Barack Obama, our next President

"The road ahead will be long. Our climb will be steep," Obama cautioned. Young and charismatic but with little experience on the national level, Obama smashed through racial barriers and easily defeated ... Full Story
NWax

Windsor, CT

#821730 Dec 14, 2012
OldRaider wrote:
<quoted text>
Read it again moron. You stopped before you came to "Even if there is such a provision in the agreement, the most that can be required of you is to pay the union fees... agency fee".
This made my point that no one is REQUIRED to join a union, just pay their fair share of negotiating and enforcing a contract.
"Under the NLRA, you cannot be required to be a member of a union or pay it any monies as a condition of employment unless the collective bargaining agreement between your employer and your union contains a provision requiring all employees to either join the union or pay union fees. Even if there is such a provision in the agreement, the most that can be required of you is to pay the union fees (generally called an "agency fee.")"
Get over it you old flock. You thug Union lost and the regular folk/worker won. Go spin your crap somewhere else, Ammo Boy.
NWax

Windsor, CT

#821731 Dec 14, 2012
OldRaider wrote:
Consider the situation where the legal fee to create a contract in a company of five employees is $1,000 and one of those employees chooses not to pay his share. Then instead of five workers paying $200 each, four must pay $250. That freeloading right-wing bloodsucker has effectively stolen $50 from the other four. I'd suggest that union members take whatever action necessary to protect their property from these thieves.
Blah, blah....
NWax

Windsor, CT

#821732 Dec 14, 2012
PDUPONT wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes Carol but the GOP is rejecting tax increases on the wealthiest advocating cuts only.
Under the Democratic proposals middleclass taxes will stay the same.
You are a liar and an idiot. Obama is not compromising, yet wants the GOP to.

The GOP wants real reform which includes spending cuts.

Morons like you just want feel good action that screws our kids.

Since: May 11

Loysville, PA

#821733 Dec 14, 2012
Lil Ticked wrote:
<quoted text>Unions are a scam and have out lived their usefullness.
1) Labor unions often harm the well-being of the worst-off by making entry into low-wage work more difficult, raising the bottom rung of the wage ladder above the marginal productivity of outsiders.
2) This provides the unions institutionally with a kind of control over access to labor market rents, which contributes to hierarchical power relations within unions that can be highly problematic.
3) Unions have often contributed to making their firms or their industries uncompetitive; they lack a built-in check that would keep them from killing the goose. This may be an even worse problem when they are faced with temporarily oligopolistic or monopolistic firms– the big traditional airlines, the Big Three automakers, traditional AT&T— which are themselves prone to become vulnerable overcommitted dinosaurs over time, and which are happy enough to lock in medium-term labor peace with contracts that put the firm one transformative competitor away from disaster.
4) Public sector unions have, under some conditions, a considerable ability to capture both sides of the bargaining table and seriously weaken public sector budget restraint.
5) Unions bureaucratize work relations in ways that can be both unpleasant and counterproductive for all concerned; they create rigidities and inflexibilities that can prevent cooperative improvements.
6) Labor unions form the organizational core of political parties and movements that seek to do more than bargain in the workplace; they’ve been a major force for social-democratic political economic organization. And the politics they shape is not especially prone to be liberal along cultural, social, or constitutional dimensions.
7) Unions– their leadership, their membership, their supporters– are capable of significant bullying that easily spills into immoral coercion against outsiders, nonmembers, and dissenters; the charge of “scab” is often an accusation of punishable treason against a cause that the accused never signed up for.
Blah Blah Blah

If all employers treated their employees with respect & paid a fair wage, unions would not exist.

Since: May 11

Loysville, PA

#821734 Dec 14, 2012
John Galt wrote:
<quoted text>
The only "qualifications" required of union workers are the payment of union dues.
In fact, unions are a refuge for incompetent slugs.
This is not true.

Union pay scales are based on skills & experience.
Lincoln Duncan

United States

#821735 Dec 14, 2012
RealDave wrote:
<quoted text>
Blah Blah Blah
If all employers treated their employees with respect & paid a fair wage, unions would not exist.
Right wing seems to hate the 47% or now seems the 98%.

“fairtax.org”

Since: Dec 08

gauley bridge wv

#821736 Dec 14, 2012
PDUPONT wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey stupid! Syria was and still is an ally of Iran which was Sadaam Hussein's archenemy. Why would he be sending them his WMD?
You're an idiot!
Russia?

