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JOEL

Mumbai, India

#47887 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>

Spoken like a true pantheist.
No, I did not allude to pantheism in the least.

I did not say that nature is the absolute.

I said that nature is the projection of the absolute/source via its innate causal mechanism and so how can the absolute/source be the same as nature?

Nature is the frontal dynamic field of the manifested absolute in manifestation.

The absolute is pure consciousness with its inherent pure energy component that in the causation gets manifested as a unified field of consciousness-energy which in turn objectivizes itself as Nature which is the cosmic manifestation with its numerous planes and varied phenomena.

Please read my posts carefully since many of the concepts I present are complex and abstruse at times.

Thank you.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47888 Jan 27, 2013
JOEL wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I did not allude to pantheism in the least.
I did not say that nature is the absolute.
I said that nature is the projection of the absolute/source via its innate causal mechanism and so how can the absolute/source be the same as nature?
Nature is the frontal dynamic field of the manifested absolute in manifestation.
The absolute is pure consciousness with its inherent pure energy component that in the causation gets manifested as a unified field of consciousness-energy which in turn objectivizes itself as Nature which is the cosmic manifestation with its numerous planes and varied phenomena.
Please read my posts carefully since many of the concepts I present are complex and abstruse at times.
Thank you.
I am sorry. You are correct. You are a panentheist.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#47889 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>

Basically nature is everything.
Nature, the phenomenal side of the dynamic form of the absolute, is everything only in the manifestation.

The phenomena of nature are evanescent and endure as long as the manifestation of the absolute lasts.

The forms of nature can be manipulated, transformed, regressed, progressed or dissolved into the seed elements and seed principles and withdrawn into the causal mechanism that inheres in the unified field of consciousness-energy that itself is the dynamic projection of the absolute which is pure consciousness with its inherent pure energy component.

The "true everything" is the self-existent, supracosmic absolute whose partial manifestation via its innate causal mechanism gives rise to its dynamic aspect which is the cosmic system or nature with its multiple planes and numerous phenomena.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#47890 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>

Therefore, there is nothing unnatural.
Yes, in this sense, every thing/every phenomenon is of nature and so there's nothing unnatural.

The phenomena or nature is constituted of opposing elements in the lower manifestation where dualism rules.

So, good and bad are dual aspects of the lower nature.

The individual of discrimination accepts or is naturally inclined to the beneficial and uplifting aspects of nature and gains in the process as he sees his psychology, emotions, body, family life and professional career blooming. Such an individual will never ruin his gene pool or mar his mind, emotions, body, family life and career by indulging in say cocaine addiction or incest or murder or illegal felling of trees or self-mutilation or suicide or terrorism as these are the negative and degrading aspects of nature or harmful traits of the unregenerate frontal personality.


We should continuously reject the bad and damaging aspects of nature and if we are yogis we should try and transform or dissolve them by bringing down a higher force of the unifying kind into the depths of being. While the lower aspects of nature are based on the play of the opposites, the higher aspect of nature is complementarity - of one lower truth positioned beside a higher truth - until one arrives at something higher than simple complementarity which is the unity of all phenomenal or nature truths and from this unified poise one rise in consciousness into the supracosmic realms that takes one altogether out of the cosmic manifestation and so on until one finally unites with the absolute.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#47891 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>

You are a panentheist.
No.

I am not even a monist who sees everything as one in the essence.

One is not the truth.

The ultimate truth is a singular system of unified aspects that're fashioned from the basal field of consciousness-energy via an innate causation.

The nondualist thinks that consciousness is the only reality as in his altered mind states he experiences only differing degrees of awareness, while he ignores or is only partially aware of the basis of the dynamic side of pure existence which is energy.

Consciousness and energy are not one thing but rather they form a unified field in which each is completely involved in the other and each cannot exist without the support of the other.

They're like say the obverse and reverse sides of a coin.

I am a realist who perceives the ultimate reality not as a single entity in which everything is undifferentiated but rather as a unified field of consciousness-energy that leaves behind the residue of pure consciousness when its innate energy component falls silent or when it enters a state of dormancy.

