middle east conflict

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Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#1
Dec 18, 2012
 
I need to move quickly...
there are years and years one could debate about this issue...
i only have topix

So anyway... As the years went by... and nations started to learn and people started to learn about the Palestinian conflict , there was great pressure by the international community to fix this problem.
Human rights organzations started to criticize Israel. Israel was getting a lot of bad press!

SO Israel started a program of what they call " Hasbara " to counter act that bad press that comes with the Israeli Occupation! What exactly is Hasbara ? Or Hasbarats as we call them on the internet?

Hasbara is a organization of Israeli Volunteers and maybe some of them are paid ... that sit on the Internet all day long and work in shifts ... to sit on any posts , Youtube ... Topix ( On the larger Discussions ), CNN ( Now that you can post Comments On CNN )
Basically ANY website that a user can post a comment on... Hasbara's job is to reply with Pro Israeli Propaganda! There is an excellent Youtube cartoon explaining how Hasbarats act in online posts.
They basically use terms like " Missile's " " Rockets " " Human Shields " "Terrorists " over and over and over again to refer to Palestinians! Their job is to SIT ON AMERICAN ONLY WEB SITES!
HASBARA IS NOT WORRIED ABOUT ANY OTHER WEBSITES BUT AMERICAN ONES!!!
Why would that be? Think about that!!!! Why do Hasbara ONLY WORRY ABOUT WHAT THE AMERICAN's THINK? I will let you figure that one out for yourself.

Anyway.... Israel has pushed this huge movement online to try to justify the occupation now that there are lots of movements against the occupation. Most of the movements are organized online!

But In all and all.... As of today.... Palestinians Resist their occupation.... Israel ..( EVERY 4 Years ) brutally attaks Gaza always before Election time.

But that was the brief history... now i want to explain what is happeneing RIGHT NOW ! and how the Jewish Lobby controls our President and our country!

“Not afraid to stand alone.”

Since: Jun 09

Flat Lick Ky.

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#2
Dec 18, 2012
 
Freedom wrote:
Okay , I had to get comfortable with my Mac!!!
Now , You say that Palestinian's need to put their weapon's down and negotiate!
If it were this simple , this conflict would be over!
Now, I want to first say that ... in 2010 , and a lot of 2011 , I was not in The United States! When you travel out of this country and see this country from the "outside in" it is a lot different from looking at it from the " inside out "
Now back to the conflict!
OF COURSE!!! WE WOULD LOVE NEGOTIATIONS! This is exactly what Palestinians have tried over and over and over again! But after the American Veto after Veto after Veto after Veto after Veto at the U.N., Negotiations got Palestinians NO WHERE!!! It got them NO WHERE FOR OVER 60 Years!
before i even start talking about the conflict , there is some things you need to know!
1. Israel was not a state before 1948! Yep! Israel did not exist before 1948!
It was not even on the map! The whole land was called Palestine before 1948! So what happened??? How did it change from Palestine to Israel?
2. After World War 2 ... The world felt sorry for Jewish people because of what Hitler had supposedly did , and the talks of a Holocaust! The world felt bad for Jews , so they wanted to create a Jewish State somewhere in the world. After looking at many different places.... and even South America ...
It was decided that Jewish People would move to Palestine!
Palestine would be split in two parts.... Jews will live in one part...
Palestinians would live in the other part!!!! This is known as the British Mandate of Palestine , or the Balfour Declaration!
But there was a Problem!!!!! A BIG PROBLEM The Jews came with weapons!
THey came with American weaponry! They started murdering Palestinian after Palestinian and even removed them from their homes into concentration camps to where some even live today! AND THEY: ARE STILL TO THIS DAY CALLED CONCENTRATION CAMPS!!!!
While Jewish People in Newly Created State Of Israel were murdering millions of Palestinians in what has become historically known as " THE PALESTINIAN EXODUS " * You can google it * Most Neighboring countries could not sit back and bear to watch!!!!
SO OTHER NATIONS LATER ON DECIDED TO ATTACK ISRAEL ALL AT THE SAME TIME! This was known as the Six Day War! There were some other factors involved ... but I need to be as brief as possible!
Your history teacher told you in high school from your " Government Text Book That Tells you THE AMERICAN Government's Propagandized version of History for reasons of National Security... Told you that These Countries WERE EVIL AND WANTED TO KILL ALL JEWS AND REMOVE ISRAEL FROM THE MAP !!!!:) They needed to tell you this ... like this... because if they told you the real reason... it would make our number 1 ally look really really bad!!!!
After the 6 Day War Israel then started to Occupy Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip!!!!
THe West Bank And Gaza Strip were Strategically Separated from one another to keep Palestine from becoming a State!
So now ... We have Israel who is occupying West Bank and Gaza!
To Be Continued....
I'm going to try to break your book you are writing down. Please I dont need the history lesson, I'm 59yrs old.

