 years ago that angels had sex with apes and humans where created..........

“There is no god”

Since: Jul 12

War, WV

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#100673
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Thousands of years ago beings from the planet kalob came to earth. They did experiments with the life her and combined different genes with their own to make a species they called man.
The leader of these beings, named megog, and his underlings known as angalias taught man to use tools and build shelter, cook food. They left on their space ship but told man they would return..........blah blah blah YAA and bi-curious worship megog a dead space scientist

Since: Aug 10

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#100674
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Satanic Priest wrote:
<quoted text>You are a special kind of stupid arn't you?
When you spout that god condemns something and we say there is no god it is not a debate, we are stating a fact and letting you know that your "faith" has no impact on any one else. Your stupid beliefs do not force us to do or not do something that you claim god wants.
There is no debate, we try to help you with your mental illness but we are not debating with you.
I will pray to the good Lord Satan that you will overcome your mental illness
Dude, he's already got you on IGNORE. Be careful, or he might put you on double secret probation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Sure

United States

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#100675
Apr 23, 2013
 

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I think this would be a wonderful thing. I believe the children who want to study the bible and learn about our savoir Jesus Christ should be able to. If you do not wish to learn about Jesus you don't have to attend this study. Just an idea. We have allowed athiest ect.. To have the final say for to long. It's time Christians took a stand. Jesus will not push himself on anyone. The teaching should be available for the
Ones who want to learn.
You are funny

Jonesborough, TN

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#100676
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Satanic Priest wrote:
<quoted text>But, but it was only 4000 years ago that angels had sex with apes and humans where created..........
Tick-tock, tick-tock. Revelation, chapter 18; The detail of Sept,11 2001, amuse me with your opinion? If G-d knows this part, what about the rest? I would hate to be on the loseing side, as you are!:)

“I'll think about it.”

Since: Nov 07

central Florida

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#100677
Apr 23, 2013
 

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_Ummm_ wrote:
<quoted text>
OK... so let me get this straight. You paraphrase Marilyn's beliefs (acting as though it was something that just hit you out of the blue), I tell you how and why I think it's crap, so then you give me the original words like it's going to change my mind??
Let me try to explain in a different way and address the source (and validity) of your argument.
First, on this "Marilyn" person. I am 95% sure that this is a Christian shill. Those sound like the words of somebody who does not even remotely understand atheism. I can barely conceive of them being the words of somebody who truly was one. Not that this would diminish the validity of any claims, but it should be said that this one fails the litmus test pretty hard.
Now, the argument itself. Look at the foundation. The words "like many atheists, the issue of people believing in God bothered me greatly" are nothing but establishment of a strawman at the very beginning. That is a logical fallacy, FYI. Any thing built from this foundation, any words that successfully attack the validity of the thought, are essentially void. This is NOT the belief of any atheist I know, and attempting to act as though it applies to ANY atheist without proof is 100% fraudulent. So, to be clear, the follow on argument ONLY applies to whatever stupid concept of atheism she claimed to subscribe to.
Now, her claim of "I was deeply curious to see if they could convince me otherwise". Again, this is not the kind of belief that I have ever seen an atheist have. You see, this isn't some soft conceptual debate where you can interpret the evidence available in some other way and have multiple theories that can prove true. There is LITERALLY no evidence available to humanity that can be used to demonstrate the existence of God. None. So there is no need to be curious if somebody could "convince you otherwise". The only curiosity is if there is evidence that we don't know about that could be used to demonstrate the existence of God.
I constantly seek out such evidence. That doesn't mean I'm doubting my assumptions, or that there is any way that any person on the planet could convince me of God's existence using all of the information I already know about, or that God is "pushing me" toward it. I do the same thing for many topics that are of significance to me. I want to know things. I read about things. I reason.
Lastly, this phrase "I have come to find out that God wants to be known. He created us with the intention that we would know him. He has surrounded us with evidence of himself and he keeps the question of his existence squarely before us."
It's gullible idiot food. You can't "come to find" something without evidence. You can only have faith that it's true. You can't say "God wants to be known", knowing full well that he gave us all the ability to observe the universe and think. If he did, he would make himself known and there would be as many atheists as "moon existence deniers". "He has surrounded us with evidence" only means that the moron writing the words here has NO concept of what the word "evidence" means.
I'm not trying to diminish your faith, as long as you're acknowledging that is what you have. I am trying to simply explain that what you have IS ONLY faith and that there is NO logical/reasonable/scientific way to state that God exists. Any argument to the contrary, without new evidence, is of absolutely no value. If religious people would recognize that, you'd probably find that all of the atheists you keep battling would simply disappear.
Also, LOL @ "their hope was completely ill-founded". Really? You really think we're going to believe that's not a full time Christian?
VERY well stated.
Especially the paragraph beginning with "I'm not trying to diminish your faith..."

