Bible study rules for public schools ...

Bible study rules for public schools proposed

There are 159660 comments on the The Courier-Journal story from Feb 10, 2010, titled Bible study rules for public schools proposed. In it, The Courier-Journal reports that:

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Courier-Journal.

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

http://www.pixoto.com/quantumm

#99907 Apr 16, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
In a pig's eye.
You have the right to strongly disagree even though all I stated have stated has been stated by the right for decades... Is part of the NRA's foundation statements and has been the basis of those that support the Legal ability for Law Abide citizens to have guns for as long as I can remember...

Satanic Priest

“There is no god”

Since: Jul 12

War, WV

#99908 Apr 16, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>I'm glad I don't read S.P.'s bible.
King James 1611.
What bible do you read?
Maybe you should give the Satonicon a try

Satanic Priest

“There is no god”

Since: Jul 12

War, WV

#99909 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Look up the Proclamation of the Family from the LDS church. That's a good start
Nope, I want to read it from one of you guys. I prefer to hear it from curious or YAA as I like comedy

“I'll think about it.”

Since: Nov 07

central Florida

#99910 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm sure you either have, or will be, at a point in your life where a miracle would be welcomed. Think then about how you were against the possibility of one.
Silly man, I have experienced many serendipitous conincidences in my life.

The latest one, a couple of years ago, was when a deadly tornado missed my house by 100 yards. Neighbors lost trees and had house damage. Some, though not in my immediate area, died.
I didn't even lose a wind chime.

No gods necessary.

What you call a "miracle" I simply call random chance.

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#99911 Apr 16, 2013
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
You have the right to strongly disagree even though all I stated have stated has been stated by the right for decades... Is part of the NRA's foundation statements and has been the basis of those that support the Legal ability for Law Abide citizens to have guns for as long as I can remember...
Yada yada. Believing a lie does not make it a truth - no matter how many years it's been fed you.
Why do three quarters of NRA members disagree with the statements of NRA's leadership? Because the NRA leadership is in bed with the manufacturers and retailers. In the last couple of decades they've become nothing but fear mongering shills.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#99912 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone has their faults, even prophets. Same with Jonah. He didn't like Ninevites. You could say he was predjudice against them. God taught him a lesson that he never really did swallow.
One guy got mad at Smith for not spelling his name right in a revelation for his mission call and left the church. Did his bad spelling make him less of a prophet?
Brigham's perceived racism to me seems unacceptable, but at that time it probably sounded pretty normal in America. Sad but true. Maybe that's why no one questioned it then. But since then, every prophet has proclaimed that this tendency was not inspired. Not was it original. Many Christian pastors then thought black skin was the curse of Cain. Maybe this made a lot of sense to him so he ran with it and expounded on it.
We are encouraged to pray about the things our prophet and apostles tell us. We need to get our own confirmation from the Holy Ghost of its truth.
Well of course you know persons of color were not allowed in the priesthood until the seventies, so your claim of all the prophets condemning Brigham's racism seems to fail. Clearly no prophet got a memo from god to put a full stop to Brigham's racist policies untill relatively recently.

So what good is it to have a prophet that fails to get the true picture of what god wants? Seems kind of pointless and condusive to false beliefs, which it clearly lead to.

The policy made me realize the church was not the true church as claimed. Would a god that really wanted the Church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints to be the one true church allow for a prophet to make false policies so large that it would lead to followers to leave the church? Seems like a giant red flag. Seems you give these red flags a pass.

So just how can one determine a true church if they give all failures a pass?

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#99913 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Worthiness is a matter between man and God. We do not compare to each other. That's God's job to judge.
So is god judging who is in the Mormon priesthood? You said those that are worthy, your words, not mine. So now you divert? Is god judging who is a prophet? This is how I judge claims of prophets, if the prophet says something that is clearly immoral, then he is not gods spokeperson, period.
How do you judge who is a prophet? Do you think Muhummad was one of gods prophets? If not, then please tell me why?

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#99914 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone has their faults, even prophets. Same with Jonah. He didn't like Ninevites. You could say he was predjudice against them. God taught him a lesson that he never really did swallow.
One guy got mad at Smith for not spelling his name right in a revelation for his mission call and left the church. Did his bad spelling make him less of a prophet?
Brigham's perceived racism to me seems unacceptable, but at that time it probably sounded pretty normal in America. Sad but true. Maybe that's why no one questioned it then. But since then, every prophet has proclaimed that this tendency was not inspired. Not was it original. Many Christian pastors then thought black skin was the curse of Cain. Maybe this made a lot of sense to him so he ran with it and expounded on it.
We are encouraged to pray about the things our prophet and apostles tell us. We need to get our own confirmation from the Holy Ghost of its truth.
Their is a massive difference between a mistake like a spelling error and making a church policy that lasted for many decades that was discriminatory. To make such a comparison shows how your mind justifies massive failures.

