Messianic Jews say they are persecute...

Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

There are 72023 comments on the Newsday story from Jun 21, 2008, titled Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel. In it, Newsday reports that:

Safety pins and screws are still lodged in 15-year-old Ami Ortiz's body three months after he opened a booby-trapped gift basket sent to his family.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Newsday.

Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45977 Dec 22, 2012
I think I got it.

Are you saying that the media hypes the Jewish banking stereotype, which may incite some loonie?

The only problem with that idea is that the mainstream media, including FOX doesnt really propagate that stereotype. Only the flung out extreme media.

But I agree, many anti-semites have never met a real Jew, live and in person. MUQ never has.
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45978 Dec 22, 2012
On the other hand, the mainstream Arab media probably does endorse that stereotype.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#45979 Dec 22, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
I think I got it.
Are you saying that the media hypes the Jewish banking stereotype, which may incite some loonie?
The only problem with that idea is that the mainstream media, including FOX doesnt really propagate that stereotype. Only the flung out extreme media.
But I agree, many anti-semites have never met a real Jew, live and in person. MUQ never has.
Roger that. The media is great at stereotyping and bringing controversy and building hype. I've met only a few and they were nice people who didn't push their religious beliefs on me so we were good.
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45980 Dec 22, 2012
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
I had UVerse for a little while. Then, the promo ran out and they tried to almost double the price and wouldn't negotiate, sooo, hasta la vista. Have they gotten competitive again?
Interesting side effect since the upgrade- half the times the page doesnt fully load - I miss the bottom and I have to refresh once or twice before the window gets it right. Only seems to happen on Topix site.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#45981 Dec 22, 2012
Gtown71 wrote:
<quoted text>
Just a quick question, but when does soneone merit a gift?
If I work, then I earn wages.
If soneone offers me a free gift, then all I can do is accept it or not, right?
Hey I even offer people 2 ways to Heaven.
1. Live a sinnless life, die and go.
2. Be sick of trying to live a sinnless life, and turn to the only one, that ever did (Jesus Christ), and accept His free gift.
Ok, enough for now, just wanted to know how people earn a free gift?:)
Do as you wish. A sinless life is not possible and who would want to live it? Again, you assume that Jesus lived a sinless life based on a story that you read. Again, he was a simple prophet like many others. Was there a link between Jesus and God or the gods? Hard to prove.

You take a free gift if it comes, but if it doesn't come, you don't worry about it. In my mind, the worst thing you can do is to spend a lifetime trying to please something that you do not know and/or fully understand.

Live your life to the best of your ability. If the time comes for you to come before God and he asks you why you didn't do more for Him, maybe that's not a place where you really wanted to be. Of course, if your time comes and they simply put you under the ground, it'll be good to know that you lived your life for you and not for God or anyone else. It is your time, use it wisely.
rabbee yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

#45982 Dec 22, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Interesting side effect since the upgrade- half the times the page doesnt fully load - I miss the bottom and I have to refresh once or twice before the window gets it right. Only seems to happen on Topix site.
rabbee: twice the virus and spyware, at slightly less than double the price? such a deal!
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45983 Dec 22, 2012
rabbee yehoshooah adam wrote:
<quoted text>
rabbee: twice the virus and spyware, at slightly less than double the price? such a deal!
yeah but its quicker! time is money they say.
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#45984 Dec 22, 2012
Which “Sword” the Prophet Used against his enemies: Part-14

Enemies of Islam represent our prophet as a very cruel and blood thirsty man, who would kill his “opponents, enemies and any one who disagreed with him” at “the drop of hat” and all his adversaries would be “terrified” at the mere sight of him.

The picture is far from true, let us look at some incidents from the life of prophet, as what was “this sword which killed the enmity for ever”

The Case of : SUHAIL BIN ‘AMR BIN ABD SHAMS

A. Early History:

Suhail was one of Important Chieftain of Makkah, when our prophet declared his mission. He was well known for his oratory skills and his reasoning power and judgment.

But all his skills were used to extinguish the mission of prophet and he was an important member of Anti Islamic council.

God works in his strange ways, Suhail was an avowed enemy of Islam, but both his daughters and two of his sons, were very early converts to Islam. May be there conversion inflamed his anti Islamic bias further.

He chained one of his son Abu Jindal, so that he should not escape and merge with Muslims. He not only chained his round the clock but tortured him so that he may renounce his religion.

