“Not a real reg”

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#202 Jul 31, 2013
Bored, so reading posts instead of cleaning the house.
Just for the record I have a workshop in my basement with every tool and power tool with the exception of an impact drill. I've built cabinets and my kitchen island. Not saying they're picture perfect but they look pretty good. I love tools. Started cause my dad did all that stuff and I was always playing with the scroll saw and the lathe as a kid.
I can also install a sink, dishwasher and disposal and other appliances. Fixed my dryer belt with the help of youtube. Can tile but can't drywall finish, some electrical and relocated a gas pipe. I could go on but the point is I think there are more women out there that are handy.
I've only encountered one or two clerks on the floor in HICs that were condescending to me when I was asking questions re home improvement stuff. And it turned out that they knew less then I did.
Sometimes we women have to be more aggressive as customers. Of course, then we're looked at as b!tches by the men.

“...,to wit”

Since: Jun 09

Location hidden

#203 Jul 31, 2013
dahgts wrote:
Bored, so reading posts instead of cleaning the house.
Just for the record I have a workshop in my basement with every tool and power tool with the exception of an impact drill. I've built cabinets and my kitchen island. Not saying they're picture perfect but they look pretty good. I love tools. Started cause my dad did all that stuff and I was always playing with the scroll saw and the lathe as a kid.
I can also install a sink, dishwasher and disposal and other appliances. Fixed my dryer belt with the help of youtube. Can tile but can't drywall finish, some electrical and relocated a gas pipe. I could go on but the point is I think there are more women out there that are handy.
I've only encountered one or two clerks on the floor in HICs that were condescending to me when I was asking questions re home improvement stuff. And it turned out that they knew less then I did.
Sometimes we women have to be more aggressive as customers. Of course, then we're looked at as b!tches by the men.
Oooo, want to come over to my house? I have lots of projects and a husband with good ( ahem) intentions.

“What's it to ya?”

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#204 Jul 31, 2013
Toj wrote:
Okay -- this was fun reading.
What drives me CRAZY is people taking my tools. I'm constantly hunting for my screw drivers, hammer (rubber mallet and various hammers I have), duct tape (that's a tool -- you have to agree), wrenches, hex keys, etc.
And I put them back where they belong after I've used them. I might have to get a tool box that locks.
Right? I have several tools that I keep in a drawer in the kitchen and a few in my car. They are MY tools, that I bought for MY use. Other people who think they know what they are doing are always "borrowing" them, then I have to go hunt them down because they can't manage to put them back. I freaking hate that.

“What's it to ya?”

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#205 Jul 31, 2013
RACE wrote:
Garden hose...
<quoted text>
Heh

“What's it to ya?”

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#206 Jul 31, 2013
dahgts wrote:
Sometimes we women have to be more aggressive as customers. Of course, then we're looked at as b!tches by the men.
I know lots of stuff about tools/making/fixing stuff too. I used to hang with my dad and he always let me use his tools, even at a very young age. I can remember being like 5 or so and he told me that the only restriction was the power tools, I could use those only with he or my mom present, otherwise as long as I put them back when I was done, it was open season in the garage; I could do whatever I wanted.

I think the being more aggressive thing sucks. WHY should we have to? We are CUSTOMERS, with MONEY. We should be catered to the same as men. And,yeah, the bitchlabel blows. Who the hell do these people think they are to make a judgement like that? If a guy is aggressive then he's abitch too! Screw this double standard. I will not tolerate it. You want to keep your job? Treat me like a customer because I have no problem whatsoever getting you fired. Go ahead call me abitch,*I* won't be the one unemployed for not treating a PAYING CUSTOMER like a paying customer.
<shrug>

I was at Nordstom once. This is a place that has a policy of kissing customer-ass. I was being ignored, in the shoe department, by a woman clerk. I said, "excuse me, do you know who I am?" She said "no..." (kinda looking at me curious because of how I phrased it) and I said "*I* am a CUSTOMER, do you know what that means?" Not sure how long she kept her job. Her supervisor overheard and came over and started ass-kissing.:D

“...,to wit”

Since: Jun 09

Location hidden

#207 Jul 31, 2013
RACE wrote:
Garden hose...
<quoted text>
Are you suggesting Mimi can moonlight giving hosejobs in the back yard?

