BARACK OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE: Suit contesting Obama's citizen...

Full story: Chicago Tribune

The U.S. Supreme Court will consider Friday whether to take up a lawsuit challenging President-elect Barack Obama 's U.S. citizenship, a continuation of a New Jersey case embraced by some opponents of Obama's ...
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Ellen1

Arlington, MA

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#117530
Oct 15, 2012
 

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SHEEPLE Buster wrote:
<quoted text>
1) Rhodes is not Ark, MORON!
2) Ark was a citizen, not Natural born, IDIOT!
Natural born citizen was never used specifically in regards to Wong Kim Ark's own status as a citizen.
The decision did not confirm that Ark was a Natural born citizen, only a citizen.
**
The Constitution of the United States, as originally adopted, uses the words "citizen of the United States," and "natural-born citizen of the United States." By the original Constitution, every representative in Congress is required to have been "seven years a citizen of the United States," and every Senator to have been "nine years a citizen of the United States." and "no person except a natural-born citizen, or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President."
The Fourteenth Article of Amendment, besides declaring that all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside,
So when you going to prove me wrong, Flaming Faggot?
Re: "Natural born citizen was never used specifically in regards to Wong Kim Ark's own status as a citizen.
The decision did not confirm that Ark was a Natural born citizen, only a citizen."

Absolutely correct. The US Supreme Court confirmed that Wong Kim Ark was a US citizen because it was a citizenship case, and the issue was whether or not he was a US citizen.

But the Wong Kim Ark ruling ALSO (have you heard the word "also" before?) defined the meaning of Natural Born Citizen. It said:

"It thus clearly appears that, by the law of England for the last three centuries, beginning before the settlement of this country and continuing to the present day, aliens, while residing in the dominions possessed by the Crown of England, were within the allegiance, the obedience, the faith or loyalty, the protection, the power, the jurisdiction of the English Sovereign, and therefore every child born in England of alien parents was a natural-born subject unless the child of an ambassador or other diplomatic agent of a foreign State or of an alien enemy in hostile occupation of the place where the child was born.

III. The same rule was in force in all the English Colonies upon this continent down to the time of the Declaration of Independence, and in the United States afterwards, and continued to prevail under the Constitution as originally established."

That says that the meaning of Natural Born comes from the common law (hence not from Vattel or from natural law). And it says that the meaning refers to the place of birth, thus not to the parents. And it says that every child born in the USA except for the children of foreign diplomats is Natural Born. And it says that the rule was used in Britain, and in the American colonies, and in the early states AND UNDER THE CONSTITUTION.

That is why constitutional scholars say:

“Under the longstanding English common-law principle of jus soli, persons born within the territory of the sovereign (other than children of enemy aliens or foreign diplomats) are citizens from birth. Thus, those persons born within the United States are "natural born citizens" and eligible to be President. Much less certain, however, is whether children born abroad of United States citizens are "natural born citizens" eligible to serve as President ..."---- Edwin Meese, et al, THE HERITAGE GUIDE TO THE CONSTITUTION (2005)[Edwin Meese was Ronald Reagan’s attorney general, and the Heritage Foundation is a well-known Conservative organization.]

And there have been seven state courts ruling on Obama and one that ruled on McCain, and every single one of them referred to the Wong Kim Ark ruling and said that it had defined Natural Born Citizen as every child born in the USA except for foreign diplomats. And the US Supreme Court has just turned down two birther appeals of one of those cases.
Grand Birther

Oregon, OH

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#117531
Oct 15, 2012
 

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LRS wrote:
<quoted text>
Follow the lineage of the father at the time of birth. His father was a transient alien. You keep want to go by England's practices at the time. Where everyone born with the realm of the King was a citizen simply by virtue of birth. America did not adhere to this practice. There are specific reasons why this was done. One of which is, if everyone born on U.S. soil is a U.S. citizen then we would be inviting people who have no allegiance towards America at all to be full fledged citizens????? That's asinine. There are other reasons as well but I'll leave it at that.
Barfer Girks, I see how an illiterate moron could believe the above, but we're dealing with the highest court in the land here. Good thing our Supreme Court has not seated illiterate morons like birthers, right?