Religious people are welcome to their "faith" as long as they are not trying to present it as facts that we ALL must live by.
They just don't seem to get that concept.
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100678
Apr 23, 2013
 

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_Ummm_ wrote:
I will be as polite as possible as I explain the truth of this matter.
Why thank you, hope you enjoyed stating YOUR opinion.
I'll be happy to clear a few things up for you, but this is based upon the assumption that one can comprehend the difference between ones own opinion, from that of the opinions of others, and hopefully that basis will not be too difficult to understand for you..
Now, moving along, and based upon my OWN opinions...
1. I have no idea why you even used the word "agenda". Are you making some sort of direct personal accusation against me, and could you please explain yourself for doing so?
Or at least, please explain whatever it is you're talking about, as I have no idea what you are referencing, nor any respect, for it at all, as anyone who accuses anyone else for no viable reason, out of the arrogance of ignorance, just breed contemptible disdain.
2. I have stated repeatedly, time and time again, I personally do not think the Bible as whole, should ever be read as strictly "literal" finding even the thought of that to be rather foolish. So, again, could you please explain whatever it is YOU are referencing? Is that idealogue something you perhaps find logical and in agreement with?
3. I do not think the Bible was transcribed to "tell" a "primitive people" anything, I think it was transcribed for quite the opposite reason, much more as a journal writer would record thoughts and insights, as well as instances of the times one might be living in, and perhaps even, much more so for FUTURE civilizations to reference, which is possibly why, the Bible has survived so well since Antiquity, as enough people through out history, saw fitting to do so. So, I believe, we are at polar opposites on THAT opinion.
4. We have already LONG since established the differences in meaning between "faith" and "Science", on this thread, and I really don't think there are many people that do NOT know the difference, so I just find that statement, more redundancy, and really quite needless, as any FIFTH grader can use a dictionary these days.
5. I for one, have NEVER used the ignorant phrase of "God did it" especially in mockery of others, as I find anyone who Would use such a phrase in that manner, to be just petulant, nettlesome and fractious...obnoxiousness on the same par Mentality level of a belligerent, self absorbed adolescent.
6. I have already explained my personal hypothesis on Creationism and Evolution... so that is something else, you and I do NOT agree on. I have no problem with parts of BOTH, theoretically AND philosophically.
6. Read back as MANY pages as you'd like, and you will HAVE to face the TRUTH then, in that I for one, have personally ALWAYS stated, I feel the turthful and logical, could ONLY state with any sort of actual unbiased contemplation, that indeed (aside from those of faith who chose to view from their OWN perspectives-to which they have every Constitutional right to) that the only other logical answer, based upon what evidentiary tangible references we do have, rather than just faith, is just to say "we do NOT know".
Is the above writings of MY OPINION too difficult to comprehend? I could try and simplify it even further if so.
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100679
Apr 23, 2013
 

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ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
It was "unscholarly" to have placed it anywhere. It could easily be the visions and ramblings of a schizophrenic.
I think that'd be a bit of a stretch, considering there's quite a few other archeological items of interest that lend credence to the possible existences of more than just one person as having contributed to the writings.
(For an example of rambling "clinical" hollow BS derived out of responding to vain BSing, please see my prior post LOL)
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100680
Apr 23, 2013
 