All days of his Makkan period, Suhail was the bitterest enemy of prophet. When prophet migrated to Madina, Suhail was member of Makkan army that met Muslim forces at Badr. He was captured live my Muslim forces.

Omar suggested to prophet to take out his front two teeth….so that he may not use his oratory skills…..but prophet said that Allah has prevented him from disfiguring people’s faces.

B. Suhail and Treaty of Hudaibiyah:

It has been mentioned in the story of Urwah, that he returned to Makkah to take prophet’s message and negotiate peace terms. After discussions, Makkah people chose Suhail as their ambassador to finalize peace terms.

Suhail tried his best to get “Best Bargain” from Muslims in the famous treaty. In fact prophet accepted ALL their terms and did not put any condition from his side. Even during dictating the treaty, Suhail continued his “belligerent” mood. The treaty was written in this way, Ali the cousin of prophet was dictating and Prophet was dictating:

“In the name of Allah, RAHMAN and RAHIM” dictated prophet

“We do not know who is this RAHMAN and RAHIM, Write Allah, in your name” Interjected Suhail, Prophet consented and asked Ali to write what Suhail told”

“This is what agreed between Mohammad, Allah’s Messenger….” Said the prophet.

“Stop, Stop” interjected Suhail “If we knew you are Allah’s messenger, why will we fight with you. Write Mohammad the Son of Abdullah”

“You know I am Allah’s Messenger” said prophet “even though you do not say it openly, he then asked to write what Suhail said”

Ali had already written Mohammad, Allah’s Messenger, he said that he would never erase this sentence, when Ali was Adamant, prophet asked him to show, where Allah’s messenger was written, he erased it with his own hand!!

“Muslims will return back this year without performing UMRAH, but they would be allowed next year and will not stay for more than three years” Said Suhail and prophet accepted.

“If any one will flee from Makkah to Madina , Muslims would return him back, but if any one would flee from Madina to Makkah, he will not be returned” Said Suhail and prophet accepted (Many Muslims felt that this was unfair, but did not open their mouths).

“There will be ten years of peace between Muslims and Makkah people, no one will harm the other. From the tribes, they are free to join with Makkan or Madina, there is no bounds on them” said Suhail and prophet agreed.

Thus the famous treaty was signed and enforced.

(Contd.)

MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#45985 Dec 22, 2012
C. Abu Jundal and Hudaibiyah:

The treaty was not yet signed, when Abu Jindal, the son of Suhail, somehow escaped from his prison and reached Hudaibiyah, his hand and feet were bleeding and his body bore mark of abuses and repeated torture.

He beseeched Muslims to take him to Madina, but Suhail was adamant to take him back to Makkah. Prophet told that treaty has not yet been signed, but Suhail said that the terms were already agreed, and this is the first test case.

Prophet requested Suhail to release Abu Jindal as a personal favour for him, but Suhail did not relent. So in the end prophet told Abu Jindal to be patient and hold faith in Allah, soon Allah will make some provision for his realise.

So, in front of the eyes of all Muslims,, Abu Jindal was dragged back to Makkah, bleeding, weeping and in chains.

Such was the Condition of Heart of Suhail bin “Amr at that stage.

D. How Suhail was slain:

When Prophet captured Makkah in 8 A\H, he announced general amnesty and Suhail was also covered in that amnesty.

He accepted Islam at the hands of prophet after fall of Makkah. Prophet gave him 100 Camels to strengthen his faith from the booty of HUNAIN.

In the remaining years of prophets life, Suhail was a good Muslim….when prophet died three years later…and whole of Arabia was engulfed in internal strife and rebellion, Suhail stood firm in his faith . He not only stood fast, but kept all Makkah people also firm, he said:

“O people of Makkah! You were the last to accept Islam, be not the First to escape from it”!! So due to his oratory skills, he saved Makkah during that difficult period.

Omar used to say “If prophet had destroyed the teeth of Suhail, after Badr, as I had suggested, how he would have helped Muslims in their period of Trial. Obviously Prophet knew more than what we could perceive”!!

