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“reign in blood”

Since: May 09

Wilmington, IL

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#61
Oct 19, 2012
 

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pde wrote:
<quoted text>
The last time I heard an older man with grown children use a line similar to "my children didn't act like that because it wasn't allowed in our household," his wife looked at him like he had two heads.
Dumb bimbo. No wonder she has a bratty kid.

Since: Aug 08

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#62
Oct 19, 2012
 
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>I think it was... that makes me an ultra liberal because I disagreed with him when he was disagreeing with somone else unless we agree to disagree andconcur instead which will re-moderate me?
Zactly!

Since: Aug 08

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#63
Oct 19, 2012
 
pde wrote:
<quoted text>The last time I heard an older man with grown children use a line similar to "my children didn't act like that because it wasn't allowed in our household," his wife looked at him like he had two heads.
So what? It doesn't mean it'sgood parenting to tolerate that or that what tonka and I say is untrue or inaccurate.

I've said I wouldn't tolerate it and tonka has said the same. As tonka said you might not be able to physically stop a child from having a melt down tantrum, but you can sure as heck make the consequences so bad that the child will realize that having a tantrum is not in his or her best interest. It's actually quite easy to nip in the bud, provided you are consistent and proportionally increase consequences to the behavior and have done this from an early age. That's all my kids know.

My kids know they aren't in charge and they don't get to call the shots. Pretty sure my wife wouldn't look at me like I had two heads if she saw me say that.

I actually just have to say, fine, don't listen ... your gonna sit on timeout snd timeout doesn't even begin until you are silent and if you don't get silent very soon you aren't doing x and 9 out of ten times my kids are like noooooo, please daddy I'll listen; why; cause they know when I say it, I mean it.

I grew up with parents who didn't enforce shyte consistently. I swore when I had kids I wasn't gonna be that parent. I swore I was going to be clear about what I expect and consistent about enforcement, and I am, even if sometimes it hurts me to see them miss out on stuff.

There is a reason why my kids teachers praise my wife and our kids during conferences. We don't put up with that crap.
pde

Davis Junction, IL

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#64
Oct 20, 2012
 

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Sublime1 wrote:
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So what? It doesn't mean it'sgood parenting to tolerate that or that what tonka and I say is untrue or inaccurate.
I'm not saying that what you or Tonka are saying is inaccurate. I'm saying that given the circumstances I see, I read the letter itself with a big grain of salt. I'm seeing the letter writer not say that the mom isn't dealing with the behavior but that it shouldn't happen at all. It's going to happen with some children no matter how it's dealt with or not. Dealing with it isn't going to make it magically and abruptly stop, it could take years of work.

It's a reality that many men, particularly men who are older and whose first set of children are already out of the house, didn't participate in child raising or child discipline to the degree that you and Tonka appear to do. So, their knowledge of what actually went on in the house is less, and their recollection of how their children actually behaved is rosier.

My bet is that down the road, the letter writer is most likely going to distressed with the behavior of both the current 9-year-old and the soon-to-be baby, and place all blame for it on the woman.

Toj

“Equality”

Since: Jul 12

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#65
Oct 20, 2012
 
pde wrote:
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I'm not saying that what you or Tonka are saying is inaccurate. I'm saying that given the circumstances I see, I read the letter itself with a big grain of salt. I'm seeing the letter writer not say that the mom isn't dealing with the behavior but that it shouldn't happen at all. It's going to happen with some children no matter how it's dealt with or not. Dealing with it isn't going to make it magically and abruptly stop, it could take years of work.
It's a reality that many men, particularly men who are older and whose first set of children are already out of the house, didn't participate in child raising or child discipline to the degree that you and Tonka appear to do. So, their knowledge of what actually went on in the house is less, and their recollection of how their children actually behaved is rosier.
My bet is that down the road, the letter writer is most likely going to distressed with the behavior of both the current 9-year-old and the soon-to-be baby, and place all blame for it on the woman.
That's what I see as well.

I think what the guys on here are doing with their kids is working for their families and they're involved. All good things. Doesn't mean that's how it goes in all families. Sometimes men think they are involved when all they say is "not in my house" but then don't back it up with actions and the reality of the situation. Not saying that women don't do the same thing -- they do. Both are not good. It seems that might be what's happening in the LW household -- not sure though since the information is scant.