“...,to wit”

Since: Jun 09

Location hidden

#208 Jul 31, 2013
Mimi Seattle wrote:
<quoted text>
I know lots of stuff about tools/making/fixing stuff too. I used to hang with my dad and he always let me use his tools, even at a very young age. I can remember being like 5 or so and he told me that the only restriction was the power tools, I could use those only with he or my mom present, otherwise as long as I put them back when I was done, it was open season in the garage; I could do whatever I wanted.
I think the being more aggressive thing sucks. WHY should we have to? We are CUSTOMERS, with MONEY. We should be catered to the same as men. And,yeah, the bitchlabel blows. Who the hell do these people think they are to make a judgement like that? If a guy is aggressive then he's abitch too! Screw this double standard. I will not tolerate it. You want to keep your job? Treat me like a customer because I have no problem whatsoever getting you fired. Go ahead call me abitch,*I* won't be the one unemployed for not treating a PAYING CUSTOMER like a paying customer.
<shrug>
I was at Nordstom once. This is a place that has a policy of kissing customer-ass. I was being ignored, in the shoe department, by a woman clerk. I said, "excuse me, do you know who I am?" She said "no..." (kinda looking at me curious because of how I phrased it) and I said "*I* am a CUSTOMER, do you know what that means?" Not sure how long she kept her job. Her supervisor overheard and came over and started ass-kissing.:D
The Nordstrom by me has a number system in the shoe department. You want to just look , if they are not busy you have a random chance of one of the sales people asking if they can help. If you want to be helped and/or if they are busy, you get a number. On sale days they have a person with a mini loudspeaker microphone calling the numbers.

I don't have these problems with sales people except when I have been shopping for a car. Maybe I am lucky. I have a theory that it is somehow connected to body language ( see prior convo's re unwanted touching and skeevy dates, also problems I did not encounter).

Re the car salesmen thing. A long time ago, late 70-early 80's, I heard a guy named Robert Abboud speak. At the time he was CEO of First National Bank of Chicago or whatever corporate name they were at the time( today it would Chase Bank). He is of Middle Easter descent. He told a story of taking his son to buy a used car on a Saturday when they were both dressed in Saturday grubbies. They were shopping in Barrington which is a very upscale country estate type suburb. The salesman did not pay attention to them, treated them in a cursory manner and dissed them when they brought up financing. His take away point was that you get treated based on how you present yourself, your assertiveness and how you are dressed . It has worked for me.

They bought a car someplace else.

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#209 Jul 31, 2013
I'm kind of the opposite. I don't want to be bothered by salespersons. If I want their help I'll ask them for it. I've been in some stores where 3 salespersons will ask me if I need help and it gets kind of annoying.

“What's it to ya?”

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#210 Jul 31, 2013
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>
you get treated based on how you present yourself, your assertiveness and how you are dressed . It has worked for me.
They bought a car someplace else.
True as far as it goes, but there is still an underlying idea that men are real people and women are merely accessories. Come on, you grew up in the 60's you understand what women have had to go through to get treated "fairly" (I use quotes because we still aren't there yet, just better) so you know how often women are dismissed out of hand as not being worthwhile. It happens shopping as well, often.

I agree with the dressing for respect thing though, for women and men. My rule of thumb is to always dress better then "they" will/do (whoever "they" are going to be at a given time) and they will accord yo more respect. So far, so good.

“I Am Mine”

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#211 Jul 31, 2013
Mimi Seattle wrote:
<quoted text>
I know lots of stuff about tools/making/fixing stuff too. I used to hang with my dad and he always let me use his tools, even at a very young age. I can remember being like 5 or so and he told me that the only restriction was the power tools, I could use those only with he or my mom present, otherwise as long as I put them back when I was done, it was open season in the garage; I could do whatever I wanted.
I think the being more aggressive thing sucks. WHY should we have to? We are CUSTOMERS, with MONEY. We should be catered to the same as men. And,yeah, the bitchlabel blows. Who the hell do these people think they are to make a judgement like that? If a guy is aggressive then he's abitch too! Screw this double standard. I will not tolerate it. You want to keep your job? Treat me like a customer because I have no problem whatsoever getting you fired. Go ahead call me abitch,*I* won't be the one unemployed for not treating a PAYING CUSTOMER like a paying customer.
<shrug>
I was at Nordstom once. This is a place that has a policy of kissing customer-ass. I was being ignored, in the shoe department, by a woman clerk. I said, "excuse me, do you know who I am?" She said "no..." (kinda looking at me curious because of how I phrased it) and I said "*I* am a CUSTOMER, do you know what that means?" Not sure how long she kept her job. Her supervisor overheard and came over and started ass-kissing.:D
Do you expect them to come offer assistance before you have asked for assistance? I hate that. I want them to leave me the hell alone unless I ask for help.

