Ill. House Approves Legalizing Same-S...

Ill. House Approves Legalizing Same-Sex Civil Unions

There are 51763 comments on the CBS2 story from Nov 30, 2010, titled Ill. House Approves Legalizing Same-Sex Civil Unions. In it, CBS2 reports that:

The Illinois House has approved a measure to legalize civil unions for same-sex couples.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CBS2.

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#42211 Sep 23, 2013
beers wrote:
<quoted text>
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Tell me how the gay movement isn't infringing upon our rights?
List of current gay boycotts
http://www.queerty.com/dont-buy-here-10-compa...
http://pinkpanthers.tumblr.com/post/618605551...
No rights are lost by removing restrictions.

Your side is notorious for boycotts as well. The difference remains, we are not trying to use the law to deny equal rights to you.

You are still free to think, believe, say, write, and do all of the other things you were free to do before same sex marriages became recognized under the same laws in effect for os couples.

Boycotts are in response to those who would use the law to deny equal recognition under the same laws they expect for themselves. Unlike those opposed to equality, we are not the ones trying to restrict equal treatment under the laws in effect.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42212 Sep 23, 2013
Not Yet Equal wrote:
Supreme Court:
"Congress... cannot deny the liberty protected by the Due Process Clause of the Fifth Amendment.
...the principal purpose and the necessary effect of this law are to demean those persons who are in a lawful same-sex marriage. This requires the Court to hold, as it now does, that DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the liberty of the person protected by the Fifth Amendment of the Constitution.
The liberty protected by the Fifth Amendment's Due Process Clause contains within it the prohibition against denying to any person the equal protection of the laws. While the Fifth Amendment itself withdraws from the Government the power to degrade or demean in the way this law does, the equal protection guarantee of the Fourteenth Amendment makes that Fifth Amendment right all the more specific and all the better understood and preserved."
(Windsor)
Not equal to marriage.

In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.

No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
Huh

Owatonna, MN

#42213 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Not equal to marriage.
In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.
No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
A same sex couple will be every bit as much of a couple as you and your wife.....SAME SAME.

Know two guys who have been together for 20 years have great business own many properties and are pillars of the community. They are great people. WHY DO YOU HATE THEM HAVING EQUALITY?
Kresimir

Irvine, CA

#42214 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare-

Of course "no fault" divorce should be legal. We live in a free society. Even if you refuse to grant divorce in an official capacity, two people who don't love each other will still act like it. What are you going to do, chain them together?

Having a child involved doesn't fix a broken relationship, it just complicates it. You might have a situation where the two parents compete for the child's loyalty and love, or where the child becomes a focal point for the enmity between the adults. In another scenario, the child might be viewed as simply an inconvenience that prevents divorce. A loveless marriage is almost always worse for everyone involved than no marriage.

And as for kids growing up in loving, capable foster homes or adopted households (same-sex or otherwise), do you think they care that their parental figures aren't biologically related to them? They might have some abstract ideal of a biological mother/father preached to them by conservative-minded folks, but in the end these ideals will probably be more emotionally damaging than anything else, because it just doesn't apply to the reality.
Kresimir

Irvine, CA

#42215 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Not equal to marriage.
In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.
No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
Oh dear...

Perception IS reality. If the two partners perceive it as a real marriage, if their adopted children perceive it as a real marriage, if the law recognizes it as a real marriage, and the community around them perceives it as a real marriage, then for all intents and purposes, it IS a real marriage.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42216 Sep 23, 2013
Kresimir wrote:
KiMare-
Of course "no fault" divorce should be legal. We live in a free society. Even if you refuse to grant divorce in an official capacity, two people who don't love each other will still act like it. What are you going to do, chain them together?
Having a child involved doesn't fix a broken relationship, it just complicates it. You might have a situation where the two parents compete for the child's loyalty and love, or where the child becomes a focal point for the enmity between the adults. In another scenario, the child might be viewed as simply an inconvenience that prevents divorce. A loveless marriage is almost always worse for everyone involved than no marriage.
And as for kids growing up in loving, capable foster homes or adopted households (same-sex or otherwise), do you think they care that their parental figures aren't biologically related to them? They might have some abstract ideal of a biological mother/father preached to them by conservative-minded folks, but in the end these ideals will probably be more emotionally damaging than anything else, because it just doesn't apply to the reality.
Sorry, but I've lived in both worlds.

No-fault is a misnomer, and far too easy to give up.