“There is no such thing”

Since: May 08

as a reasonable person

#821737 Dec 14, 2012
RealDave wrote:
<quoted text>
Blah Blah Blah
If all employers treated their employees with respect & paid a fair wage, unions would not exist.
Obviously you are a union supporter and speaking from an emotional perspective. I did that work out for Hostess?
I also notice that the unions in Michigan conduct themselves with an over emotional lack of dignity as well.

Since: May 11

Loysville, PA

#821738 Dec 14, 2012
Eman wrote:
<quoted text>
What a lying sack of sht. 98% of americans don't pay income taxes.
The population of the US is 311 million.

2% would be 62,200,000.

There are more federal income tax returns than that that pay taxes.

That doesn't count the joint returns where one retun would be two people.

My God you are one dumb POS.
sonicfilter

Indianapolis, IN

#821739 Dec 14, 2012
libertarian site....

When Right-To-Work Is Wrong and Un-Libertarian

"Employers own the wages they will pay and the sites where work will be performed under such contracts. So it’s their right to dispense the wages and make the sites available specifically to union members, just as it’s their right, more generally, to trade with anyone they choose.

When a legislature interferes with voluntary employment contracts, it infringes people’s freedom to bargain with their own labor and possessions. Treating this kind of interference as acceptable means licensing arbitrary interventions into the market by politicians, who are ill-equipped to second-guess the decisions made by the real people making work agreements with one another."

http://reason.com/blog/2012/12/12/when-right-...

Since: May 11

Loysville, PA

#821740 Dec 14, 2012
John Galt wrote:
<quoted text>
When the economy crashes because of tax increases, the democrats will be demanding tax cuts.
Like it did in the 90's?
sonicfilter

Indianapolis, IN

#821741 Dec 14, 2012
Proponents of right-to-work laws defend them on several grounds:

The laws lower wage costs, and thus consumer prices.
The laws benefit workers in non-unionized workplaces, who will earn less in their absence.
The laws give particular workers opportunities to negotiate for better, or different, terms of employment.

It’s not the job of the government to interfere with free agreements to lower costs or boost incomes. Presumably the government could force lots of people to work for no wages at all. That would also do what right-to-work laws do, albeit much more dramatically: It would treat people as slaves. The same would be true if it mandated wages for everyone.

All that people need in order to negotiate for themselves is freedom of contract.(Of course, sometimes they might not be able to do so if an employer is bound by a union contract that prohibits individual negotiations. But if the contract is a voluntary one, the government has no business interfering with it.)

Read more: http://www.fee.org/the_freeman/detail/whats-w...
sonicfilter

Indianapolis, IN

#821742 Dec 14, 2012
Good Conservative Policies Fall Off Fiscal Cliff

In the absence of good ideas that Republicans agree on, bad ideas that Democrats hate will do.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-12/good...
sonicfilter

Indianapolis, IN

#821743 Dec 14, 2012
Right-to-work is big government

It deserves mentioning that right-to-work laws are actually counter to the expressed philosophy of the right wing, and especially the libertarian sorts. Few seem to understand (or discuss) the mechanics of how right-to-work laws actually achieve their expressed aim. They do so by prohibiting freedom of contract. Specifically, the laws make it illegal for a union and a business to freely enter into a contract with one another over requiring that employees be union members. If these two actors want to enter into such a contract, it does not matter: the law says they cannot.

So it functions as an economic regulation that prohibits certain kinds of contracts. Naturally you would expect politicians that are vehemently against economic regulation and laws that restrict freedom of contract to be opposed to right-to-work. Right? Well, no. Because at the end of the day, those are simply shell arguments. Freedom of contract and less government regulation are principles to stand behind only as long as they flatter the needs of capital. When capital is better served by violating these principles, then the right is more than willing to do so.

On this blog, I like to entertain right-wing arguments on face value because I do not think they actually generate the kinds of conclusions right-wingers claim they do. But in reality it’s important to always keep in mind that that these arguments are purely objects of convenience and seek to obscure the true interests of the right. If you want a model that will predict how right-wingers will behave, the best one going is to just determine what behaviors best flatter capital and the rich. If you use a model that relies upon the principles they espouse, you will wind up looking as stupid as Dick Morris and confused as Karl Rove.

http://mattbruenig.com/2012/12/06/right-to-wo...