Toj

“Equality”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#212 Jul 31, 2013
Mimi Seattle wrote:
<quoted text>
I know lots of stuff about tools/making/fixing stuff too. I used to hang with my dad and he always let me use his tools, even at a very young age. I can remember being like 5 or so and he told me that the only restriction was the power tools, I could use those only with he or my mom present, otherwise as long as I put them back when I was done, it was open season in the garage; I could do whatever I wanted.
I think the being more aggressive thing sucks. WHY should we have to? We are CUSTOMERS, with MONEY. We should be catered to the same as men. And,yeah, the bitchlabel blows. Who the hell do these people think they are to make a judgement like that? If a guy is aggressive then he's abitch too! Screw this double standard. I will not tolerate it. You want to keep your job? Treat me like a customer because I have no problem whatsoever getting you fired. Go ahead call me abitch,*I* won't be the one unemployed for not treating a PAYING CUSTOMER like a paying customer.
<shrug>
I was at Nordstom once. This is a place that has a policy of kissing customer-ass. I was being ignored, in the shoe department, by a woman clerk. I said, "excuse me, do you know who I am?" She said "no..." (kinda looking at me curious because of how I phrased it) and I said "*I* am a CUSTOMER, do you know what that means?" Not sure how long she kept her job. Her supervisor overheard and came over and started ass-kissing.:D
Awesome! I am SO using that next time I feel ignored.

“It made sense at the time....”

Since: May 09

Schaumburg, IL

#213 Jul 31, 2013
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>
The Nordstrom by me has a number system in the shoe department. You want to just look , if they are not busy you have a random chance of one of the sales people asking if they can help. If you want to be helped and/or if they are busy, you get a number. On sale days they have a person with a mini loudspeaker microphone calling the numbers.
I don't have these problems with sales people except when I have been shopping for a car. Maybe I am lucky. I have a theory that it is somehow connected to body language ( see prior convo's re unwanted touching and skeevy dates, also problems I did not encounter).
Re the car salesmen thing. A long time ago, late 70-early 80's, I heard a guy named Robert Abboud speak. At the time he was CEO of First National Bank of Chicago or whatever corporate name they were at the time( today it would Chase Bank). He is of Middle Easter descent. He told a story of taking his son to buy a used car on a Saturday when they were both dressed in Saturday grubbies. They were shopping in Barrington which is a very upscale country estate type suburb. The salesman did not pay attention to them, treated them in a cursory manner and dissed them when they brought up financing. His take away point was that you get treated based on how you present yourself, your assertiveness and how you are dressed . It has worked for me.
They bought a car someplace else.
a family friend used to hang wallpaper and do some painting years ago. one day after work she had to shop for some lady garments, includign trying them on. she was followed around like a hawk, and IIRC someone even thew open the fitting room curtain to "see if she needed any assistance"... very nice friend got very not nice. store (don't even know which one) lost a good customer.

“A Programmer is not in IT!”

Since: Feb 09

Neda, stay with me!

#214 Jul 31, 2013
If you are making eye contact with a sales person, I believe it imply's that you are seeking assistance, and I would expect them to offer it to me.

If I am looking at the shelves,products,whatever then I do not need assistance.
Mister Tonka wrote:
<quoted text>Do you expect them to come offer assistance before you have asked for assistance? I hate that. I want them to leave me the hell alone unless I ask for help.

“It made sense at the time....”

Since: May 09

Schaumburg, IL

#215 Jul 31, 2013
Mister Tonka wrote:
<quoted text>Do you expect them to come offer assistance before you have asked for assistance? I hate that. I want them to leave me the hell alone unless I ask for help.
there's being ignored, having a sales clerk float by once asking if assitance is needed and sayign something like "i'll be over there if you need me" and having teh clerk circle like a vulture...

i like being acknowledged but not ignored of hovered upon.

wehn i used to work retail, i'd acknowledge, ask if htey were looking for antyhing specific, but then leave them alone until they sstarted either picking up a lot of things (so i could hold them at teh counter) or looking lost, but i didn't trail behind like a puppy.