""OF COURSE!!! WE WOULD LOVE NEGOTIATIONS! This is exactly what Palestinians have tried over and over and over again! But after the American Veto after Veto after Veto after Veto after Veto at the U.N., Negotiations got Palestinians NO WHERE!!! It got them NO WHERE FOR OVER 60 Years!""
..........What negotiations? Lay down your arms and act civilized,Take care of your children and the rest of the world will see you differently. Thats all it takes..........
Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#3
Dec 18, 2012
 
Okay , As you know... Israel says that they want to negotiate the borders.
Well , When you want to negotiate something you must start somewhere!
SO where do you start?

Well , you start with THE LAW!!! THE WORLD LAW!!! THE INTERNATIONAL LAW!!
This is fair ... right? Let's start negotiating according to International Law!!

This is what the Palestinians did. Palestinians said " Hey , It is Illegal to Settle on this land because it is under military occupation "
" Also , International Law and Un Resolution 242 Says that The West Bank and Gaza Strip are occupied territories , So ....
Israel must leave all occupied territories and this will be our state!

There is a problem like i said before ...
Israel basically says at this point...
" WAIT A MINUTE... WE ALREADY MOVED THOUSANDS OF OUR PEOPLE THERE... SO WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO.... WE CAN"T MOVE THEM OUT "

Now...( THIS WAS THE IDEA OF THE SETTLEMENTS ALL ALONG )
( MOVE AS MANY PEOPLE THERE AS YOU CAN WHILE YOU CAN DO IT BECAUSE IF WE MOVE ENOUGH PEOPLE THERE.... THEY WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO FORCE THEM ALL OUT )

So Israel uses this argument when Palestinians start Negotiating on the Basis Of International Law.

So what did the Palestinians say in response to this...

" HEY, NO PROBLEM... THEY CAN STAY.... BUT THEY WILL NEED TO HAVE PALESTINIAN PAsSPORTS AND THEY WILL hAVE THE RIGHT TO LIVE HERE FOREVER "

This wasnt good enough for Israel Either!

Now most of the Negotiations are basically with the West Bank!

Any PALESTINIAN STATE WOULD HAVE TO INCLUDE A SAFE PASSAGE TO GAZA .. because it is cut off from The West Bank.

HAMAS IS IN CHARGE OF GAZA! HAMAS did NOT TAKE CONTROL OF GAZA! THEY WERE DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED BY THE PEOPlE OF GAZA!!!!

THe United States and Israel say that Hamas is a terrorist organization because of the rocket issue... but you have to know that....
Hamas is a movement for the freedom of Palestine.
If there was no Occupation... There would never be not even 1 rocket fired into Israel.

This is what the Israeli Spokespersons did not tell you in the memo that was wrote up for them before they came to American News Channels such as CNN, FOX and so On!
They could simply say " WE WOULD STOP IF THE ROCKET's STOPPED "
" IT IS THAT SIMPLE "

BUT WAIT.... NO ITS NOT!!!

When these same Spokespersons went to news networks like " RT AMERICA " " PRESS TV " and so on... THEY WERE ASKED SOME SERIOUSLY TOUGH QUESTIONS and were basically humiliated because they could not answer them.

One Guy asked.. OKAY SO IF HAMAS IS THE PROBLEM... AND THE ONLY PROBLEM... THEN WHAT WAS THE PROBLEM BEFORE HAMAS WAS IN GAZA?
YOU STILL DID THIS Before Hamas... The guy didnt know the answer.