And yes, many Christians thought the mark of Cain was all black persons. And this is why no one should follow ancient books as if it were some absolute truth.

If prophets really had some sort of line to god, then any possible confusion on this mark of Cain should have never existed, yet it did and still does for some.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#99916 Apr 16, 2013
TruthIs wrote:
<quoted text>
Because sometimes that layer of (let's use the word faith- instead of magic, shall we) can ulitimetly be the optimal placement piece in the jigsaw puzzle of life.
And really, anyone who would deem such has "baduh" is a few cards short of playing with a whole deck, logically.
Faith and magic are the same, aren't they? Either label you give to it you are saying that reality is too scary so I want a supernatural helping hand. And since there's no evidence beyond faith and anecdote that supports such an idea it is silly to buy into it.

Look, I know people are scared about life and death stuff. So am I. And I know people will continue to pray and have faith. No problem. Praying is actually beneficial to you, personally, in the same way that meditation and relaxation are beneficial. So sure, do it all you like.

But if you claim that it does anything beyond placebo you are making a claim about reality that is not supported by evidence. Be prepared to defend that claim or stop making it.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#99917 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Elements of the restoration continue to happen. It isn't like a light switch. And remember, God's time obviously is not the same as ours. God allowed the church to remain in apostasy for almost 2000 years before beginning the restoration.
Jesus taught the Jews before taking the gospel to the Gentiles. Does it mean He loves Jews more? No, the scriptures say that God is not a respecter of persons. I think the only reason that blacks weren't allowed to hold the priesthood from the foundation of the church was because no one prayed for that revelation. They didn't see it as racism because it was normal at that time. Today, we obviously see that as horrible racism, but put yourself in 1830. It was a different world.
With all due respect, you are fooling yourself. Listen to how you are rationalizing this:

-The church was in disarray until *your* chosen sect came into being. How convenient.

-Racism was institutional in your church until the collective will of the church overcame racism. God decided to just let it happen that way? Very convenient.

-Revelations occur slowly, according to human standards and human needs...very convenient.

So...you belong to a church that skips along at a pace consistent with human beings changing their values and culture over time. Your church fathers receive revelations only if they ask for them and only at that same, human pace.

How is this any different from a world in which your god does not actually exist at all?

And how about this. You told a tall tale about an ear miraculously healing up because of prayer. So God is intervening there. Yet it took him over a hundred years to put an end to the institutional racism?

Is any of this logic getting through your faith shield?

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#99918 Apr 16, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you say there is no evidence? Because of a study? Please don't limit yourself to studies. God doesn't do parlor tricks.
There has to be a righteous purpose for what is asked and it must be the will of God that it be done.
Of course miracles can happen for people that do not believe. Sometimes this makes people reflect on their beliefs. That's what my post was getting at. When you find yourself in a hopeless situation, would you open the door to the chance that God is real? And with a tiny bit of faith would you chance it and pray to a God that might hear you, or would you give up?
No, not because of a study. Because of a BUNCH of studies. Like it or not, statistics tell us a great deal about reality. You are making claims about how REALITY works when you talk about miracles and prayers. I am telling you that the data does not back you up.

In the USA thousands of children have cancer. Thousands die from cancer. Slowly and painfully. And this is in a country where 85% of people are Christians.

How much more righteous do you need something to be than "God please don't let my baby die."? Are you f*cking serious with the "righteous" nonsense??

And yes, apparently according to you and the lost dog person God certainly does parlor tricks. What else would you call it when he fixes a kid's ear and lets another kid asphyxiate on her own blood or get raped to death?

I guess the raped kids aren't righteous enough?
curious

Winter Garden, FL

#99919 Apr 16, 2013
GWB wrote:
<quoted text>
That's interesting take on what you said. I recall a Jehovah's Witness who came to my door one day said the same almost exact thing that you wrote down. Have you studied with Jehovah's Witnesses? Your replies are similar to some I have talk to.
Anyway you said that God does not want you to dread him.
Synonyms
verb. fear - be afraid
noun. fear - fright
adjective. frightful
Let us look at the scriptures and see if what it says.
Matt 10:28
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
James 2:19
You say you have faith, for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror.
Yes, being afraid or fearful of God does have scriptural support, James and Matthew wrote that down emphatically.
Looking at what you had said, it would only mean to not displease him does not put the cheese on the cracker. Rather you are trying to mitigate what the bible says about God ability to bring terror upon you for sinning.
I do under stand your example. It does not reach the level of what the writers are trying to say in the bible.
No,I have not studied with Jehovah's Witnesses. I have previously stated that I donot belong to any religious organization,nor do I attend any church. I do read the Bible.
YOU stated " Anyway you said that God does not want you to dread him." and that is incorrect,go back and you will see that what I SAID was" I don't know why anyone would dread God" and I gave you my reasons why I felt that way.
To me,there is a difference between fear and dread. EXAMPLE I fear the Lord,because it is for my own GOOD..I dread a tornado,because a tornado IS NOT for my own good,same as I would DREAD a snakebite or any other number of events THAT are not for my own good