Such was Suhial, the Son of ‘Amr, whose heart of stone was made mallow by the “Sword of Compassion and Charity of prophet”

Source: Companions of Prophet: by Talib Hashmi

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#45986 Dec 22, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Interesting side effect since the upgrade- half the times the page doesnt fully load - I miss the bottom and I have to refresh once or twice before the window gets it right. Only seems to happen on Topix site.
Topic has been acting strange for me as well. There is a video popup that it keeps trying to load and my browser is only half successful at preventing it.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#45987 Dec 22, 2012
MUQ wrote:
Which “Sword” the Prophet Used against his enemies: Part-14
(Contd.)
I see that you decided not to follow-on to your crazy theories. Much easier to post stories that others write. How many parts are there to the story and why not simply put the link and clog the forum a little less?
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45988 Dec 22, 2012
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
Topic has been acting strange for me as well. There is a video popup that it keeps trying to load and my browser is only half successful at preventing it.
Topix and the Advocate are by far the slowest running sites for me, too many add-ons.
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45989 Dec 22, 2012
idgaf wrote:
<quoted text>
I see that you decided not to follow-on to your crazy theories. Much easier to post stories that others write. How many parts are there to the story and why not simply put the link and clog the forum a little less?
He will probably get around to it eventually. First he posts his religious spam, usually in quick succession on a few different forums. Then he answers his messages....
rabbee yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

#45990 Dec 22, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
yeah but its quicker! time is money they say.
rabbee: wine is fine, but licker is quicker?
Gtown71

United States

#45994 Dec 22, 2012
idgaf wrote:
<quoted text>
Do as you wish. A sinless life is not possible and who would want to live it? Again, you assume that Jesus lived a sinless life based on a story that you read. Again, he was a simple prophet like many others. Was there a link between Jesus and God or the gods? Hard to prove.
You take a free gift if it comes, but if it doesn't come, you don't worry about it. In my mind, the worst thing you can do is to spend a lifetime trying to please something that you do not know and/or fully understand.
Live your life to the best of your ability. If the time comes for you to come before God and he asks you why you didn't do more for Him, maybe that's
not a place where you really wanted to be. Of course, if your time comes and they simply put you under the ground, it'll be good to know that you lived

your life for you and not for God or anyone else. It is your time, use it
wisely.
Is what you wrote , really what you get from what I wrote?

I do agree with you on one thing, that no one can live a sinless life.
you also said, who would want to?

If Jesus was a prophet ,then a prophet cannot lie.

Jesus lived a sinnless life.
As far as who would want to?

before I was born again" which Jesus said one Must be" I would have never wanted to.

when I reached a point, that I was sooo sick of the Din filled life , that I had made , The one true God showed up. He knew I was seriously looking for something,to help me. I also had just started thinking " what if?" " what if I am wrong" about there being a God?

I turned from my sin sick life, and put all of my faith and trust in Him.

as of now? me

I still sin,as do all, but in my heart of hearts I no longer want to sin at all.

as far as death. if I am wrong,and have spent all this time worshiping,praising,and telling others about a God that does not exsist, then who cares?

I will not know any better.

But what if you are wrong,and there is a God?

as far as bragging and being an example, that is all glory to God,for any good I do.

just from a logical stand point.
you have heard my story.
maybe the story of others.
people eho went from Believing in No God.
to believing in God, with lives being changed.

bible aside, do you truly think all those with a testamony are just lying?
although there will be some that do lie, and say a cow saved me, but I am talking about so many, yet so few who have had their lives forever changed by Jesus Christ.

what is my motive for even being on here?

an atheist friend of mine told me, that if he really thought that there was a god and he knew the way to heaven, that he would be trying to scream it to all anywhere he could.

I simply replied, that's all I'm trying to do.

take care and God bless
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45995 Dec 23, 2012
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
a. The way I interpreted history is as per what is written in your scripture. And the uncouth words which you wrote about our prophet is your subjective opinion and speaks about the filthy and dirty state of your mind (showing your "true" jewish mentality, should I say?)
b. Chosen people: What I wrote about Chosen people is also based on your scriptures. But you only have selective memory of your own scriptures. What else can I say?
a. you missed the point entirely

b. you ignored the point entirely

Lets move on - obviously I have reached your mental limits.
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45996 Dec 23, 2012
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
After going thru your comments on my posts, let me say it is not Logic but "reverse logic".
You are just commenting for the sake of comments. You accuse me of having knowledge about our earth as if you have "Visited" every part of this Universe and writing from your "personal experiences".
The "best way" to discuss with some one in your state of mind is to say "peace" and stay away.
Its funny how you run away from criticism.

That doesnt work here.

His position was essentially agnostic. You cant make the claim that agnostics know it all. Thats not the basis of their claim.