This according to me is the way existence is.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#47892 Jan 27, 2013
Good night from Joel, Cuffe Parade, Mumbai.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47893 Jan 27, 2013
JOEL wrote:
<quoted text>
No.
I am not even a monist who sees everything as one in the essence.
One is not the truth.
The ultimate truth is a singular system of unified aspects that're fashioned from the basal field of consciousness-energy via an innate causation.
The nondualist thinks that consciousness is the only reality as in his altered mind states he experiences only differing degrees of awareness, while he ignores or is only partially aware of the basis of the dynamic side of pure existence which is energy.
Consciousness and energy are not one thing but rather they form a unified field in which each is completely involved in the other and each cannot exist without the support of the other.
They're like say the obverse and reverse sides of a coin.
I am a realist who perceives the ultimate reality not as a single entity in which everything is undifferentiated but rather as a unified field of consciousness-energy that leaves behind the residue of pure consciousness when its innate energy component falls silent or when it enters a state of dormancy.
This according to me is the way existence is.
I am sorry. You are an acosmic panentheist.
former res

Newtown Square, PA

#47894 Jan 27, 2013
HughBe wrote:
<quoted text>
Former-- Are you not placing a "flase god" before thee?
HUghBe--- NEVER.
The lady doth protest too much, methinks.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47895 Jan 27, 2013
JOEL wrote:
<quoted text>
No.
I am not even a monist who sees everything as one in the essence.
One is not the truth.
The ultimate truth is a singular system of unified aspects that're fashioned from the basal field of consciousness-energy via an innate causation.
The nondualist thinks that consciousness is the only reality as in his altered mind states he experiences only differing degrees of awareness, while he ignores or is only partially aware of the basis of the dynamic side of pure existence which is energy.
Consciousness and energy are not one thing but rather they form a unified field in which each is completely involved in the other and each cannot exist without the support of the other.
They're like say the obverse and reverse sides of a coin.
I am a realist who perceives the ultimate reality not as a single entity in which everything is undifferentiated but rather as a unified field of consciousness-energy that leaves behind the residue of pure consciousness when its innate energy component falls silent or when it enters a state of dormancy.
This according to me is the way existence is.
You are definitely a person that uses 50 dollar words where 5 cent words may be appropriate. Certainly this vocabulary is not how you speak to women when courting? Get a girlfriend. I am entertained by your convoluted thoughts at times and at times think you look for the most complex words you can put together and then do so, but at an alrmingly quick rate. Yes, your vocabulary is very good from what I can tell. Why mix up simple concepts so much as to make them appear complex.

It's easy to make things complicated, much harder to simplify. There is strength in brevity and clarity.

Bye!!!

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47896 Jan 27, 2013
JOEL wrote:
<quoted text>
Nature, the phenomenal side of the dynamic form of the absolute, is everything only in the manifestation.
The phenomena of nature are evanescent and endure as long as the manifestation of the absolute lasts.
The forms of nature can be manipulated, transformed, regressed, progressed or dissolved into the seed elements and seed principles and withdrawn into the causal mechanism that inheres in the unified field of consciousness-energy that itself is the dynamic projection of the absolute which is pure consciousness with its inherent pure energy component.
The "true everything" is the self-existent, supracosmic absolute whose partial manifestation via its innate causal mechanism gives rise to its dynamic aspect which is the cosmic system or nature with its multiple planes and numerous phenomena.
Panentheism (from Greek &#960;&#8118;&#957 ; (pn) "all"; &#7952;&#957; (en) "in"; and &#952;&#949;&#972; &#962; (thes) "God"; "all-in-God") is a belief system which posits that the divine (be it a monotheistic God, polytheistic gods, or an eternal cosmic animating force), interpenetrates every part of nature and timelessly extends beyond it. Panentheism differentiates itself from pantheism, which holds that the divine is synonymous with the universe.[1]

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47897 Jan 27, 2013
JOEL wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, in this sense, every thing/every phenomenon is of nature and so there's nothing unnatural.
The phenomena or nature is constituted of opposing elements in the lower manifestation where dualism rules.
So, good and bad are dual aspects of the lower nature.
The individual of discrimination accepts or is naturally inclined to the beneficial and uplifting aspects of nature and gains in the process as he sees his psychology, emotions, body, family life and professional career blooming. Such an individual will never ruin his gene pool or mar his mind, emotions, body, family life and career by indulging in say cocaine addiction or incest or murder or illegal felling of trees or self-mutilation or suicide or terrorism as these are the negative and degrading aspects of nature or harmful traits of the unregenerate frontal personality.
We should continuously reject the bad and damaging aspects of nature and if we are yogis we should try and transform or dissolve them by bringing down a higher force of the unifying kind into the depths of being. While the lower aspects of nature are based on the play of the opposites, the higher aspect of nature is complementarity - of one lower truth positioned beside a higher truth - until one arrives at something higher than simple complementarity which is the unity of all phenomenal or nature truths and from this unified poise one rise in consciousness into the supracosmic realms that takes one altogether out of the cosmic manifestation and so on until one finally unites with the absolute.
I see you also buy into the notion of stage theories