I do not believe that I ever said that Fear of the lord,does not have Scriptural support. As a matter of fact,proverbs,as you,know,clearly states"Fear of the Lord,is the begining of wisdom"
Then I used an example in order to signify what that fear implied to me. In that example I explained to you how and why my parents taught me to fear them.It was for my own good,not in order to terrorize me.
That is the type of fear that I believe,God tries to instill in all of us,for our own good.
SE Jeremiah 32:39,God says
39 Then I will give them one heart and one way,that they may FEAR Me forever,for the Good of them and their children after them.
Now,in scriptures, God clearly gives everyone a choice;Seek me and ye shall find me, and provided HIS SON,JESUS CHRIST,as the solution as to how this can be attained.
We have a choice of, arbitrarily rejecting this solution,or we can put that solution to the test and see if it works.. I found The Gospel of John to be extremely helpful,especially John3;1 to 10.
So ,I don't believe that God intends for us to come to know him by using a dread factor ,meaning,
scaring us with threats of Hell and brimstone.The Bible says that one comes to God through Faith not fear.
Now,if you make no effort to find God and put your trust in him,then ,there are consecuences.
You may well,wind up in hell....and one should Dread that as it is not for your own good.

SEE Jeremiah 32:39,God says
Then I will give them one heart and one way,that they may FEAR Me forever,for the Good of them and their children after them.
My response has too many characters,will do 2 postings
TruthIs

United States

#99920 Apr 16, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
Faith and magic are the same, aren't they? Either label you give to it you are saying that reality is too scary so I want a supernatural helping hand. And since there's no evidence beyond faith and anecdote that supports such an idea it is silly to buy into it.
Look, I know people are scared about life and death stuff. So am I. And I know people will continue to pray and have faith. No problem. Praying is actually beneficial to you, personally, in the same way that meditation and relaxation are beneficial. So sure, do it all you like.
But if you claim that it does anything beyond placebo you are making a claim about reality that is not supported by evidence. Be prepared to defend that claim or stop making it.
No faith and magic are not the same.

Not even literally (or even closely).

Magic will not take anyone to a "better dimension", except for the brief moment of amusement, and the sometimes lingeruing after affect.

Faith however, will.
curious

Winter Garden, FL

#99921 Apr 16, 2013
You cited"Matt 10:28
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
That particular verse was said in order to drive home a point to the 12 disciples that he was sending out to preach the gospel and has to be interpreted in that context,starting with matt 10,5 to 31.
In closing his instructions to the disciples,Jesus states in verse 31 Do not fear therefore;you are of more value than many sparrows
The following verse,which you also cited
"James 2:19
You say you have faith, for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror" was also taken out of context,Where James was also trying to make a point,starting at James 2;14 and ending at james 2;21.
Taking verses out of context,will not give you an accurate meaning of that which the writer is attempting to convey and what he means.

I f you decide to read through those verses,and after reading them,you have any questions,let me kmow.I may or may not,be able to answer them to your satisfaction,but I will try

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#99922 Apr 16, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>"In a pig's eye" is a colloquialism for strongly disagree.
If you deny that any and every social group has a pecking order, we can call this discussion quits, as it has run into the brick wall of delusion.
OBVIOUSLY.
If you mean that in my church, one person is more important than another, then the statement is incorrect. If you mean one calling has a larger scope than another, or requires more effort, or is the mode of communication in crisis sure.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#99923 Apr 16, 2013
Satanic Priest wrote:
<quoted text>Nope, I want to read it from one of you guys. I prefer to hear it from curious or YAA as I like comedy
Ok whatever. Sounds to me like you don't want a real answer. Just ammo to attack people.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#99924 Apr 16, 2013
aWitchintheWoods wrote:
<quoted text>Silly man, I have experienced many serendipitous conincidences in my life.

The latest one, a couple of years ago, was when a deadly tornado missed my house by 100 yards. Neighbors lost trees and had house damage. Some, though not in my immediate area, died.
I didn't even lose a wind chime.

No gods necessary.