No one knows what happens when a couple works through difficult times except someone who has weathered those things. And the message it communicates to the children is priceless.

Not ideals at all, but the very best of life and love.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42217 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Not equal to marriage.
In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.
No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
Kresimir wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh dear...
Perception IS reality. If the two partners perceive it as a real marriage, if their adopted children perceive it as a real marriage, if the law recognizes it as a real marriage, and the community around them perceives it as a real marriage, then for all intents and purposes, it IS a real marriage.
Even if that were true, how does that change one single iota of what I said?
Kresimir

Irvine, CA

#42218 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare wrote:
Even if that were true, how does that change one single iota of what I said?
It wouldn't change what you said. But it would render similar opinions largely irrelevant.
Neil An Blowme

Hoboken, NJ

#42222 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare wrote:
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Not equal to marriage.
In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.
No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
That same law applies to you, numbnuts. And procreation is NOT part of that law. You keep bringing procreation up. We keep reminding you that it's not a requirement. Are you unteachable?
Neil An Blowme

Hoboken, NJ

#42223 Sep 23, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, but I've lived in both worlds.
No-fault is a misnomer, and far too easy to give up.
No one knows what happens when a couple works through difficult times except someone who has weathered those things. And the message it communicates to the children is priceless.
Not ideals at all, but the very best of life and love.
I bet you LOVE the sound of your own voice. Why don't you just post the phone book? Your posts are incoherent babble, and I bet you don't even see the contradictions in them, do ya?

Just out of curiosity, who told you that you knew what you were talking about?
Kresimir

Irvine, CA

#42224 Sep 23, 2013
Besides, with currently technology and methods like in vitro fertilization with sperm/egg donors, it's completely possible to produce embryos that are the genetic offspring of two people of the same sex. So the procreation argument becomes a non-issue as well.

I'm also going to anticipate the likely next fallback from the anti-ssm point of view: it's not natural. Well, you want to know what else isn't natural? Vaccinations, prosthetic limbs, hearing aids, computers, or pretty much anything else that helps people overcome natural obstacles, and which make this modern era worth living in compared to the pre-industrial age.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42225 Sep 24, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Not equal to marriage.
In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.
No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
Kresimir wrote:
<quoted text>
It wouldn't change what you said. But it would render similar opinions largely irrelevant.
You confuse facts with opinion. Not because you don't know they are facts, but because they are facts that conflict with a manufactured illusion you are trying to pass off as reality.

Those facts will never be irrelevant. They will always distinguish a ss couple from marriage.

However, your comments are not an opinion either. They are pure and simply a lie.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42226 Sep 24, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Not equal to marriage.
In every aspect, ss couples will only ever be a mutually sterile, pointlessly duplicate gendered half of marriage.
No manipulated law can make a fake, manufactured couple marriage.
Neil An Blowme wrote:
<quoted text>
That same law applies to you, numbnuts. And procreation is NOT part of that law. You keep bringing procreation up. We keep reminding you that it's not a requirement. Are you unteachable?
Your president and justice department ignore laws they disagree with. Why am I not justified in doing the same thing? Especially when those laws are manipulations of the Constitution?

As I have stated many times, a 'requirement' is not necessary for a relationship that needs protection NOT to procreate, especially from those seeking to impose a relationship that needs protection just to have abusive imitation intercourse! Not to mention, that is totally incapable of procreating EVER! 100% barren and desolate!

How idiotic!

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42227 Sep 24, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, but I've lived in both worlds.
No-fault is a misnomer, and far too easy to give up.
No one knows what happens when a couple works through difficult times except someone who has weathered those things. And the message it communicates to the children is priceless.
Not ideals at all, but the very best of life and love.
Neil An Blowme wrote:
<quoted text>
I bet you LOVE the sound of your own voice. Why don't you just post the phone book? Your posts are incoherent babble, and I bet you don't even see the contradictions in them, do ya?
Just out of curiosity, who told you that you knew what you were talking about?
Just what are you confused about honey?

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42228 Sep 24, 2013
Kresimir wrote:
Besides, with currently technology and methods like in vitro fertilization with sperm/egg donors, it's completely possible to produce embryos that are the genetic offspring of two people of the same sex. So the procreation argument becomes a non-issue as well.
I'm also going to anticipate the likely next fallback from the anti-ssm point of view: it's not natural. Well, you want to know what else isn't natural? Vaccinations, prosthetic limbs, hearing aids, computers, or pretty much anything else that helps people overcome natural obstacles, and which make this modern era worth living in compared to the pre-industrial age.
They believe it is possible. Has it been done yet? No.