SO WHAT DID ISRAEL DO TO RT 4 WEEKS AGO FOR ASKING TOUGH QUESTIONS? ISRAEL BOMBED RT in GAZA! They bombed their station.
They also bombed Press Tv as well.

Israel bombed the press because they knew that these 2 channels .... by only telling the truth.... were the biggest threat to Israel.

But Israel was wrong! The whole world was watching! And just days after the conflict ended.... The whole word voted in favor of a Palestinian state

“Not afraid to stand alone.”

Since: Jun 09

Flat Lick Ky.

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#4
Dec 18, 2012
 
Freedom wrote:
Okay , As you know... Israel says that they want to negotiate the borders.
Well , When you want to negotiate something you must start somewhere!
SO where do you start?
Well , you start with THE LAW!!! THE WORLD LAW!!! THE INTERNATIONAL LAW!!
This is fair ... right? Let's start negotiating according to International Law!!
This is what the Palestinians did. Palestinians said " Hey , It is Illegal to Settle on this land because it is under military occupation "
" Also , International Law and Un Resolution 242 Says that The West Bank and Gaza Strip are occupied territories , So ....
Israel must leave all occupied territories and this will be our state!
There is a problem like i said before ...
Israel basically says at this point...
" WAIT A MINUTE... WE ALREADY MOVED THOUSANDS OF OUR PEOPLE THERE... SO WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO.... WE CAN"T MOVE THEM OUT "
Now...( THIS WAS THE IDEA OF THE SETTLEMENTS ALL ALONG )
( MOVE AS MANY PEOPLE THERE AS YOU CAN WHILE YOU CAN DO IT BECAUSE IF WE MOVE ENOUGH PEOPLE THERE.... THEY WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO FORCE THEM ALL OUT )
So Israel uses this argument when Palestinians start Negotiating on the Basis Of International Law.
So what did the Palestinians say in response to this...
" HEY, NO PROBLEM... THEY CAN STAY.... BUT THEY WILL NEED TO HAVE PALESTINIAN PAsSPORTS AND THEY WILL hAVE THE RIGHT TO LIVE HERE FOREVER "
This wasnt good enough for Israel Either!
Now most of the Negotiations are basically with the West Bank!
Any PALESTINIAN STATE WOULD HAVE TO INCLUDE A SAFE PASSAGE TO GAZA .. because it is cut off from The West Bank.
HAMAS IS IN CHARGE OF GAZA! HAMAS did NOT TAKE CONTROL OF GAZA! THEY WERE DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED BY THE PEOPlE OF GAZA!!!!
THe United States and Israel say that Hamas is a terrorist organization because of the rocket issue... but you have to know that....
Hamas is a movement for the freedom of Palestine.
If there was no Occupation... There would never be not even 1 rocket fired into Israel.
This is what the Israeli Spokespersons did not tell you in the memo that was wrote up for them before they came to American News Channels such as CNN, FOX and so On!
They could simply say " WE WOULD STOP IF THE ROCKET's STOPPED "
" IT IS THAT SIMPLE "
BUT WAIT.... NO ITS NOT!!!
When these same Spokespersons went to news networks like " RT AMERICA " " PRESS TV " and so on... THEY WERE ASKED SOME SERIOUSLY TOUGH QUESTIONS and were basically humiliated because they could not answer them.
One Guy asked.. OKAY SO IF HAMAS IS THE PROBLEM... AND THE ONLY PROBLEM... THEN WHAT WAS THE PROBLEM BEFORE HAMAS WAS IN GAZA?
YOU STILL DID THIS Before Hamas... The guy didnt know the answer.
SO WHAT DID ISRAEL DO TO RT 4 WEEKS AGO FOR ASKING TOUGH QUESTIONS? ISRAEL BOMBED RT in GAZA! They bombed their station.
They also bombed Press Tv as well.
Israel bombed the press because they knew that these 2 channels .... by only telling the truth.... were the biggest threat to Israel.
But Israel was wrong! The whole world was watching! And just days after the conflict ended.... The whole word voted in favor of a Palestinian state
Whats wrong with not having negotiations and not making demands? Show us that you are a peaceful people that Israel is mistreating. I've got to tell you as of now all we see is Israel defending itself.
Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#5
Dec 18, 2012
 