What you call a "miracle" I simply call random chance.
Not a situation I was referring to.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#99925 Apr 16, 2013
Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Well of course you know persons of color were not allowed in the priesthood until the seventies, so your claim of all the prophets condemning Brigham's racism seems to fail. Clearly no prophet got a memo from god to put a full stop to Brigham's racist policies untill relatively recently.

So what good is it to have a prophet that fails to get the true picture of what god wants? Seems kind of pointless and condusive to false beliefs, which it clearly lead to.

The policy made me realize the church was not the true church as claimed. Would a god that really wanted the Church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints to be the one true church allow for a prophet to make false policies so large that it would lead to followers to leave the church? Seems like a giant red flag. Seems you give these red flags a pass.

So just how can one determine a true church if they give all failures a pass?
No no. They didn't all condemn it, they just didn't worry about it. It wasn't an issue for over a hundred years because there were a scarce few blacks anywhere near Utah. Even today a black person will tell you they feel like a fly in a bowl of milk. Once more blacks started to join the church, it became a matter of concern, so the prophet asked God, and received the revelation that all worthy males could receive the priesthood.
It's a red flag today because our society is different. Just like marrying a 14 year old is no longer acceptable, though it happened for thousands of years before.
GWB

Rancho Cordova, CA

#99926 Apr 16, 2013
curious wrote:
You cited"Matt 10:28
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
That particular verse was said in order to drive home a point to the 12 disciples that he was sending out to preach the gospel and has to be interpreted in that context,starting with matt 10,5 to 31.
In closing his instructions to the disciples,Jesus states in verse 31 Do not fear therefore;you are of more value than many sparrows
The following verse,which you also cited
"James 2:19
You say you have faith, for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror" was also taken out of context,Where James was also trying to make a point,starting at James 2;14 and ending at james 2;21.
Taking verses out of context,will not give you an accurate meaning of that which the writer is attempting to convey and what he means.
I f you decide to read through those verses,and after reading them,you have any questions,let me kmow.I may or may not,be able to answer them to your satisfaction,but I will try
Well that's a mouthful, you seem confused about the understanding of what the two apostles said. The use of out of context clause to escape from a valid scripture post that is self explanatory, I sort of expected. That is how different religions are formed and all lean on the understanding of men not God, because men wrote the bible and its interpretation varies among even scholars.
Known Fact

United States

#99927 Apr 16, 2013
curious wrote:
<quoted text>
No,I have not studied with Jehovah's Witnesses. I have previously stated that I donot belong to any religious organization,nor do I attend any church. I do read the Bible.
YOU stated " Anyway you said that God does not want you to dread him." and that is incorrect,go back and you will see that what I SAID was" I don't know why anyone would dread God" and I gave you my reasons why I felt that way.
To me,there is a difference between fear and dread. EXAMPLE I fear the Lord,because it is for my own GOOD..I dread a tornado,because a tornado IS NOT for my own good,same as I would DREAD a snakebite or any other number of events THAT are not for my own good
I do not believe that I ever said that Fear of the lord,does not have Scriptural support. As a matter of fact,proverbs,as you,know,clearly states"Fear of the Lord,is the begining of wisdom"
Then I used an example in order to signify what that fear implied to me. In that example I explained to you how and why my parents taught me to fear them.It was for my own good,not in order to terrorize me.
That is the type of fear that I believe,God tries to instill in all of us,for our own good.
SE Jeremiah 32:39,God says
39 Then I will give them one heart and one way,that they may FEAR Me forever,for the Good of them and their children after them.
Now,in scriptures, God clearly gives everyone a choice;Seek me and ye shall find me, and provided HIS SON,JESUS CHRIST,as the solution as to how this can be attained.
We have a choice of, arbitrarily rejecting this solution,or we can put that solution to the test and see if it works.. I found The Gospel of John to be extremely helpful,especially John3;1 to 10.
So ,I don't believe that God intends for us to come to know him by using a dread factor ,meaning,
scaring us with threats of Hell and brimstone.The Bible says that one comes to God through Faith not fear.
Now,if you make no effort to find God and put your trust in him,then ,there are consecuences.
You may well,wind up in hell....and one should Dread that as it is not for your own good.
SEE Jeremiah 32:39,God says
Then I will give them one heart and one way,that they may FEAR Me forever,for the Good of them and their children after them.
My response has too many characters,will do 2 postings
An excellent example: Some teenagers were trying to get my daughter to do some things she knew she should not do, she refused then thay responded, "you are afraid of your parents!" She answered I love my parents and I am afraid if I do what you want me to it would hurt my parents-----I'm AFRAID I might hurt my parents. That is a healthy fear---we should have the same fear of God!

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