This fact remains. At every point of comparison, including procreation, there are vast distinctions between marriage and ss couples.
Kresimir

Irvine, CA

#42229 Sep 24, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
They believe it is possible. Has it been done yet? No.
This fact remains. At every point of comparison, including procreation, there are vast distinctions between marriage and ss couples.
It's been done in mice. And if you read in detail, there's hardly any scientific reason why it couldn't be replicated in humans.

I think what you mean to say, is that at every point of comparison, except for maybe procreation, there are highly abstract and subjective distinctions between opposite-sex marriages and same-sex marriages. But when you boil it all down, none of it really matters in a larger context.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42230 Sep 24, 2013
Kresimir wrote:
<quoted text>
It's been done in mice. And if you read in detail, there's hardly any scientific reason why it couldn't be replicated in humans.
I think what you mean to say, is that at every point of comparison, except for maybe procreation, there are highly abstract and subjective distinctions between opposite-sex marriages and same-sex marriages. But when you boil it all down, none of it really matters in a larger context.
"hardly any" are the key words...

Duplicate genders is an 'abstract' distinction from diverse gendered couples???

Here is a list of just some 'abstracts';

If you
believe denying marriage to a relationship
will prevent love

If you
demand any committed relationship
has to be called marriage

If you
claim rights and benefits can only be acquired
by an imposition on marriage

If you
equate the diversity of two genders
with the redundancy of same genders

If you
desecrate the sacred tradition of all major religions
and violate the historic practice of every single culture in history

If you
believe a fundamental change to the building block of society
will have absolutely no affect

If you
think a law can change
the reality of crucial distinctions in relationships

If you
pretend duplicating sexuality
is the same as blending masculinity and femininity

If you
condemn some children to parents of only one gender
and deliberately deny some children one natural parent

If you
ignore the design of sexual union
to manipulate a harmful act

If you
violate evolution's law of reproduction
to equate a genetic dead end

If you
risk the healthiest human relationship
to include one of the unhealthiest

If you
parallel the sole birthplace of every other relationship
with one that can reproduce none

If you
dilute all these things
down to just 'a committed relationship of two people'

Then, and only then, can you equate same-sex unions with marriage.
YOURALOSER

Paris, IL

#42231 Sep 24, 2013
Huh wrote:
<quoted text>
A same sex couple will be every bit as much of a couple as you and your wife.....SAME SAME.
Know two guys who have been together for 20 years have great business own many properties and are pillars of the community. They are great people. WHY DO YOU HATE THEM HAVING EQUALITY?
Really 20 years and no kids bet they cant have a baby can they or must be like you a Ahole baby?
Kresimir

Irvine, CA

#42232 Sep 24, 2013
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
"hardly any" are the key words...
Duplicate genders is an 'abstract' distinction from diverse gendered couples???
Here is a list of just some 'abstracts';
(really long post)
"hardly any" implies that in all likelihood it'll happen eventually.

Also, for all your emphatic statements that try to distinguish between your "fact" and others' "opinions", about 3/4ths of that list you compiled was opinion

And 3/4ths of it was just completely bewildering ignorance.

When you got to the part about federal benefits you reminded me of the tale of the Buddhist monk who hoards material wealth from temple donations but then turns around and says to all his disciples that they don't need it to be true Buddhists. Talk about being a hypocrite on a high horse.

I'd give a more detailed breakdown on the excessive shortcomings of that post, but it's 3:40am here and I'm practically incapacitated from having too much wine. So I guess I'll continue this later, that is whenever you decide to start making sense.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#42233 Sep 24, 2013
Kresimir wrote:
<quoted text>
"hardly any" implies that in all likelihood it'll happen eventually.
Also, for all your emphatic statements that try to distinguish between your "fact" and others' "opinions", about 3/4ths of that list you compiled was opinion
And 3/4ths of it was just completely bewildering ignorance.
When you got to the part about federal benefits you reminded me of the tale of the Buddhist monk who hoards material wealth from temple donations but then turns around and says to all his disciples that they don't need it to be true Buddhists. Talk about being a hypocrite on a high horse.
I'd give a more detailed breakdown on the excessive shortcomings of that post, but it's 3:40am here and I'm practically incapacitated from having too much wine. So I guess I'll continue this later, that is whenever you decide to start making sense.
I'll wait.

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