Limbertwig wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm going to try to break your book you are writing down. Please I dont need the history lesson, I'm 59yrs old.
""OF COURSE!!! WE WOULD LOVE NEGOTIATIONS! This is exactly what Palestinians have tried over and over and over again! But after the American Veto after Veto after Veto after Veto after Veto at the U.N., Negotiations got Palestinians NO WHERE!!! It got them NO WHERE FOR OVER 60 Years!""
..........What negotiations? Lay down your arms and act civilized,Take care of your children and the rest of the world will see you differently. Thats all it takes..........
But this was tried before!
The Violence only started during the 1st and 2nd Intifada's
Before this.... The violence was one sided! Israel did the same thing before this.

NOW... EVEN OBAMA SAID.... TO AIPAC... that ISRAEL MUST RETURN TO THE 1967 Borders.....
ISRAEL SAID NO AND TOLD HIM NO TO HIS FACE!!!!

SO you clearly see Obama wants the 2 state solution. And All He has to do is tell israel that if they do not return to the borders of 1967.... He will never veto any Resolution against Israel in the U.N.
Remember... every time a Resolution is pushed through the U.N. against Israel... 97 Percent of the world votes for this resolution. America veto's it.

Do you know that in 2009 Israel used white phosphorous against the civilian population of Gaza.
This was a war crime! When you breathe white phosphorous , you do not breathe it back out until you are DEAD!! It can reach temps of up to 1500 degrees (F)
But israel wants to talk about Iran!!!!??????

ISRAEL USED WHITE PHOSPHOROUS AGAINST Palestinians and poured it into the streets.
when you breathed the air.... the air went inside your body and cooked you from the inside out... to death... The world tried to punish Israel for this...... America Vetoed it !

Israel bombed a U.N. Elementary school! When you bomb a target.... you bomb by it's GPS COORDINATE!!! This is how you bomb. Certain GPS COORDINATES ARE CONSIDERED A " NO HIT LIST " Every military has a " NO HIT LIST OF GPS COORDINATES "
ISRAEL HAD ONE... THEY BOMBED THIS SCHOOL ANYWAY....
THE U.N. Called it a War Crime

Israel bombed a school bus taking young girls to college... the video was released and leaked..
It was horrifying to watch as the IDF COULD CLEARLY SEE GIRLS WITH PURSES GETTING ON A SCHOOL BUS.... and then they bombed them

The White Phosphorous
The Bombing of children in an elementary school
The School Bus Issue

I will tell you another one...

Israel flew over Gaza and dropped papers ....
Palestinians picked up these papers and they read.....
" GO TO ( THIS POINT ) IF YOU WANT TO BE SAFE... WE WILL NOT BOMB THIS AREA "

So ISRAEL GAVE THE PEOPLE ENOUGH TIME TO GET TO THIS AREA ...

AnD....
and...

ISRAEL BOMBED THE AREA THAT THEY TOLD EVERYONE TO GO TO....
THEY GOT THEM EXACTLY WHERE THEY: WANTED THEM

NOW.... I WANT TO TELL YOU AN EVEN MORE PERSONAL STORY
Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#6
Dec 18, 2012
 
I am getting married in a few months!

SHE IS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL WOMAN IN THE WORLD

SHE IS PALESTINIAN!

In 2009 ... she was talking to me on the phone during the war.
I MET HER IN PERSON BY THE WAY AND I HAVE KNOWN HER FOR 7 YEARS

So anyway we were talking on the phone.....
she was scared

her phone gets a beep....
she answers the beep

it is a pre recorded message kinda like the call you get from telemarketers at home...

" HELLO !!! YOUR HOME WILL BE BOMBED WITHIN SECONDS, PLEASE LEAVE YOUR HOUSE IMMEDIATELY "

It repeats

" HELLO !!! YOUR HOME WILL BE BOMBED WITHIN SECONDS ... PLEASE LEAVE YOUR HOUSE IMMEDIATELY "

OVER AND OVER AGAIN

AND OVER

Yeah

This is a very personal issue for me

but since then... right before the latest conflict..
we got her out of Gaza....
But she is considered what is known as a Refugee
She is not a citizen of any country
but she will be free soon

I bring all of this to the barbourville topix because i know it is a small town

i know that most people there probably don't know what is going on and probably dont care

but if i can reach out to 1 person...

