Wednesday at 6: Letters from Japan - NewsChannel 5.com - Nashvi...

[Dreamgirl]

Sally wrote:

<quoted text>
What I can say to Toland is, to keep away from Savoie and people like Arudou Debito is better for you, if you are really an ordinary father just wants to meet your daughter. Please think what Savoid did for his wife. People who support him can never be trusted.
I don't know if Toland know Arudou Debito in person. But, I know Arudou Debito is watching this forum often and very interested in Toland. Be careful. Please research what Arudou has been doing in Japan before joining.
Many People won't trust Toland if Arudou Debito support you. He call Japanese "Little Yellow Jap" and has caused so many troubles in Japan so far...
It's a waste of time for you to join people like Savoie. I'll stand by you if you are really a genuine father.

Because he has praised Chris Savoie, Paul Toland has already lost my respect. I don't trust him, and I don't believe he is telling the whole truth. And my reaction is typical, as Sally is saying.

The same thing applies to Debito Arudou, who in some ways resembles Chris Savoie, such as in the way he mercilessly uses people and discards them when they are no longer of use.

Do you know Debito Arudou's argument in his Japan Times article? He argued that Japan needs to treat people like Chris Savoie very well and let them have access to their children, otherwise fewer foreign men will want to marry Japanese women, and this will hurt Japan because of the population decline.

Another thing, both Chris Savoie and Debito Arudou are Americans who took Japanese citizenship but kept the American citizenship.(However, Arudou was forced to drop American citizenship after boasting about having both on his website). And of course both of them do not have access to their children after divorce, and blame everyone but themselves for that.

[Sally]

Dreamgirl wrote:

<quoted text>
Because he has praised Chris Savoie, Paul Toland has already lost my respect. I don't trust him, and I don't believe he is telling the whole truth.

I already noticed several things what Pere Paul Toland didn't tell.
So, I don't trust him.

On the other hand, maybe, his emotion for his daughter is true.
So, I hope he will act like other ordinary fathers and stop joining these people.

[Sally]

Sorry, I misspelled.

"Peter Paul Toland" is correct.

[Dreamgirl]

Sally wrote:

<quoted text>
On the other hand, maybe, his emotion for his daughter is true.

Maybe, but I don't think so. The child was an infant when custody was granted to the mother. Reports of him sneaking around to see the girl make me think he should be arrested for stalking.

He shows absolutely no common sense in how to approach such a problem. Rather, he wants to win enough sympathy to gain something (custody) by force. That will never happen.

We can thank Chris Savoie for showing us that most of these fathers probably deserve not too much sympathy, if any at all.

In my opinion, anyone (such as Toland) who praises a monster like Chris Savoie is forever unqualified to receive the slightest sympathy or respect. Nor would I give him any advice how to solve his problems.

[Sally]

Dreamgirl wrote:

<quoted text>
Maybe, but I don't think so. The child was an infant when custody was granted to the mother.

Reading his court record, Peter Paul Toland and his Japanese wife, Etsuko, were separated in Japan when she was still pregnant. And like you pointed out, custody was granted to the mother when their daughter was a infant.

I saw several pictures of Toland with their daughter.
But, I suppose he haven't met their daughter often even at that time, because they were separated already at that time.

But, nobody knows how he feels. So, I advised him such.

[Joseph]

Dreamgirl wrote:

Reports of him sneaking around to see the girl make me think he should be arrested for stalking.

Dreamgirl,

This quote is absolutely unbelievable.

Paul Toland’s daughter was taken from him, where he was living with her (Negishi Navy Family Housing), while he was away at work, when she was only nine months old. He has done nothing wrong, yet he has been completely removed from his daughter’s life, thanks to the ridiculous manner in which the Japanese legal system handles cases such as these. Now you want to compound that miscarriage of justice by suggesting that he should be arrested for stalking his own daughter? Honestly? Is this really what you are saying? You’re telling us that instead of being moved to tears by the story of a father whose daughter was taken from him, is not allowed to see her, and is pitifully forced into talking to her ex-soccer coaches in order to try to learn what she – once again, his own daughter - is like, you want him arrested?

Dreamgirl wrote:

We can thank Chris Savoie for showing us that most of these fathers probably deserve not too much sympathy, if any at all.

Additionally, I would like to know how you can possibly use the (desperate, but admittedly foolish) actions of one man to judge every other father in cases like these? What sort of logic is that? I don’t think that Paul Toland has ever said that he supports the specific actions that Christopher Savoie took. I would suspect that he, and the other fathers, merely understand what it’s like to live with the knowledge that you may never see your children again. I would suspect that they understand how the pain of that might cause Christopher to do what he did, and that they welcome the attention that it has brought to the issue. Prior to the Savoie story, Japan, the media, and the rest of the world, wasn’t paying much attention to any of any of this. It was being ignored, and every day that passes is another day of their children’s lives that these fathers have missed.