Had you read the court's opinion in Ark, you'd know that the above garbage was agrued by the LOSING side in the case, and the court absolutely destroyed the "father's lineage" BS in its opinion.

Sorry, Butthurt Loser, but you're WONG.

IV. It was contended by one of the learned counsel for the United States that the rule of the Roman law, by which the citizenship of the child followed that of the parent, was the true rule of international law, as now recognized in most civilized countries, and had superseded the rule of the common law, depending on birth within the realm, originally founded on feudal considerations.
But at the time of the adoption of the Constitution of the United States in 1789, and long before, it would seem to have been the rule in Europe generally, as it certainly was in France, that, as said by Pothier, "citizens, true and native-born citizens, are those who are born within the extent of the dominion of France," and "mere birth within the realm gives the rights of the native-born citizen, independently of the origin of the father or mother, and of their domicil;" and children born in a foreign country, of a French father who had not established his domicil there nor given up the intention of returning, were also deemed Frenchmen, as Laurent says, by "a favor, a sort of fiction," and Calvo, "by a sort of fiction of exterritoriality, considered as born in France, and therefore invested with French nationality." Pothier Trite des Personnes, pt. 1, tit. 2, sect. 1, nos. 43, 45; Walsh-Serrant v. Walsh-Serrant,(1802) 3 Journal du Palais, 384; S.C., 8 Merlin, Jurisprudence,(5th ed.) Domicile,§ 13; Prefet du Nord v. Lebeau,(1862) Journal du Palais, 1863, 312 and note; 1 Laurent Droit Civil, no. 312; 2 Calvo Droit International,(5th ed.)§ 542; Cockburn on Nationality, 13, 14; Hall's International Law,(4th ed.)§ 68. The general principle of citizenship by birth within French territory prevailed until after the French Revolution, and was affirmed in successive constitutions, from the one adopted by the Constituent Assembly in 1791 to that of the French Republic in 1799. Constitutions et Chartes,(ed. 1830) pp. 100, 136, 148, 186.[667] The Code Napoleon of 1807 changed the law of France, and adopted, instead of the rule of country of birth, jus soli, the rule of descent or blood, just sanguinis, as the leading principle; but an eminent commentator has observed that the framers of that code "appear not to have wholly freed themselves from the ancient rule of France, or rather, indeed, ancient rule of Europe -- de la vieille regle francaise, ou plutot meme de la vieille regle europeenne -- according to which nationality had always been, in former times, determined by the place of birth." 1 Demolombe Cours de Code Napoleon,(4th ed.) no. 146.
Grand Birther

Oregon, OH

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#117532
Oct 15, 2012
 

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The later modifications of the rule in Europe rest upon the constitutions, laws or ordinances of the various countries, and have no important bearing upon the interpretation and effect of the Constitution of the United States. The English Naturalization Act of 33 Vict.(1870) c. 14, and the Commissioners' Report of 1869 out of which it grew, both bear date since the adoption of the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution; and, as observed by Mr. Dicey, that act has not affected the principle by which any person who, whatever the nationality of his parents, is born within the British dominions, acquires British nationality at birth, and is a natural-born British subject. Dicey Conflict of Laws, 741. At the time of the passage of that act, although the tendency on the continent of Europe was to make parentage, rather than birthplace, the criterion of nationality, and citizenship was denied to the native-born children of foreign parents in Germany, Switzerland, Sweden and Norway, yet it appears still to have been conferred upon such children in Holland, Denmark and Portugal, and, when claimed under certain specified conditions, in France, Belgium, Spain, Italy, Greece and Russia. Cockburn on Nationality, 14-21.

