Transit line potential discussed

Hundreds of people came out yesterday to learn about and help shape plans for an east-west transit route in Baltimore - a project that would cost more than $1 billion and could go from dream to groundbreaking ...

[153bal]

This project should really have been heavy rail in my opinion.

[Fed up in Towson]

$1 billion?!?? Hasn't anyone read about the horrfic state of Baltimore City schools and drug-related violence that's on the front page of this liberal rag every day? This is insane. This rotting carcass of a city better get its priorities together instead of lusting after the latest shiny new toy ... especially while the rest of us are forever footing the bill for all of its problems.

[Theo]

This is just another example of liberals gone wild, using our tax money for their social engineering follies. Light rail on the East-West corridor would be a major waste. It would be even less effective than the north-south Light Rail, which has yet to come close to reducing congestion in 15 years of service. Why are planning officials resistant to upgrading MARC service, which can readily support those who choose to take east-west rail transportation, at a fraction of the cost of another light rail folly?

If we wanted an effective transportation solution for a billion dollars, would see the freeways finished, add a few cheap MARC stations and run MARC trains inside the Beltway more frequently.

[Todd]

Fed up in Towson is exactly right. There seemed to be absolutely no skepticism being expressed as to the prospects for this transit line. All the people quoted seemed to be directly involved with transit programs in other cities. What about the opinion of average citizens in those cities? Would they agree with their planners rosy assessments?$83.3 million dollars a mile hardly seems like an efficient use of funds to me. Seems like we could get a much higher return on our investment by just improving the existing road ways and bus system, but I guess that isn't sexy enough for Sheila Dixon's administration. They would rather move people emotionally than move them physically.

[Mar]

Are you crazy? If there actually was a functioning transportation systemk in Baltimore people would use it. The current fragmented lines are only convenient if your start and end points are lucky enough to be right on it! If it is convenient people will ride it.

Theo wrote:

This is just another example of liberals gone wild, using our tax money for their social engineering follies. Light rail on the East-West corridor would be a major waste. It would be even less effective than the north-south Light Rail, which has yet to come close to reducing congestion in 15 years of service. Why are planning officials resistant to upgrading MARC service, which can readily support those who choose to take east-west rail transportation, at a fraction of the cost of another light rail folly?
If we wanted an effective transportation solution for a billion dollars, would see the freeways finished, add a few cheap MARC stations and run MARC trains inside the Beltway more frequently.

[Red Line Fan]

anyone tried to drive from 95 to fells point or canton lately? it's absolute traffic chaos. parking? not a chance. Given the awesome new development down that way (harbor east, canton crossing, brewers hill, etc.), the red line is exactly what we need in southeast.

[Richard]

I am in favor of this "liberals gone wild" idea. With gas prices through the roof, traffic at its worst, alternatives are needed. And, actually, Todd, regarding "average citizens," many of those people were at the convention center. Anyone could come, and public opinion has been sought after repeatedly.

[Fed up in Towson]

Red Line Fan wrote:

anyone tried to drive from 95 to fells point or canton lately? it's absolute traffic chaos. parking? not a chance. Given the awesome new development down that way (harbor east, canton crossing, brewers hill, etc.), the red line is exactly what we need in southeast.

Yeah, but much of that new development is vacant due to the cratered housing market and the completely insane property taxes in Baltimore City, which Herr Dixon refuses to lower (presumably so she can pay for trinkets like her new rail line, which she'll probably name after herself).

I've got news for you ... there's congestion EVERYWHERE, in every major metro area of the US. Why is Canton / Fells Point so special that it deserves a $1 billion project? With less than a 40% graduation rate in the city schools and rampant drug-related violence, this should be so far down on the priority list that it can't even be considered until the city provides some acceptable level of education and safety for its citizens. What am I missing?

[John F Kestler]

How about us on the East side? Why Timonium to the airport? Why Owings Mills to downtown? Why now proposing Social Security in western Baltimore County to the John's Hopkins complex? Why not Middle River to Downtown? We on the East side pay just as much, if not more taxes than the rest of the Baltimore metro area. Why are we always sucking hind tit? Is this reverse racially motivated? I wonder!

[TechBalt]

Light Rail is a bad idea. Heavy rail is a good idea:
http://www.examiner.com/x-284-Baltimore-Polit...

[jht]

the fatal flaw in all of these plans is the lack of express service. the taxpayers who pay for mass transit would use it if they didn't have to stop at every stop on the way to downtown.

[Fells Point MD]

The Red Line will split Fell's Point in half, eliminate 150-200 parking spaces in an area where parking is already a mess, and remove parking lanes on Aliceanna, Fleet and/or Eastern and turn them into traffic lanes. Imagine a train or illegal tractor trailers driving in front of your house where the use to be a parking lane. Think of the noise, vibrations and danger as it's just a matter of time before a speeder, of which there are many, goes of the road and hits someone on the sidewalk or hits a house. Red Line through Fell's Point s a MISTAKE and the community will fight this every inch of the way!!!!