Have you even read any of the facts with regards to the Toland case, or any of the others that have been cited as examples here? If you have not, I would suggest that you do so before you condemn all the fathers as bad people undeserving of your sympathy, and throw your support behind the current system being employed in Japan. The Savoie case was a poor one. Paul Toland’s case - and the others mentioned here (Paul Wong, Murray Wood, and Samuel Lui’s)– are not. They are clear examples of foreign fathers being horribly mistreated by Japan’s courts. Read all the facts.

[bkh]

Can someone send me the link for Toland's case pls?
I am very curious about that case now
I am amazed about this forum. Now it is no longer talking about Savoie but Toland case...
interesting.

I have to say I don't condem fathers who have lost their kids .. BUT I am upset that the father of abducted children associates themselves with Savoie case.

i think each case should be treated differently.
I do not agree for the laws with Japan and I hope the fathers of other cases will be able to see their kids again..

Instead of attacking the fathers or mothers.. let's talk about what we can do.
How can we tell the kids that their loved daddy and mommy are waiting for them?
Is there a network where the kids can be informed what is happening to their missing dad or mom?

Overall the forum that i have seen there is so much hatred. People making racist comments about Japanese and I think it needs to be stopped.

We need to take a step back and discuss what we can do.
Also we need to find out both side stories. We need to have more information on every party..
instead one sided.

Like Toland case how can we find out about the exwife feeling since she is no longer alive (that is what I understood)
is there someone who knows more about it..

It also goes with Savoie case.. We hear only from christohper side but how about more info about Noriko side..

Overall let's not attack each other with racial comments or calling a person stupid... which I have seen a lot in some forums..

Dear toland
you might be a nice guy but I am very skeptic..
because I have met military personel in Japan who basically told me that Japanese woman are easy to get and easy to use...
when I heard that statement I was upset and told couple of people to reeducate themselves..
Now because of that statement I try not to judge every military personal but the overall image of military personal in Japan is tarnished..
I think it goes with every culture.. One bad apple makes every one look bad sometimes..

[bkh]

Some Japanese law needs to be changed.. however
as some ppl on Facebook suggest to boycott Japan product is not right.

To the fathers and mothers who can not see their children.
I hope one day you will reunite with the kids..
Also I believe the truth will come out one day and the kids will find out.. They will judge each parent as they find out the truth.

[Curious]

Joseph, Samual Lui is not a clear example of a foreign father being horribly mistreated by the Japanese courts. The courts in that case did what was within their power to do.

[Joseph]

Curious,

I will rephrase what I said with regards to the Samuel Lui case. He wasn't mistreated by the Japanese courts, he was mistreated by the current set of laws those courts enforce. Does this change anything? No. He still suffered the same injustice regardless of which "word(s)" takes the blame.

For those unfamiliar with the Samuel Lui case, you can read about it here: http://www.crnjapan.net/The_Japan_Childrens_R...

Basically, it boils down to this. The mother and the father lived in the United States. The mother was abusive, and was actually arrested for that abuse. The father was then given custody of the child, with the mother receiving visitation rights. During one of those visitations, the mother abducted the child to Japan.

The father, Sameul Lui, then went to Japan to try to get his child back through the Japanese court system. The Osaka District Court recognized that custody of the child was legally his, and an additional appellate court confirmed that ruling. They ruled in his favor, but because the court has no power to physically remove the child from the mother that he was currently living with, there was nothing they could do to enforce their ruling.

The mother dragged this out in the courts for three years, and then filed for sole custody of the son that she had abducted. The court then granted her that custody.

Again, you can argue about the choice of words I used, but it doesn’t make any difference. It is absolutely ridiculous that a court could recognize the mother was in the wrong, rule in the father’s favor, but not be able to do anything about it. It’s even more ridiculous that if he were to try the same thing that she did, in this case taking his son out of Japan, that same court would have laws that they would enforce.

[Curious]

Joseph, it does make a difference, and the wording is important because one of the claims is that Japanese courts always rule against foreign fathers.

The 30,000 yen/day penalty imposed by the court against the mother for not complying with the court's visitation order could have had real effect if the mother had had assets.

Japan is not the only country that will not forcefully remove a child from a home.

I don't disagree with your general analysis of Japanese law, but that is the state of the law. He should never had had to deal with Japanese courts in the first place.

My concern is when the state of Japanese law is used as justification to move a divorce to a more favorable jurisdiction. The way that CRC Japan rationalizes that in its "Success Stories" page is very troubling. In such cases, claims about Japanese law, including about property division, should be very critically examined. This critical examination must be particularized to the options available in a particular case, such as a high asset case.