There is, therefore, little ground for the theory that, at the time of the adoption of the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution of the United States, there was any settled and definite rule of international law, generally recognized by civilized nations, inconsistent with the ancient rule of citizenship by birth within the dominion.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 694, 666-667
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117533
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Ellen1 wrote:
<quoted text>
America adhered, and still adheres to that practice.
“Under the longstanding English common-law principle of jus soli, persons born within the territory of the sovereign (other than children of enemy aliens or foreign diplomats) are citizens from birth. Thus, those persons born within the United States are "natural born citizens" and eligible to be President. Much less certain, however, is whether children born abroad of United States citizens are "natural born citizens" eligible to serve as President ..."---- Edwin Meese, et al, THE HERITAGE GUIDE TO THE CONSTITUTION (2005)[Edwin Meese was Ronald Reagan’s attorney general, and the Heritage Foundation is a well-known Conservative organization.]
Re: "if everyone born on U.S. soil is a U.S. citizen then we would be inviting people who have no allegiance towards America at all to be full fledged citizens????? That's asinine."
James Madison disagrees:
"It is an established maxim, that birth is a criterion of allegiance. Birth, however, derives its force sometimes from place, and sometimes from parentage; but, in general, place is the most certain criterion; it is what applies in the United States."
In other words, Madison said, and subsequent laws and Supreme Court rulings have confirmed, that our system assumes that if you are born on US soil and your parents are not foreign diplomats, then you will have allegiance to the USA, and only to the USA.
A person born on US soil who fights against the USA can be tried for treason regardless of the citizenship of his parents and regardless of whether the person has dual citizenship status.
You're as dense as Galena.
Ellen1

Arlington, MA

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#117534
Oct 15, 2012
 

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LRS wrote:
<quoted text>
You're as dense as Galena.
And you are not commenting on the issues. the US Supreme Court has ruled that the meaning of Natural Born Citizen comes from the common law and refers to the place of birth. And US law holds that every child born in the USA except for the children of foreign diplomats, has and in fact must have, allegiance to the USA.

Since: Mar 11

Jacksonville, FL

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#117535
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Rogue Scholar wrote:
<quote>
Margaret Thatcher on Socialism
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Jacques Ottawa wrote:
<quoted text>
No atrribution. Who is this nut case narrating this video anyhow?
What are you talking about?
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117536
Oct 15, 2012
 

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What part of this are you unable to comprehend? I put quotation marks around two keywords for ya. Try as you may you cannot get away from "not subject to any foreign power".

During the original debate over the amendment Senator Jacob M. Howard of Michigan—the author of the Citizenship Clause[8]—described the clause as having the same content, despite different wording, as the earlier Civil Rights Act of 1866, namely, that it excludes Native Americans who maintain their tribal ties and "persons born in the United States who are "foreigners", "aliens", who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers."[

Since: Mar 11

Jacksonville, FL

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#117537
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Mitt has announced that I will be his Chief of Staff and Sarah will be his Secretary of State. I thank him for his confidence in me and think Sarah will make a fine Sec. of State.

Since: Mar 11

Jacksonville, FL

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#117540
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Jacques Ottawa wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, he will have more flexibility. So? Are you interpreting what "flexibility" means?
Incidentally, isn't this man Putin the very one your comrade American er hmm communist Lady has been quoting, along with Putin's newspaper, Pravda? Aren't you ashamed, showing off your president as some pawn in the Russians' hands? Anything, right down to his buying a $3.5 million home in Hawaii as he is sure to lose.
Well, you know that communists (Putin) does not get along with fascists (Obama). So what else is new?