Definition of AGNOSTIC
1: a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (as God) is unknown and probably unknowable; broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god
Frijoles

Stamford, CT

#45997 Dec 23, 2012
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>

b. Chosen people: What I wrote about Chosen people is also based on your scriptures. But you only have selective memory of your own scriptures. What else can I say?
I guess Wikipedia has a selective memory as well

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_as_a_chosen...

Crucial to the Jewish notion of chosenness is that it creates obligations exclusive to Jews, while non-Jews receive from God other covenants and other responsibilities. Generally, it does not entail exclusive rewards for Jews.

----------
The point is, MUQ is that is not YOU who gets to define and interpret the concepts that us Jews follow.

It is US - the Jews.
idgaf

Tewksbury, MA

#45998 Dec 23, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Its funny how you run away from criticism.
That doesnt work here.
His position was essentially agnostic. You cant make the claim that agnostics know it all. Thats not the basis of their claim.
Definition of AGNOSTIC
1: a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (as God) is unknown and probably unknowable; broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god
Beans,

Thanks for jumping in there. I have to say that I am disappointed in Muq's inability to defend his position of assumed logic.

Muq,

you proved nothing yet decided that you'd take the high road, but how can you? That's like going into a battle and taking off running. Live to fight another day, maybe. Is this what you've done? I think you are running away from others challenging your flawed views.

My point is not to say that your religious beliefs are wrong. Your logic is choppy at best, but that"s ok. You can learn. You cannot prove any of your claims one way or the other. I can challenge your claims and you are left unable to defend the challenge. Is there 1 God for all existence? Is there multiple gods? Is the universe what we know? Are there multiple universes and a multitude of dimensions? Do the Earthly laws apply across all existence? We simply don't know the answer to all of these questions. There is no logical or illogical way to prove the theories. Talk to me about the American Indians? How come Jesus didn't come to visit them? How come God didn't appear to them? The Buddhists? The Mayans? The Aztecs? The Hopi? The Hindus? Many, many groups simply did not see the messiah? Why? They were not worthy? He didn't have time? He forgot?

The bible is a tricky topic. It was put together from a lot of different books written at the time. Why were only those books chosen? Who chose them? What was the intent? Who changed them? For what reason? How does money come into play here and what was the role of the church?
Cesar Chavez Reagan

Tewksbury, MA

#46000 Dec 23, 2012
Gtown71: Is what you wrote , really what you get from what I wrote?
Idgaf: I was making a point, hopefully you understood where I was going.
Gtown71: you also said, who would want to?
Idgaf: I still say who would want to.
Gtown71: If Jesus was a prophet ,then a prophet cannot lie.
Idgaf: I'm not so sure that you can prove this. It's hard to say that Jesis could not lie. Also, how do you know? What written proof do we have that Jesus lived? Bible? Nah, it's a story.
Gtown71: Jesus lived a sinnless life.
Idgaf: prove this. Others would argue otherwise.
Gtown71: As far as who would want to?
before I was born again" ...
Idgaf: what made you reach that point? What moving thing in your life pushed you over the edge? A life expereince. A divorce? A death? These are psychological events mostly.
Gtown71: I also had just started thinking " what if?" " what if I am wrong" about there be...
Idgaf: here's where you and I differ, I am not claiming that there is not a God. I am claiming that we do not know God and that we do not understand God. That being said, nothing you do in this life can prepare you for meeting your Maker. So, my point is not to waste precious time on something you surely do not understand.
Gtown71: as far as death. if I am wrong,a ....
Idgaf: true, but why waste all that time and energy, why not just live a good life and let the chips fall where they may?
Gtown71: I will not know any better.But what I.....
Idgaf: if you are wrong then you are wrong. If you are wrong and your God is a merciful, all knowing and all forgiving, you will be fine. If your God is vindictive, then you won't want to be there. No, I don't think people lie about being reborn. The thing is that you can be reborn for different reasons most having nothing to do with religion. People have a need for something bigger than they are. It's hard to accept that you are here without a purpose.
Gtown71: what is my motive for even being on he...
Idgaf: how did you, an athiest come onto another athiest? Is there just a world of athiests out there? I thin agnostic possibly. Not too many athiests, then again, I could be wrong.

Live the best life that you can and the rest will all fall in place on it's own. If by the time you die, you haven't done enough, it was simply not meant to be. I think you mean well. Is it possible that you've mistaken what your rebirth was and for what purpose?

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