My job here is finished

“Not afraid to stand alone.”

Since: Jun 09

Flat Lick Ky.

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#7
Dec 18, 2012
 

Judged:

1

Freedom wrote:
<quoted text>
But this was tried before!
The Violence only started during the 1st and 2nd Intifada's
Before this.... The violence was one sided! Israel did the same thing before this.
NOW... EVEN OBAMA SAID.... TO AIPAC... that ISRAEL MUST RETURN TO THE 1967 Borders.....
ISRAEL SAID NO AND TOLD HIM NO TO HIS FACE!!!!
SO you clearly see Obama wants the 2 state solution. And All He has to do is tell israel that if they do not return to the borders of 1967.... He will never veto any Resolution against Israel in the U.N.
Remember... every time a Resolution is pushed through the U.N. against Israel... 97 Percent of the world votes for this resolution. America veto's it.
Do you know that in 2009 Israel used white phosphorous against the civilian population of Gaza.
This was a war crime! When you breathe white phosphorous , you do not breathe it back out until you are DEAD!! It can reach temps of up to 1500 degrees (F)
But israel wants to talk about Iran!!!!??????
ISRAEL USED WHITE PHOSPHOROUS AGAINST Palestinians and poured it into the streets.
when you breathed the air.... the air went inside your body and cooked you from the inside out... to death... The world tried to punish Israel for this...... America Vetoed it !
Israel bombed a U.N. Elementary school! When you bomb a target.... you bomb by it's GPS COORDINATE!!! This is how you bomb. Certain GPS COORDINATES ARE CONSIDERED A " NO HIT LIST " Every military has a " NO HIT LIST OF GPS COORDINATES "
ISRAEL HAD ONE... THEY BOMBED THIS SCHOOL ANYWAY....
THE U.N. Called it a War Crime
Israel bombed a school bus taking young girls to college... the video was released and leaked..
It was horrifying to watch as the IDF COULD CLEARLY SEE GIRLS WITH PURSES GETTING ON A SCHOOL BUS.... and then they bombed them
The White Phosphorous
The Bombing of children in an elementary school
The School Bus Issue
I will tell you another one...
Israel flew over Gaza and dropped papers ....
Palestinians picked up these papers and they read.....
" GO TO ( THIS POINT ) IF YOU WANT TO BE SAFE... WE WILL NOT BOMB THIS AREA "
So ISRAEL GAVE THE PEOPLE ENOUGH TIME TO GET TO THIS AREA ...
AnD....
and...
ISRAEL BOMBED THE AREA THAT THEY TOLD EVERYONE TO GO TO....
THEY GOT THEM EXACTLY WHERE THEY: WANTED THEM
NOW.... I WANT TO TELL YOU AN EVEN MORE PERSONAL STORY
Hamas is putting weapons there what do you expect Israel to do?
Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#8
Dec 18, 2012
 
back to Obama....

Now... If Obama told Aipac that Israel must go to the 1967 borders...
and Israel told him No...
Why wouldnt he put pressure on Israel ?????

He could simply stop Israel from doing this and force them to return to the 1967 borders by which Israel was orginially created on!

WHY DONT OBAMA DO THIS....

IT IS SIMPLE... HE CAN NOT!!!! WHY NOT?

There is a powerful Jewish lobby that controls the American Media and Corporations and the American Government!

If you win the Jewish Lobby Over.... You will probably be the next President of the United States.

This was why you saw that in the Presidential debates.... Romney and Obama were fighting hard over which one " Sucked Netanyahu's D...K the best...

IN WHAT OTHER COUNTRY ... WOULD YOU SEE CANDIDATES.... FIGHTING OVER WHICH ONE.... DID THE MOST FOR ANOTHER COUNTRY????
IT SOUNDS CRAZZZZYYYY You would never see this in any other country but in America ...

Why? Because This Country is controlled by the Jewish Lobby....

RICK SANCHEZ FROM CNN ... remember him? The Hispanic Guy that was on during the day... yeah... he basically told the world on xm radio that he could not say , or report stories the way he wanted to because of the Jewish Lobby that runs Cnn.
He was fired for this!