[Fells Point MD]

What chance do you give the City and State doing this right? Look at the current light rail and ask if you would want that coming doing your street! Property values will plummet for those on the actual street that has parking removed! Will these citizens be compensated??? Also, the SE Transportation study, which was to be delivered August 2007, moved to September, then January 2008 "at the latest", stlll has not been issued. So it's now going on 9 months late!! Do kid your self, the City and State is not looking out for the Southeast area, then just want to jam this down our throats and tell us it's for our own good. I seriously think we could spend a billion more wisely elsewhere. As far as traffic through Fell's Point and Canton, look to see how many of those cars have more than 1 person per car. I think you'll find very few do and those drivers, who love their own car, will not use the Red Line!!!

[Matty P]

I honestly believe that Baltimore is actively trying to achieve the title of "Worlds most ridiculous Mass Transit system in the world!" I am a huge proponent of mass transit, and would use it, if it were even mildly functional. The RED LINE is another huge mistake. Scrap THE WHOLE SYSTEM and START OVER! This city will always be the butt of jokes when this is how it spends its money.

[Horrified In Harford]

Here we go again! The meeting at the Arena must have been in the barn burner class, every bit equal to the Sales Hype and Self Improvement Seminars at the venue. There is one tiny problem with this. Who gets to pay the bartender for the nice drinks and hospitality?

Why, why! Everyone else in the State of Maryland, dummy! One Billion dollars to chase a fantasy of, "...a shining, alabaster city, my friends..." Sigh!

Neat deal. City politicos can promote it. City locals can demand micro management of all of it. Oh, and where to send the bills? To the taxpayers - including the very poor and those on fixed incomes - throughout the Happy Empire of Merry Land! Pfui! If one wishes to throw a part, best make arrangments to pay for it out of one's own account...

s/ Horrified.........

[Neil]

I'm trying to figure out conservatives' opposition to mass transit? Why are they opposed to something that will make this city more efficient? With gas prices going up, with a huge influx of people moving to the area because of BRAC, do you really think that widening the roads is the answer when we could easily get many people off the roads and across town faster? Opposition boggles the mind. Ah, I get it. Don't like the giver, so shoot the gift.

Now, I am opposed to the light rail. I've seen the entire proposed system, and it looks good, and it looks better if it were underground. A light rail will reduce the property values of the streets they're on, but an underground heavy rail will not.

Great cities have these systems.

[john c]

I hope we will finally connect our transit system to Penn Station and, with it, the rest of the national Amtrak and Marc rail system. I can't think of one city in the world that has a train station that is NOT connected to its subway(s).

[Fells Point MD]

To John C. The current Red Line plans do not connect the current light rail with the proposed Red Line - users of either will have to walk two blocks to change lines. Ridiculous I know, but this is the current plan. Please get someone with a little sanity involved in this planning process!!!

[Fed up in Towson]

Neil wrote:

Opposition boggles the mind. Ah, I get it. Don't like the giver, so shoot the gift.

Gift? Who do you think is "giving" the $1 billion? That would be us, the taxpayers. Besides, do you really think people associated with BRAC would seriously living downtown, surrounded by crime with awful schools while paying insane property taxes? Come on.

If you want Baltimore to be a "great city," trying getting above a 40% high school graduation rate and keep the citizens from killing each other first. That's where the $1 billion should go -- period. You have to be at least average or even "acceptable" before you can begin to visualize greatness.

[Mitch]

john c wrote:

I hope we will finally connect our transit system to Penn Station and, with it, the rest of the national Amtrak and Marc rail system. I can't think of one city in the world that has a train station that is NOT connected to its subway(s).

You can take the light rail connector (currently out of service) to State Center and then walk 3 blocks through empty streets to the subway. What do you mean Penn Station isn't connected to public transit!?!?!

I just hope the red line will actually go the places that its riders want (unlike the north/south light rail). Camden Yards, Pratt Street, the Inner Harbor, Harbor East, Fells Point, Canton, Canton Crossing. There are a significant number of people who live in the Fells Point/Canton areas today that drive to work because they 1) don't have a direct bus option or 2) can't figure the direct bus option. Offer them an easy route that saves money ($64/month for your transit pass vs.$120+/month for parking), and this will be heavily traveled. Plus the tourists who visit downtown can go from the stadium to Canton without driving and re-parking.

If only the north-south line served Charles Street and Mt. Vernon, it too would be usable downtown. Instead, it's slow and travels down abandoned Howard Street (which was abandoned before light rail).

Please don't build a red line that is as slow from one end to the other as the current light rail. Other cities have functional light rail (Portland, Denver), so hopefully Baltimore follows their lead.