The thing with these letters is we get to pretend we know, but we really don't.

“...,to wit”

Since: Jun 09

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#66
Oct 20, 2012
 

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pde wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not saying that what you or Tonka are saying is inaccurate. I'm saying that given the circumstances I see, I read the letter itself with a big grain of salt. I'm seeing the letter writer not say that the mom isn't dealing with the behavior but that it shouldn't happen at all. It's going to happen with some children no matter how it's dealt with or not. Dealing with it isn't going to make it magically and abruptly stop, it could take years of work.
It's a reality that many men, particularly men who are older and whose first set of children are already out of the house, didn't participate in child raising or child discipline to the degree that you and Tonka appear to do. So, their knowledge of what actually went on in the house is less, and their recollection of how their children actually behaved is rosier.
My bet is that down the road, the letter writer is most likely going to distressed with the behavior of both the current 9-year-old and the soon-to-be baby, and place all blame for it on the woman.
It was happening at 9 because mom did not put a stop to it at 6.

30 years ago guys were participating in child care, SAHM vs FTWM was a long established issue and no fewer men were involved in childcare than there are today.

I was there. I know. Just because teh guy is presumed to be older does not make him from pre 1965

Toj

“Equality”

Since: Jul 12

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#67
Oct 20, 2012
 
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>
It was happening at 9 because mom did not put a stop to it at 6.
30 years ago guys were participating in child care, SAHM vs FTWM was a long established issue and no fewer men were involved in childcare than there are today.
I was there. I know. Just because teh guy is presumed to be older does not make him from pre 1965
Eh, not as prevalent as today. I'm sure there were more then than there was in 1965. Each decade sees a change in how things "were". It also depends upon where a person lives. Each geographical area has differences as well.

There are men today who don't have much to do about childcare. Not as many as before, thankfully. That's why I cringe when I hear someone says "that's how my parents did it" -- from raising children to every day life. Life should change from generation to generation. We learn things. Doesn't mean all people do change with the times.

“On Deck”

Since: Aug 08

French Polynesia

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#68
Oct 20, 2012
 
Maybe so Sub, but I see continual time-outs as source of resentment.
This guy wants the child to consider him a parent, which he is not and will never be.

I had a step-father, and that is all he was. A step.
He's a lawyer too. We haven't spoke in years.

Toj

“Equality”

Since: Jul 12

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#69
Oct 20, 2012
 
loose cannon wrote:
Maybe so Sub, but I see continual time-outs as source of resentment.
This guy wants the child to consider him a parent, which he is not and will never be.
I had a step-father, and that is all he was. A step.
He's a lawyer too. We haven't spoke in years.
Everyone has a different experience. I agree that you have to do more than time out, but steps can sometimes be the most important person in your life. Sometimes not. It really depends on the situation, the people, and how you get along.

Since: Aug 08

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#70
Oct 20, 2012
 
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>It was happening at 9 because mom did not put a stop to it at 6.
^^^^ this.
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>30 years ago guys were participating in child care, SAHM vs FTWM was a long established issue and no fewer men were involved in childcare than there are today.

I was there. I know. Just because teh guy is presumed to be older does not make him from pre 1965
I agree. I honestly don't know what she is talking about.

Since: Aug 08

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#71
Oct 20, 2012
 
loose cannon wrote:
Maybe so Sub, but I see continual time-outs as source of resentment.
It's not just timeouts, but using words and explaining why they are on timeout, when necessary.

I don't think my kids are exceptional and they get it. I've talked to them and explained I'm not doing a good job being a parent if I don't punish them for misbehaving. They get it. Even my son with autism does and that is no easy feat. They understand it, even if they may not like it at the time.