Since: Mar 11

Jacksonville, FL

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#117541
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Rogue Scholar 05 wrote:
And Snopes says it is true too. Thank you EPA!!!
http://www.snopes.com/photos/accident/trainfi ...
Jacques Ottawa wrote:
<quoted text>
Was GWB not president then? His fault, no?
Silly Liberal, do you mean the train engineer should have called the president, any president, to avert such an issue? Why if every president had to answer every question 24/7/365, when would he sleep?
But there you go again, blaming Bush for everything that went wrong while he was president. I would not even thought about blaming Obama if this had happened on his watch but you will not let any opportunity like this to blame Bush!!!
Oh, I ran over a nail last week and got a flat tire, should I blame Obama?

Since: Mar 11

Jacksonville, FL

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#117543
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Proverbs 29:9 Used to Describe Joe Biden During VP Debate; RNC Issues Ad

Read more at http://global.christianpost.com/news/proverbs...
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117545
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Ellen1 wrote:
<quoted text>
And you are not commenting on the issues. the US Supreme Court has ruled that the meaning of Natural Born Citizen comes from the common law and refers to the place of birth. And US law holds that every child born in the USA except for the children of foreign diplomats, has and in fact must have, allegiance to the USA.
LMAO
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117546
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Ellen1 wrote:
<quoted text>
And you are not commenting on the issues. the US Supreme Court has ruled that the meaning of Natural Born Citizen comes from the common law and refers to the place of birth. And US law holds that every child born in the USA except for the children of foreign diplomats, has and in fact must have, allegiance to the USA.
You think you can force someone to have allegiance with the U.S.? LOL
Just Sayin

Toledo, OH

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#117547
Oct 15, 2012
 

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It looks like Obama's going to win.

In scandalous footage captured by a Project Veritas videographer, a top Obama campaign worker gleefully helps an undercover reporter cast a ballot for the president in two states. The reporter identifies herself as an Obama supporter who has illegally registered to vote in Florida and Texas and plans to vote in both places.

Organizing for America Regional Field Director Stephanie Caballero – a salaried employee of the Democratic National Committee in Houston, Texas – offers to print out a ballot the reporter can mail to Florida.

“Oh my God, this is so funny,” Caballero says.“It’s cool though.”

However, this was no isolated incident. Project Veritas’ latest effort in Texas, New Jersey, New York and Connecticut shows Obama campaign workers helping people who say they want to commit election fraud.

In August, the Colorado Secretary of State’s Office sent out 4,000 letters to people on its voter rolls who are possible noncitizens ineligible to vote.

In September, the Florida Department of State identified 198 suspected noncitizens who were illegally registered to vote.

In two Ohio counties, the number of people currently registered to vote exceeds the voting-age population, according to the Columbus Dispatch. At least one out of every five registered Ohio voters is likely to be ineligible to cast a ballot.

True the Vote, a Houston-based election integrity group, has notified 160 counties across the nation that there are more voters on registration rolls than eligible voters in each county.

In February, the Pew Center said it found 2.8 million people with active registrations in more than one state.

According to Project Veritas, investigators contacted the North Carolina Board of Elections and presented it with a list of 30,000 residents who died between 2002 and 2012 and are still registered to vote.(And that’s in a state Obama won by only 14,000 votes in 2008!)