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stage_theory

Kind of a religious application of Piaget
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47898 Jan 27, 2013
For some strange reason, when I read Joel's posts, the following video comes to mind. This has been done under various companies. First time I saw it was Rockwell based, now something else, but still funny. A matter of putting together a lot of complex words but saying very little. Sorry, Joem, you just remind me of this.

http://m.youtube.com/watch...
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47899 Jan 27, 2013
Joel posted this ... Didn't catch it the first time 'til Beans posted a comment:

J: So, good and bad are dual aspects of the lower nature.
IDGAF: How can you be sure of this? What is good? What is bad? We understand good/bad because of a societal acceptance of these definitions. How do we really know the difference? We are condtioned through what society says is correct, not always by the correct. Just saying ...

J: The individual of discrimination accepts or is naturally inclined to the beneficial and uplifting aspects of nature and gains in the process as he sees his psychology, emotions, body, family life and professional career blooming.
IDGAF: but are these from true discrimination between the good and bad? There are some very troubled people who are the best people that they can be, but still are very troubled. They make good choices, bad things happen to them regardless. Karma? Or just shitty luck? Hard to tell, but I don't see genralizing that making the Good Choice will always bring a blooming life. Sometimes bad shit happens to good people. That's just life.
J: Such an individual will never ruin his gene pool or mar his mind, emotions, body, family life and career by indulging in say cocaine addiction or incest or murder or illegal felling of trees or self-mutilation or suicide or terrorism as these are the negative and degrading aspects of nature or harmful traits of the unregenerate frontal personality.
IDGAF: we can respectfully agree to disagree on this set of comments. Too many good people who make good choices in life and live wonderful lives get caught up in all of the above. Making a statement that being pure of mind, body and spirit will keep away the bad is simply flawed. You may live a perfect life and be overtaken by canceer. You may live a perfect life and get caught up using drugs due to illness. You may be living a perfect life somewhere and get caught up with an extremist group. This can start off totally unintentional. Life is simply not this simple. You can simplify and the simpler you keep it, the less likely bad things may happen to you. One of the challenges in life is overcoming adversity. Life would be too boring if bad things didn't exist.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47900 Jan 27, 2013
idgaf wrote:
For some strange reason, when I read Joel's posts, the following video comes to mind. This has been done under various companies. First time I saw it was Rockwell based, now something else, but still funny. A matter of putting together a lot of complex words but saying very little. Sorry, Joem, you just remind me of this.
http://m.youtube.com/watch...
Once again, awarded Frijole's Seal of Approval

http://media.treehugger.com/assets/images/201...
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47901 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
I see you also buy into the notion of stage theories
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stage_theory
Kind of a religious application of Piaget
Stage theory sounds like life in general. But as I was looking through your link, I started thinking that evolution can be categorized in stage theory, but much, much slower if indeed it exists.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47902 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again, awarded Frijole's Seal of Approval
http://media.treehugger.com/assets/images/201...
These things must be related to dogs. They have dog faces.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47903 Jan 27, 2013
idgaf wrote:
<quoted text>
Stage theory sounds like life in general. But as I was looking through your link, I started thinking that evolution can be categorized in stage theory, but much, much slower if indeed it exists.
The fundamental bias behind most stage theories is that the most developed level is also the highest level - usually occupied by the guy who is creating the theory. I see this is Joel - he assumes that enlightenment happens in stages.



“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#47904 Jan 27, 2013
idgaf wrote:
<quoted text>
These things must be related to dogs. They have dog faces.
They are cuties, arent they?
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47905 Jan 27, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
They are cuties, arent they?
Yup, might make nice pets like dogs. You'd have to have a nice large pool heheheh

Well, Joel is definitely different. I think we could do the turbo encabulator on Joel's view of life and becoming.

So, I see lots of phylosophy here. What's your background? I've never put much time or thought into general phylosophy, but I have my own crazy thoughts just the same. My background is more on the technical sciences and mathematical.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#47906 Jan 27, 2013
To Joel's credit, he is the king and god of his mind and his little space and time.

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