[Sally]

Peter moved to revise the commissioner's ruling. He asserted that Japan had not yet issued a jurisdictional decision in the matter and that the Pierce County Superior Court "should not dismiss the action in Washington until the outcome ... is determined in Japan."
2005.6.14 without dismissing his Washington action, Peter filed for divorce in Arlington, Virginia.
2005.9.20 Peter filed a Civil Rule (CR) 41 motion4 to dismiss his Washington dissolution action in Pierce County Superior Court.
2005.9.29 At the Pierce County Superior Court hearing on Peter's motion to dismiss, Etsuko informed the court that the Tokyo family court
had asserted jurisdiction over the parties, the marriage, and their child and had, in fact, issued a decree of dissolution.
2005.9.29(the same day as the entry of the decree of dissolution) Peter had avoided the commencement of the appeal period by discharging his attorneys in Japan.
2006.2.24 Peter filed a motion to lift the stay in Pierce County Superior Court, asserting that, contrary to his earlier claim of Virginia domicile, he was domiciled in Washington.
This statement contradicted his September 2005 statement that he was domiciled in Virginia for 15 months.
Peter, in his September 2005 motion to dismiss, represented to the Pierce County Superior Court that "it makes no economic sense for Washington to continue to resolve the case here.
The dissolution was only pending in Washington because [Peter] was domiciled in Washington. His domicile has now switched to Virginia."
2006.5.10 She told the court that the Japanese divorce became final, and, therefore, moved to dismiss the Washington action.(Erika was 3 years old.)
2006.6.2 the Pierce County Superior Court dismissed Peter's case.
Peter argues that "Washington possessed UCCJEA jurisdiction" because his child "was domiciled in Washington and could not be domiciled in Japan."
But, the child's home state is defined as "the state in which a child lived with a parent ... for at least six consecutive months immediately before the commencement of a child custody proceeding."
Etsuko and their child have resided solely in Japan since 1999.
Under these circumstances Peter's appeal was regarded as "frivolous" and on this basis she was awarded her attorney fees and costs in Washington court.

[Sally]

Sorry for posting long comment above.

Joseph, I misunderstood one thing.
Peter Paul Toland and Etsuko Futagi were separated when their daughter, Erika, was 9 month old.

They divorced in Tokyo family court on May, 2006.(Erika was 3 years old.)
Etsuko was employed and economically independent, and the Tokyo family court awarded her full custody.

[Sally]

According to statistics, around 17 percents of father get full custody in Japan.

Around 30 years ago, it's common that father got full custody in Japan. You know, the former Prime Minister, Koizimi, took full custody of 2 boys. It's after Japan was defeated the war that women came to get full custody. GHQ changed Japanese family law drastically and tried to achieve women's social status.

[Sally]

Wow, sorry again.

Toland divorced on September 29, 2005, when Erika was 2 years old. And Etsuko informed the fact to Washington court on May, 2006.

Their divorce is a bit complicating.

[Sally]

According to the National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS) in US on 2008, nearly 75 percent of all child custody awards are made to the mother. Only about 10 percent of child custody awards are made to fathers. The rest of the child custody awards involve some sort of joint custody arrangement.

In Japan, there's no "joint custody". Nearly 20 percents of all child custody awards are made to the father.
Then, there's no big difference between US and Japan about custody.

[Dreamgirl]

Joseph wrote:

<quoted text>
I don’t think that Paul Toland has ever said that he supports the specific actions that Christopher Savoie took. I would suspect that he, and the other fathers, merely understand what it’s like to live with the knowledge that you may never see your children again... Read all the facts.

I'd suggest YOU get your facts straight. Toland DID INDEED extol Chris Savoie and praise his vile actions, on this forum and on other forums, and in letters made public.

Pretty much this fact alone eliminates all of the "arguments" in your verbiage about what you "suspect" to be true.

You want people to feel sorry for someone, when there appears to be no reason to feel sorry for him.

It's surprising that it was not enough for him to sneak around and learn from soccer coaches what his daughter was like. That should have been enough. So yes, the fact that this was not enough does make me think he should have been arrested for stalking. Clearly he expressed admiration for what Chris Savoie did, so he should not be allowed anywhere near his daughter.

Furthermore, Sally has presented all the documented details of Toland's case, which all show that he has no claim whatsoever to any custody.

Anyone who supports Toland is just as ignorant or vile as those few supporting Chris Savoie.

[Paul Toland]

Fascinating, that I am a subject of interest for the vile commments of Japanese government agents like Sally and Dreamgirl, who apparently know nothing about me or my life. So Sally and Dreamgirl are basically saying that an only living parent should be charged with stalking for trying to see their only living child who has been abducted and is being wrongly retained by a third party who is not a parent to the child. Following this same logic would lead me to believe, then, that they would also want Shigeru and Sakie Yokota charged with stalking if they, as the only living parents of Megumi Yokota, went to North Korea to try to see their daugher, who is being held by third-party non-parents. My case is no different than Megumi's case, as I am the only living parent of Erika, and Erika is being held by a third-party non-parent. My case is not even a case of parental child abduction, because that would imply that a parent was holding my child. It is rather a straightforward criminal kidnapping, since a non-parent is holding her.

[Someone who knows]

Paul Toland is not the victim. He only tells one side of the story based on his distorted perceptions. The truth is Paul Toland cannot accept that he is wrong and not in control. He total lack of cultural understanding and unwillingness to accept changed doomed their relationship from the start. Trust me I now.

[Paul Toland]

The current abductor, Akiko Futagi, is free to tell her side of the story, but I have never heard anything from her. I have been trying to find out her side of the story since Etsuko's death, but all I get is silence.