Since: May 10

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#117548
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Rogue Scholar 05 wrote:
And Snopes says it is true too. Thank you EPA!!!
http://www.snopes.com/photos/accident/trainfi ...
Jacques Ottawa wrote:
<quoted text>
But have you not always maintained Snopes was a Soros thing? All of a sudden, like Huffington, Washington Post, you quote it when it suits you, still not understanding that reliable news sources will always deliver news it as is, leaving their opinions and editorials for the opinions and editorials pages.
If it is about Obama, they twist the issue. I just Googled "snopes obama college records" and this is what I got:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers...
Ah, what does Obama's SSN have to do with his college records?
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117549
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Just Sayin wrote:
It looks like Obama's going to win.
In scandalous footage captured by a Project Veritas videographer, a top Obama campaign worker gleefully helps an undercover reporter cast a ballot for the president in two states. The reporter identifies herself as an Obama supporter who has illegally registered to vote in Florida and Texas and plans to vote in both places.
Organizing for America Regional Field Director Stephanie Caballero – a salaried employee of the Democratic National Committee in Houston, Texas – offers to print out a ballot the reporter can mail to Florida.
“Oh my God, this is so funny,” Caballero says.“It’s cool though.”
However, this was no isolated incident. Project Veritas’ latest effort in Texas, New Jersey, New York and Connecticut shows Obama campaign workers helping people who say they want to commit election fraud.
In August, the Colorado Secretary of State’s Office sent out 4,000 letters to people on its voter rolls who are possible noncitizens ineligible to vote.
In September, the Florida Department of State identified 198 suspected noncitizens who were illegally registered to vote.
In two Ohio counties, the number of people currently registered to vote exceeds the voting-age population, according to the Columbus Dispatch. At least one out of every five registered Ohio voters is likely to be ineligible to cast a ballot.
True the Vote, a Houston-based election integrity group, has notified 160 counties across the nation that there are more voters on registration rolls than eligible voters in each county.
In February, the Pew Center said it found 2.8 million people with active registrations in more than one state.
According to Project Veritas, investigators contacted the North Carolina Board of Elections and presented it with a list of 30,000 residents who died between 2002 and 2012 and are still registered to vote.(And that’s in a state Obama won by only 14,000 votes in 2008!)
Barfer Girks, is that you?
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117550
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Jacques Ottawa wrote:
Grand Birther wrote:
<quoted text>
Butt Butt Butt Butthurt Loser, I see you've taken to call yourself "Barfer Girks."
<quoted text>
I know GB's not a female. However, were he, you'd lose all interest, so infatuated are you, in almost every post, with genders and weird sexual conotations.
Shhhh, wittle refugeeboi!
Ellen1

Arlington, MA

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#117551
Oct 15, 2012
 

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LRS wrote:
<quoted text>
You think you can force someone to have allegiance with the U.S.? LOL
Legal allegiance. Some people who were born in the USA with three generations of US citizens before them turned out to be spys and traitors. The law is based on legal allegiance.
Ellen1

Arlington, MA

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#117552
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Just Sayin wrote:
It looks like Obama's going to win.
In scandalous footage captured by a Project Veritas videographer, a top Obama campaign worker gleefully helps an undercover reporter cast a ballot for the president in two states. The reporter identifies herself as an Obama supporter who has illegally registered to vote in Florida and Texas and plans to vote in both places.
Organizing for America Regional Field Director Stephanie Caballero – a salaried employee of the Democratic National Committee in Houston, Texas – offers to print out a ballot the reporter can mail to Florida.
“Oh my God, this is so funny,” Caballero says.“It’s cool though.”
However, this was no isolated incident. Project Veritas’ latest effort in Texas, New Jersey, New York and Connecticut shows Obama campaign workers helping people who say they want to commit election fraud.
In August, the Colorado Secretary of State’s Office sent out 4,000 letters to people on its voter rolls who are possible noncitizens ineligible to vote.
In September, the Florida Department of State identified 198 suspected noncitizens who were illegally registered to vote.
In two Ohio counties, the number of people currently registered to vote exceeds the voting-age population, according to the Columbus Dispatch. At least one out of every five registered Ohio voters is likely to be ineligible to cast a ballot.
True the Vote, a Houston-based election integrity group, has notified 160 counties across the nation that there are more voters on registration rolls than eligible voters in each county.
In February, the Pew Center said it found 2.8 million people with active registrations in more than one state.
According to Project Veritas, investigators contacted the North Carolina Board of Elections and presented it with a list of 30,000 residents who died between 2002 and 2012 and are still registered to vote.(And that’s in a state Obama won by only 14,000 votes in 2008!)
What makes you think that Republicans do not do exactly the same thing????
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#117553
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Ellen1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Legal allegiance. Some people who were born in the USA with three generations of US citizens before them turned out to be spys and traitors. The law is based on legal allegiance.
Right.

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