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_Ummm_ wrote:
<quoted text>
Something that liars of all sort figured out long ago. Fortune tellers, astrologers, preachers, etc. etc.:
Vagueness + a little bit of educated guesswork = tricking the gullible.
If you think anything is "related", that's because your presupposition got in the way of a true evaluation of the information. Vague texts can seem to be "related" to a great many things if you want them to be. It's easy to convince a fool of something that he already wanted to hear.
Tangible items speak much louder than words sometimes-especially in the world of archeology.

And I'm not one on snake oil selling anything to anyone, finding that type of thing to often be highly lacking, of any sort of merit, ethics, or decency.
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100681
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Skeptical Spectacles wrote:
<quoted text>
True words. I would add to this our (human) ability for pattern recognition contributes immensely to "magical" thinking. We're hard-wired to categorize everything we sense and to make connections with the data. Effective pattern detection was essential for our survival in the pre-modern world (and to some degree still is today). Unfortunately, it also fuels post hoc reasoning.
I sense that if one "imagines" hard enough, it almost smells like a load of donkeydung in here. Do you have some sort of "agenda"? Maybe perhaps in trying to sell frosted donkeydung disguised as something with some sort of "magical virtue-healing" powers to the unsuspecting?
(Although I could agree SOME with your statement of pattern detections, per example perhaps- when monitoring the skies, like those "stupid" primitives of old, for celestial, and not celestial events, but not so much on calling a thunderstorm a thunderstom after the fact)
AuNaturale

Somerset, KY

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#100682
Apr 23, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
<quoted text>
Quote,chromiuman wrote" There isn't any reasonable expectation that Rev. was divinely inspired or that John of Patmos even laid eyes on Jesus
Let me see if I understand you correctly.In order for a book to be included in the New Testament,It has to meet the following criteria.
1)That the Authors" had either known Jesus personally or were closely affiliated with somebody who had, and were considered trustworthy by that person(apostolic authority). For example, Matthew, Peter, and John were disciples, Paul had an encounter with Jesus on the road to Damascus, Mark worked closely with Peter, and Luke traveled with Paul..
2)That the message contained the book were ones that accurately portrayed Jesus and presented Christianity in the form practiced by the church that sprung out of Jesus.
.3)And that they had to be Divinely Inspired,meaning,Guided by the hand of God.
In your view,Revelation does not meet that criteria,therefore,in your judgement,it should not have been included,in
Whereas,the other books in the New Testament,because,in your judgement they met that criteria, were legitimately included.
When I made my comments about your being acomedy writer for Jay leno and that is why he was fired,I was not aware that you subscribed to the abovementioned criteria.
Accept my apologies,I had misjudged you and based on your explanation, I was wrong.
Although, I do not necessarily agree,that Revelation does not belong in the old testament
3)And that they had to be Divinely Inspired,meaning,Guided by the hand of God.
Chromiolio would have to deny the well known state of "writers block" amongst those who have ever partaken of, to deny the validity of that statement :-).
AuNaturale

Somerset, KY

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#100683
Apr 23, 2013
 

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ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>

The author of Revelation has no credentials aside from having been exiled by the Romans to the island of Patmos along with other heretics.
A chapter of the book with some of The most thought provoking metaphors of the ages.

Could've been a metaphorologist, for all we REALLY know, for certain!!

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#100684
Apr 23, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
How do we know Africa is where the first humans began?
It is the dominant theory because of evidence and reason. If humans began elsewhere we should see evidence for it. But we do not.

The same methods we used to understand that humans came out of Africa are the same methods used to dismiss ideas like Jesus Christ visiting the USA. No evidence, no dice.