“...,to wit”

Since: Jun 09

Location hidden

#216 Jul 31, 2013
Mimi Seattle wrote:
<quoted text>
True as far as it goes, but there is still an underlying idea that men are real people and women are merely accessories. Come on, you grew up in the 60's you understand what women have had to go through to get treated "fairly" (I use quotes because we still aren't there yet, just better) so you know how often women are dismissed out of hand as not being worthwhile. It happens shopping as well, often.
I agree with the dressing for respect thing though, for women and men. My rule of thumb is to always dress better then "they" will/do (whoever "they" are going to be at a given time) and they will accord yo more respect. So far, so good.
I don't disagree. A lot may be personal to me, to my attitude demeanor etc. But I learned to pick up BS signals so that if I even suspected I was being taken advantage of or getting a bum's rush ( buy now because in 10 minutes the price goes up, or the next shipment has a higher mfg cost so we have to charge you more , etc), I'll leave .

Some of it is learned behavior. My dad was a furniture and appliance salesman after he stopped being a Chicago cop. I picked up how to control a situation and what to listen for.(I also know of some truly appalling things salesmen will try on customers.)

The only other context is which I can almost guaranty someone will try to to rip me off is when I have traveled to non English speaking places. The first day is almost always a rip-off, is incredibly aggravating but for me it is so predictable that I budget for it ( or make reservations).

I am not minimizing the fight or the process or the distance that women have come. I was certainly there, but there were as*holes in the 50's and 60's and there are as*holes now. You just learn how to work around them.

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#217 Jul 31, 2013
RACE wrote:
If you are making eye contact with a sales person, I believe it imply's that you are seeking assistance, and I would expect them to offer it to me.<quoted text>
Really, if you want help so bad you should just ask for it rather than stare at the salesperson and get upset that they aren't reading your body language.

I'm with Tonka, don't even talk to me or even look at me, lmao (just kidding about the look at me), unless I ask you for help.

“I Am Mine”

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#218 Jul 31, 2013
Aisle Sitter wrote:
<quoted text>
there's being ignored, having a sales clerk float by once asking if assitance is needed and sayign something like "i'll be over there if you need me" and having teh clerk circle like a vulture...
i like being acknowledged but not ignored of hovered upon.
wehn i used to work retail, i'd acknowledge, ask if htey were looking for antyhing specific, but then leave them alone until they sstarted either picking up a lot of things (so i could hold them at teh counter) or looking lost, but i didn't trail behind like a puppy.
I want them to completely leave me alone unless I ask for help. And I agree with Race. They need to at least be on the lookout for someone needing assistance. Eye contact is a good indicator of that.

“I Am Mine”

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#219 Jul 31, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Really, if you want help so bad you should just ask for it rather than stare at the salesperson and get upset that they aren't reading your body language.
I'm with Tonka, don't even talk to me or even look at me, lmao (just kidding about the look at me), unless I ask you for help.
re: eye contact

I would not be upset if sales guy missed the eye contact. I would just go tell him i need help. Just saying that, to me, eye contact is a good indicator that its ok to ask if i want help unstead of the noemally preferred leaving me alone

“A Programmer is not in IT!”

Since: Feb 09

Neda, stay with me!

#220 Jul 31, 2013
You assumed a lot more than what I said. If I could not get their attention, then I have no qualm about going to them and getting it. I would not be mad about that, but a good sales person will notice me looking and come to me. I mean, if the person is stocking shelves, I would not expect them to notice me.

But when you have 2 sales peeps BS'ing with each other, and one or both are looking in my direction, and neither offers to help, then I get pizzed and walk out. Not being noticed and being ignored are two different things.
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Really, if you want help so bad you should just ask for it rather than stare at the salesperson and get upset that they aren't reading your body language.
I'm with Tonka, don't even talk to me or even look at me, lmao (just kidding about the look at me), unless I ask you for help.

“What's it to ya?”

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#221 Jul 31, 2013
Mister Tonka wrote:
<quoted text>Do you expect them to come offer assistance before you have asked for assistance? I hate that. I want them to leave me the hell alone unless I ask for help.
Actually yes I do. That's good customer service. I don't want them to follow me around or intrude, but greeting me and asking if I need assistance with anything...youbetcha.

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