They don't resent me either. They think im the greatest thing since sliced bread at their age. I'm super fly, lol.
loose cannon wrote:
This guy wants the child to consider him a parent, which he is not and will never be.
I'm not getting that vibe at all. I think you are projecting.
loose cannon wrote:
I had a step-father, and that is all he was. A step.
He's a lawyer too. We haven't spoke in years.
Hard for me to opine on that situation. Maybe he was a jerk. Maybe he was only there with a stick, but not for love. Maybe your mom didn't do a better job of disciplining you, so he didn't have to be the bad guy. Maybe your mom didn't teach you to respect him and facilitate a better relationship between the two of you. Maybe it was a combo of both. Hard for me to know. I wasn't there.

I do agree with P that good parenting starts very early and doesn't involve blinders.

Since: Aug 08

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#72
Oct 20, 2012
 
I also rarely have to put my kids on timeout. So they aren't continual. When I do have to do so, I do it right, tho. That was my point.
pde

Davis Junction, IL

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#73
Oct 20, 2012
 

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Sublime1 wrote:
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I agree. I honestly don't know what she is talking about.
Summary: I see someone who says that his children didn't have behavior problems because it wasn't acceptable in his house, as not being a person who had much involvement in getting his children to the point where said behavior was not occurring. Because someone who was involved in getting his already-raised children to that point would know it is generally a lot more work than simply declaring the behavior unacceptable.

“A Programmer is not in IT!”

Since: Feb 09

Neda, stay with me!

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#74
Oct 22, 2012
 
What a lucky man....
loose cannon wrote:
Maybe so Sub, but I see continual time-outs as source of resentment.
This guy wants the child to consider him a parent, which he is not and will never be.
I had a step-father, and that is all he was. A step.
He's a lawyer too. We haven't spoke in years.

“I Am Mine”

Since: Dec 08

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#75
Oct 22, 2012
 
PEllen wrote:
<quoted text>
It was happening at 9 because mom did not put a stop to it at 6.
30 years ago guys were participating in child care, SAHM vs FTWM was a long established issue and no fewer men were involved in childcare than there are today.
I was there. I know. Just because teh guy is presumed to be older does not make him from pre 1965
And this idea that dads were not involved seems puzzling in light of the phrase, "YOU WAIT TILL YOUR FATHER GETS HOME!"

That's not a new one. That's been around a long time. Basically, if you won't behave for mom, pop's gonna straighten you out when he gets home.

Since: Aug 08

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#76
Oct 22, 2012
 
pde wrote:
<quoted text>
Summary: I see someone who says that his children didn't have behavior problems because it wasn't acceptable in his house, as not being a person who had much involvement in getting his children to the point where said behavior was not occurring. Because someone who was involved in getting his already-raised children to that point would know it is generally a lot more work than simply declaring the behavior unacceptable.
That may be how you see things. I merely point out that someone saying that said behavior wasn't accepted in their house, isn't saying that it doesn't take a lot of work or saying that they simply snapped their fingers and declared to their children that it was not accepted.

Since: Aug 08

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#77
Oct 22, 2012
 
RACE wrote:
What a lucky man....
<quoted text>
LOL

“It made sense at the time....”

Since: May 09

Schaumburg, IL

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#78
Oct 22, 2012
 
Mister Tonka wrote:
<quoted text>And this idea that dads were not involved seems puzzling in light of the phrase, "YOU WAIT TILL YOUR FATHER GETS HOME!"
That's not a new one. That's been around a long time. Basically, if you won't behave for mom, pop's gonna straighten you out when he gets home.
family folk lore has it that my father's brother was pitching a fit in the grocery store, the likes of which he should have outgrown years prior. a delivery man two rows over heard it, went over to the kid, smacked him but good, and everyone went on their merry way.

the delivery man was my grandfather... he recognized teh particular tone of the fit, and went right over to "take care of it". he didn't say anything of note to my grandmother, so i'm sure it looked really odd to anyone else in teh store.(and this was way before child abuse was the issue it is now.)

don't know if father's brother ever tried pitching a fit in a store again. The relationship between my dad nad his brother is nearly non-existant (note the use of "father's brotehr" inseead of uncle), and this story, i think, is part of it.
Sam I Am

Knoxville, TN

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#79
Oct 22, 2012
 
Mister Tonka wrote:
<quoted text>Interesting. I know of a similar test. If you disagree with edogg, you're a liberal.
No, if you disagree with Mutt, you're right.

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