“There is no god”

Since: Jul 12

War, WV

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#100685
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Sure wrote:
I think this would be a wonderful thing. I believe the children who want to study the bible and learn about our savoir Jesus Christ should be able to. If you do not wish to learn about Jesus you don't have to attend this study. Just an idea. We have allowed athiest ect.. To have the final say for to long. It's time Christians took a stand. Jesus will not push himself on anyone. The teaching should be available for the
Ones who want to learn.
You have it backwards, you have not allowed us, we have allowed you and the christian cult is pushing so we are making a stand. Stay away from our children, period.
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100686
Apr 23, 2013
 

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ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah,... and stuff.
okay..next time I'll just put blah blah blah, and stuff..it (cause I had other STUFF to do lol)

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#100687
Apr 23, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
<quoted text>
You are right,I have never experienced what Atheists have experienced...I was once an Agnostic. See if you are in agreement with this article;
Written by Marilyn Adamson
I was an atheist at one time. And like many atheists, the issue of people believing in God bothered me greatly. What causes us to do that? When I was an atheist, I attributed my intentions as caring for those poor, delusional people...to help them realize their hope was completely ill-founded. To be honest, I also had another motive. As I challenged those who believed in God, I was deeply curious to see if they could convince me otherwise. Part of my quest was to become free from the question of God. If I could conclusively prove to believers that they were wrong, then the issue is off the table, and I would be free to go about my life.
I didn't realize that the reason the topic of God weighed so heavily on my mind, was because God was pressing the issue. I have come to find out that God wants to be known. He created us with the intention that we would know him. He has surrounded us with evidence of himself and he keeps the question of his existence squarely before us. It was as if I couldn't escape thinking about the possibility of God. In fact, the day I chose to acknowledge God's existence, my prayer began with, "Ok, you win..." It might be that the underlying reason atheists are bothered by people believing in God is because God is actively pursuing them.
I am not the only one who has experienced this. Malcolm Muggeridge, socialist and philosophical author, wrote, "I had a notion that somehow, besides questing, I was being pursued." C.S. Lewis said he remembered, "...night after night, feeling whenever my mind lifted even for a second from my work, the steady, unrelenting approach of Him whom I so earnestly desired not to meet. I gave in, and admitted that God was God, and knelt and prayed: perhaps, that night, the most dejected and reluctant convert in all of England."
Lewis went on to write a book titled, "Surprised by Joy" as a result of knowing God. I too had no expectations other than rightfully admitting God's existence. Yet over the following several months, I became amazed by his love for me
BTW I have never questioned the natural intellect of Atheists
Atheism is a product of proper skepticism. Really, on the whole, atheism itself is boring. It just means you don't accept the god hypothesis. What is exciting is skepticism itself, the idea that we can understand this universe by examining it and using reason.

That's the fun part. The god question is only relevant because so many people seem to be ate up with the idea of god. So we have to constantly discuss it.

Go to a forum on Bigfoot, aliens, or homeopathy and you'll see the same thing. Skeptics argue from evidence and reason, believers argue from faith and magic. The god question is no different.

Personally, I think that some people who say they "used to be" atheists were never atheists. This is because a lot of people will search for answers in life and pass through various phases. I had my Jesus phase for a couple of years and then it passed. But I have been a skeptic since I was a boy. I never had a time when I just got mad at god and became an atheist. I am an atheist because I just don't have a belief in god. End of story. And that lack of belief is a direct result of being skeptical, which is the same as being rational.
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100688
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
It is the dominant theory because of evidence and reason. If humans began elsewhere we should see evidence for it. But we do not.
The same methods we used to understand that humans came out of Africa are the same methods used to dismiss ideas like Jesus Christ visiting the USA. No evidence, no dice.
Have you ever examined any oceanic plate tectonics?
TruthIs

Somerset, KY

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#100689
Apr 23, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
It is the dominant theory because of evidence and reason. If humans began elsewhere we should see evidence for it. But we do not.
The same methods we used to understand that humans came out of Africa are the same methods used to dismiss ideas like Jesus Christ visiting the USA. No evidence, no dice.
and why would you think Jesus actually ever physically visited the US?

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