Since: May 11

Loysville, PA

#821745 Dec 14, 2012
Eman wrote:
<quoted text>
Even letterman thinks he's a lying sack of sht.
" DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST: Here's what upset me last night, this playing fast and loose with facts. And the President Obama cites the op-ed piece that Romney wrote about Detroit,“Let them go bankrupt, let them go bankrupt,” and last night he brings it up again.“Oh, no, Governor, you said let them go bankrupt, blah blah blah, let them go bankrupt.” And Mitt said,“No, no, check the thing, check the thing, check the thing.”
Now, I don't care whether you're Republican or Democrat, you want your president to be telling the truth; you want the contender to be lying. And so what we found out today or soon thereafter that, in fact, the President Obama was not telling the truth about what was excerpted from that op-ed piece. I felt discouraged.
RACHEL MADDOW: Because the "Let Detroit go bankrupt" headline you feel like was inappropriate?
LETTERMAN: Well, the fact the President is invoking it and swearing that he was right and that Romney was wrong and I thought, well, he's the president of course he's right. Well, it turned out no, he was taking liberties with that."
Romney's plan was to let GM go bankrupt. That was the truth.

His plan was that it would then come back after receiving funding from private sources.

Experts say that those sources weren't available.

Then what would happen?

Since: Nov 09

Pharr, TX

#821746 Dec 14, 2012
Lil Ticked wrote:
<quoted text>Unions are a scam and have out lived their usefullness.
1) Labor unions often harm the well-being of the worst-off by making entry into low-wage work more difficult, raising the bottom rung of the wage ladder above the marginal productivity of outsiders.
2) This provides the unions institutionally with a kind of control over access to labor market rents, which contributes to hierarchical power relations within unions that can be highly problematic.
3) Unions have often contributed to making their firms or their industries uncompetitive; they lack a built-in check that would keep them from killing the goose. This may be an even worse problem when they are faced with temporarily oligopolistic or monopolistic firms– the big traditional airlines, the Big Three automakers, traditional AT&T— which are themselves prone to become vulnerable overcommitted dinosaurs over time, and which are happy enough to lock in medium-term labor peace with contracts that put the firm one transformative competitor away from disaster.
4) Public sector unions have, under some conditions, a considerable ability to capture both sides of the bargaining table and seriously weaken public sector budget restraint.
5) Unions bureaucratize work relations in ways that can be both unpleasant and counterproductive for all concerned; they create rigidities and inflexibilities that can prevent cooperative improvements.
6) Labor unions form the organizational core of political parties and movements that seek to do more than bargain in the workplace; they’ve been a major force for social-democratic political economic organization. And the politics they shape is not especially prone to be liberal along cultural, social, or constitutional dimensions.
7) Unions– their leadership, their membership, their supporters– are capable of significant bullying that easily spills into immoral coercion against outsiders, nonmembers, and dissenters; the charge of “scab” is often an accusation of punishable treason against a cause that the accused never signed up for.
There are costs in negotiating and enforcing a contract. Ensuring a safe working environment and lobbying for remedies to work related problems takes time and money. Protecting against management abuses of power such as nepotism and favoritism requires oversight. No reasonable person believes that each individual is better off bearing the burden of these tasks themselves.
Don't fool yourself, non-union workplaces use models developed through union efforts and non-union workplaces also benefit from the competitive salaries generated by union contracts.
Its naive to say unions have outlived their usefulness.
Obama 2016

Virginia Beach, VA

#821747 Dec 14, 2012
ObamaRezcoDoddReal estate wrote:
<quoted text>
You'll be another Obama Muslim lover hiding in a brand new Mosque built by the Unions!
I'll be safer there than in my local mall or movie theater.
Obama 2016

Virginia Beach, VA

#821748 Dec 14, 2012
gun nuts wrote:
<quoted text> they will get all the ammo befor getting the guns.
I think Cook Countie's 5 cents per round "violence tax" should be implemented nationwide. Let the gun nuts fix the deficit since there responsible for most of Americas health care costs.
Obama 2016

Virginia Beach, VA

#821749 Dec 14, 2012
gun nuts wrote:
<quoted text>bann libtards ,they cause much worse damage than guns
Typical racist republican. Wants to bann free speech.
ole_47

Blanchard, OK

#821750 Dec 14, 2012
RealDave wrote:
<quoted text>
Blah Blah Blah
If all employers treated their employees with respect & paid a fair wage, unions would not exist.
Ethics realdave...
Laws and 'unions' won't change idiots into einsteins or a-holes into angels...

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