Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

Full story: Newsday

Safety pins and screws are still lodged in 15-year-old Ami Ortiz's body three months after he opened a booby-trapped gift basket sent to his family.
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former res

Broomall, PA

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#48715
Feb 6, 2013
 
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
My position is that I dont know if a man named Jesus existed or not, primarily because I havent made it a habit to read much of what modern science or modern history has to say on the issue. However, I have no chip on my shoulder to doubt such a possibility either.
A few months ago, a recognized popular author and Rabbi named Shmuely Boteach published a book called Kosher Jesus. I never read it, so I cant comment on how scholarly it is, but his view of the matter is that Jews should accept and embrace the notion that Jesus as man existed, and what he taught was barely concealed Judaism of the time. Therefore we Jews should be proud of Jesus, and steal him back (the man, not the messiah) from the Christians.
Its an intriguing line of thought, and the book was condemned by more than a few prominent orthodox Jews that couldnt get past the title.
Huggy of course also missed the boat on Boteach and considers him a Messianic - since he obviously never read past the title either..
Well....some of my best friends are Jewish :)).....and they tend to say the believe JC existed and was sort of mystic or some such. Not that it's up for a vote.

Other than stating he was the son of god, I guess he was a good Jew? Or was that even enough to make him not Jewish?

Huggy wrote: "While at it explain your man's/Frijoles' words i.e. "I never DOUBTED the existence of historical Jesus."

I didn't check the quote and took him at his word. So took that to mean you did acknowledge JC's existence.
former res

Broomall, PA

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#48717
Feb 6, 2013
 
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
Interesting perspective.
I believe that regardless of whether Jesus existed as a real person or as just a highly exaggerated folklore, his teachings were neither unique nor groundbreaking. His moral teachings were mundane, common sense stuff that any humanist would already embrace.
Is anything new? Was it ever? One could say the same of Shakespeare. Some say it better than others, not that I'm a biblical scholar.

Personally, I like the Sermon on the Mount/The Beatitudes/Golden Rule etc.

Good teaching that most of use could use reinforcing in.

the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.(5:3)
those who mourn: for they will be comforted.(5:4)
the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.(5:5)
they who hunger and thirst for righteousness: for they will be satisfied.(5:6)
the merciful: for they will be shown mercy.(5:7)
the pure in heart: for they shall see God.(5:8)
the peacemakers: for they shall be called children of God.(5:9)
those who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
And even at that, today's so-called christians are poor examples of followers of this person/folklore since their focus is more on all the baggage that religion has built up around him rather than focusing on the core/basic humanistic teachings.
True for most of them, but not all.

Some are better than others. More sincere. And many are hypocrites.

In other words...even if one doesn't think JC was the son of god, doing things his way.....well, one could do worse.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48718
Feb 6, 2013
 
PSEUDO-PSYCHOLOGY:

The so-called sciences like psychology that deal with the human mind are so much dependent on physical science that they cannot go beyond narrow limits and ironically everything about their deductions is inferential and of a gross physical kind despite the fact that the mind is a field of consciousness and action that exceeds and defies every gross physical characteristic and standard of assessment. The greatest difficulty faced by science is its incapacity of knowing an object in all its thatness via a union in consciousness and energy of the subject with the object.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48719
Feb 6, 2013
 
PSYCHOLOGY & GENES:

The difficulty with regards to understanding personality is that it is a subjective state involving several subtle factors playing out their respective roles in the gross physical as well as acting subliminally behind the scenes and this difficulty is further increased by the lack of any clear-cut genetic mechanism for psychological inheritance.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48720
Feb 6, 2013
 
LIMITATIONS OF GENES:

Genes are not the exclusive determinants of life.
This is even more evident for subjective states such as self-awareness, abstraction, conscious reflection, intuition, feeling, inspiration and revelation. The poet, the artisan, the sage, the philosopher, the gifted musician and the scientist are not only helped by heredity but also through a vertical non-genetic hereditary transmission. This is recognized to be a complex interplay of learning, example and influence that occurs in human transactions.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48721
Feb 6, 2013
 
Oneness supports all differentiation.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48722
Feb 6, 2013
 
In man, the will and self-knowledge can become fully conscious and potent....
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48723
Feb 6, 2013
 
The objective cannot be cognized or analyzed without the subjective.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48724
Feb 6, 2013
 
Spatio-temporal factors play on the exteriorized and unregenerate mode of the human consciousness to create this illusion of subjective and objective states.
rabbee yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

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#48725
Feb 6, 2013
 
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually it is your burden to prove or at least show evidence that your Jesus is NOT a delusion.
rabbee: well if anyone thinks i am a delusion, then you really are deluded. and especially about, my name too. don't know what my name really is, so your going to pretend to love me any way? really sad comentary for this whole world, rejecting the truth again, here in TheStory of Creation.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48726
Feb 6, 2013
 
Yoga breaks down the artificial barrier between the subjective and objective states and opens up the awakened individualized consciousness to the deeper realms of the unified field of consciousness-energy.