You see.... The Jewish Lobby is the reason why when you watch american news channels , that 98 percent of everyone talking are saying things in a " PRO ISRAELI " way!!!

The Jewish Lobby makes sure that America will take money from its own citizens .... to balance the budget.... before it will take 1 cent that this country gives to Israel!!!!!

The first thing you would do in an economic crisis is to cut funding to Israel.
They get 3 billion just in .... " HEY HERE IS SOME MONEY TO SPEND " this type of aid... this does not include military funding!
It is estimated that The United States gives Israel over 10 BILLION per year in aid money!

So why take from the American people? WHY NOT TAKE FROM ISRAEL WHEN WE ARE IN THE DUMPS!!!!

It must be because of the lobby

If Obama is for a 2 state solution and for the return of Israel to the 1967 borders... but does not make it happen... THEN IT MUST BE BECAUSE OF THE LOBBY
Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#9
Dec 18, 2012
 
Limbertwig wrote:
<quoted text>
Hamas is putting weapons there what do you expect Israel to do?
do palestinians not have the right to protect themselves?

what are they supposed to do
Freedom

Decatur, GA

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#10
Dec 18, 2012
 
Limbertwig wrote:
<quoted text>
Hamas is putting weapons there what do you expect Israel to do?
SO WHEN YOU CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS THIS YEAR ... AND THE BIRTH OF JESUS...
U KNOW HE WAS BORN IN BETHLEHEM

I just want you to think about how the people in Bethlehem have to live today
YEP.... Its still called Bethlehem

They live under a brutal Israeli Occupation .. Bethlehem's citizen's are murdered every single day

I want you to remember the Pregnant Palestinian woman who lived in Bethlehem who DIED ON THE STREET IN LABOR BECAUSE ISRAEL REFUSED TO LET HER DRIVE TO THE HOSPITAL BECAUSE IT WAS A JEWISH ONLY HIGHWAY IN HER OWN LAND!!!!
THIS WAS NOT IN ISRAEL!!!

SHE DIED IN LABOR BECAUSE ISRAEL WOULD NOT LET HER TRAVEL ON THE HIGHWAY TO GET TO THE HOSPITAL BECAUSE ONLY JEWS WERE ALLOWED ON THE ROAD

IF YOU WERE NOT A JEW... U WAS NOT ALLOWED TO TRAVEL ON THE RoAD

Please think of the people of Bethlehem

“Not afraid to stand alone.”

Since: Jun 09

Flat Lick Ky.

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#11
Dec 18, 2012
 
If I was the leader of the Palestinian People I would tell them to lay down their arms. I would get rid of the terrorists and their supporters. Then the west would stand with you. That doesn't mean we would stop being Israels ally. You must stop the fighting so we can know who is at fault. As it looks to Americans now Israel i defending itself.

“Not afraid to stand alone.”

Since: Jun 09

Flat Lick Ky.

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#12
Dec 18, 2012
 
Freedom wrote:
<quoted text>
SO WHEN YOU CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS THIS YEAR ... AND THE BIRTH OF JESUS...
U KNOW HE WAS BORN IN BETHLEHEM
I just want you to think about how the people in Bethlehem have to live today
YEP.... Its still called Bethlehem
They live under a brutal Israeli Occupation .. Bethlehem's citizen's are murdered every single day
I want you to remember the Pregnant Palestinian woman who lived in Bethlehem who DIED ON THE STREET IN LABOR BECAUSE ISRAEL REFUSED TO LET HER DRIVE TO THE HOSPITAL BECAUSE IT WAS A JEWISH ONLY HIGHWAY IN HER OWN LAND!!!!
THIS WAS NOT IN ISRAEL!!!
SHE DIED IN LABOR BECAUSE ISRAEL WOULD NOT LET HER TRAVEL ON THE HIGHWAY TO GET TO THE HOSPITAL BECAUSE ONLY JEWS WERE ALLOWED ON THE ROAD
IF YOU WERE NOT A JEW... U WAS NOT ALLOWED TO TRAVEL ON THE RoAD
Please think of the people of Bethlehem
If the Palestinians can afford weapons they can afford their own Hospital. Stop the weapons and build a Hospital.

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