Since: Aug 11

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#48727
Feb 6, 2013
 
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Is anything new? Was it ever? One could say the same of Shakespeare. Some say it better than others, not that I'm a biblical scholar.
Personally, I like the Sermon on the Mount/The Beatitudes/Golden Rule etc.
Good teaching that most of use could use reinforcing in.
the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.(5:3)
those who mourn: for they will be comforted.(5:4)
the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.(5:5)
they who hunger and thirst for righteousness: for they will be satisfied.(5:6)
the merciful: for they will be shown mercy.(5:7)
the pure in heart: for they shall see God.(5:8)
the peacemakers: for they shall be called children of God.(5:9)
those who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
<quoted text>
True for most of them, but not all.
Some are better than others. More sincere. And many are hypocrites.
In other words...even if one doesn't think JC was the son of god, doing things his way.....well, one could do worse.
Regarding the Sermon on the Mount/The Beatitudes/Golden Rule etc. I can boil it all down to two main points:

1. Play nice
2. Clean up after yourself when you're done

I challenge anyone to find a moral situation for which one of these two don't apply.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48728
Feb 6, 2013
 
The so-called subjective is is connected to the so-called objective via universal force fields.

Since: Aug 11

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#48729
Feb 6, 2013
 
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Is anything new? Was it ever? One could say the same of Shakespeare. Some say it better than others, not that I'm a biblical scholar.
Personally, I like the Sermon on the Mount/The Beatitudes/Golden Rule etc.
Good teaching that most of use could use reinforcing in.
the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.(5:3)
those who mourn: for they will be comforted.(5:4)
the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.(5:5)
they who hunger and thirst for righteousness: for they will be satisfied.(5:6)
the merciful: for they will be shown mercy.(5:7)
the pure in heart: for they shall see God.(5:8)
the peacemakers: for they shall be called children of God.(5:9)
those who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
<quoted text>
True for most of them, but not all.
Some are better than others. More sincere. And many are hypocrites.
In other words...even if one doesn't think JC was the son of god, doing things his way.....well, one could do worse.
"While some of the passages in this sermon have been considered sage advice by readers of varying beliefs, the sermon includes many passages which seem to contradict the claim that the author was wise beyond mortal men. Many people have pointed out that rather than being the ultimate instructions for how to live life, the sermon contains several passages that would typically qualify as bad advice and projects some philosophical positions that are typical of the era and not indicative of a wise, transcendent being. A detailed, verse-by-verse look at the message in this sermon follows below."

http://wiki.ironchariots.org/index.php...
rabbee yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

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#48730
Feb 6, 2013
 
Frijoles wrote:
http://www.merriam-webster.com /dictionary/delusion
Definition of DELUSION
1: the act of deluding : the state of being deluded
2a : something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated
2b : a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary; also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs
rabbee: example; if you call adam, by the name jesus. then that is being delusional. and it's like calling, Yeetzak as issac.

““You must not lose faith ”

Since: Jun 11

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#48731
Feb 6, 2013
 

Judged:

1

HughBe wrote:
<quoted text>
HughBe---why compare REAL/Jesus with fiction/Homer, wise child?
Maat---Mon, you're EFFIN BRILLIANT!
HughBe--- Thanks Maat, it is a GIFT.
Frijoles---“Irony is wasted on the stupid”
HughBe--- Well said, YOU "effin" FOOL.
Frijoles---Thats not irony. Thats vainly concealed anger.
HughBe--- sonny boy, I DELIBERATELY ignored Maat's calling me EFFIN and focused on the positive i.e. BRILLIANT. This went right over your head. Now that I have explained it, go back and see in you understand it now.
Next, there is no anger and was no anger towards Maat, YOU "effin" FOOL.
By the way did you pick up on the "concealed anger" via your Satan?
Grammar is indeed a real issue.
Enforcing a predicate, not a person...sigh.
Grammar indeed. That's apart from the actually real slow thought processing speed.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48732
Feb 6, 2013
 
The truth of the matter is rather that all the qualities we ascribe to external objects are inside us and not in the "external world". So what remains of the "external world"? What remains of the subjective world? Everything, whether subjective or objective, is one field of different forces at play creating via spatio-temporal factors a feeling of internal and external in the exteriorized human consciousness. Actually speaking, everything in existence is simply a manifestation of the unified field of consciousness-energy.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48733
Feb 6, 2013
 
REINCARNATION - It is the recycling, in a progressive or a regressive manner, of the subtler grades of the disembodied individualized and imperishable consciousness-energy that retains in its fold information regarding karma and degree of evolution which serves as the cause and impetus of the next descent into matter.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

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#48734
Feb 6, 2013
 
Salvation must be integral - no part of existence (mental, vital-emotional physical and subconscient) must be left out of the perfection of being.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

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#48736
Feb 6, 2013
 
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Well....some of my best friends are Jewish :)).....and they tend to say the believe JC existed and was sort of mystic or some such. Not that it's up for a vote.
Other than stating he was the son of god, I guess he was a good Jew? Or was that even enough to make him not Jewish?
Huggy wrote: "While at it explain your man's/Frijoles' words i.e. "I never DOUBTED the existence of historical Jesus."
I didn't check the quote and took him at his word. So took that to mean you did acknowledge JC's existence.
I was a bit sloppy with my words, but followed up with a clarification of intent. To most people, that clarification would of been adequate, but as we all know, Huggy is a little bit special with that regard.

There are many Jewish people who consider EVEN the discussion of Jesus a topic that may lead to cooties. Thats a reflex that has been developed from centuries of persecution, reinforced by experiences with modern day evangelicists.

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