Once slow-moving threat, global warming speeds up, leaving litt...

Full story: Newsday

When Bill Clinton took office in 1993, global warming was a slow-moving environmental problem that was easy to ignore.

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Since: Mar 09

Wichita, KS

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#35365
Apr 26, 2013
 

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Rogue Scholar 05 wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you know why the Vikings called Newfoundland "Vinland"? Because a thousand years ago wild grapes grew there and Vikings liked .... wine!
But ya know, wild grapes no longer grow in Newfoundland. Do you know why? Because Newfound is COLDER now than it was a thousand years ago. Have you ever heard of the Medieval Warm Period? Now, what did we humans do a thousand years ago to cause the Medieval Warm Period?
And I bet you believe than evil mankind is more powerful than our Sun, don't you? Well, our Sun is taking a Rip van Winkle and in the past dozen years the Earth has cooled about one degree centigrade!!!!
http://solarscience.msfc.nasa.gov/images/ssn_...
Now, if you still believe in Gorebal Warming, you need to move to Canada while there is still room for you.
http://www.thegwpf.org/russian-scientist-warn...
More sour grapes. http://www.de-fact-o.com/fact_read.php...
Dont drink the koolaid

Minneapolis, MN

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#35367
Apr 26, 2013
 

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OzRitz wrote:
<quoted text>
It's all about the mix, just because CO2 is part of the natural atmosphere doesn't mean we can flood the place with it. Which is what MAN is doing at the moment. It's all about the balance that is critical to support life regardless of climate and the like.
Good point.

Below 250ppm CO2 would be at a dangerously low level. At 5000 ppm CO2 would be getting closer to a dangerously high level. Currently, at 400 ppm CO2 is MUCH closer to 250 than it is to 5000.

Today, Earth is due to enter into a new Ice Age and with CO2 levels so low it will be unstoppable. Man's only hope is to triple the CO2 in the air and save our planet from Catastrophic Climate Change.
litesong

Everett, WA

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#35368
Apr 26, 2013
 

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drink the kkk-aid wrote:
At 5000 ppm CO2 would be getting closer to a dangerously high level......Man's only hope is to triple the CO2 in the air and save our planet from Catastrophic Climate Change.
You trot out a denial dose CO2 killer poisoning level of non-science. On top of that, you never mention buildings of inadequate ventilation requirements that often have 5-10 TIMES CO2 concentrations of the atmosphere.

Not only do you advocate for higher CO2 levels for the entire life of people & societies, than even the prolifically math crippled 'lyin' brian', your doses of CO2 have major health problems, not only over lifespans, but short term body stresses, too.

Indeed, you earn your name,'drink the kkk-aid', an advocate for death.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

Since: Dec 08

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#35369
Apr 26, 2013
 

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OzRitz wrote:
It's all about the mix, just because CO2 is part of the natural atmosphere doesn't mean we can flood the place with it. Which is what MAN is doing at the moment. It's all about the balance that is critical to support life regardless of climate and the like. I mean if Oxygen suddenly feel below the 20% mark then we would all slowly suffocate to death. So please don't say we can rob one component to have it replaced with another. Even in China now in the big cities the air quality is so poor on some days its at dangerous levels. If it wasn't for the wind blowing it across for others to enjoy they would have to ban vehicles. Especially when they were adding over a million more cars a month up until 2011. When the gov had to step in to control it, these ppl all threw away the bicycles when corporate US & corporate Europe decided this is where the profits are.
China's air quality problem isn't caused by CO2. There's no experiment showing man can change global climate in any measurable way and reproducible way.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

Since: Dec 08

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#35370
Apr 26, 2013
 

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gcaveman1 wrote:
A dodge. Irrelevant. Another lie as far as the air and water are concerned.
Life is just a brief blink of light and warmth before and after and eternity of cold and dark. Enjoy emitting carbon dioxide now because you'll be able to conserve forever when you're dead.
Teddy R

United States

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#35371
Apr 26, 2013
 

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Patriot AKA Bozo wrote:
<quoted text>
You are wrong as usual. Exxon is one of the most profitable corporations in the world.
Profitable. adj. Producing profit rather than loss. SYN: successful, well-managed, assisting, beneficial, contributive, cost-effective, fruitful, gainful, going, good, in the black, productive, sustaining, useful, valuable, worthwhile

I'm sure they would appreciate your unintended compliment.
gcaveman1

Laurel, MS

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#35373
Apr 26, 2013
 

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Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>Life is just a brief blink of light and warmth before and after and eternity of cold and dark. Enjoy emitting carbon dioxide now because you'll be able to conserve forever when you're dead.
A dodge.

Irrelevant.

AKA, more bullshit from lyin brian.

Since: Mar 09

Wichita, KS

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#35374
Apr 26, 2013
 
Teddy R wrote:
<quoted text>
Profitable. adj. Producing profit rather than loss. SYN: successful, well-managed, assisting, beneficial, contributive, cost-effective, fruitful, gainful, going, good, in the black, productive, sustaining, useful, valuable, worthwhile
I'm sure they would appreciate your unintended compliment.
I am sure that they are all of those things as well as m aking more money than most....
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/global...
Teddy R

United States

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#35375
Apr 26, 2013
 

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Patriot AKA Bozo wrote:
<quoted text>
I am sure that they are all of those things as well as m aking more money than most....
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/global...
Are you saying this is a bad thing they should be reviled for? Or are your touting ExxonMobil stock as a "buy?"

I can't tell which.

Your point is ...?
gcaveman1

Laurel, MS

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#35376
Apr 26, 2013
 

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Patriot AKA Bozo wrote:
<quoted text>
You are wrong as usual. Exxon is one of the most profitable corporations in the world. My advice for you is to stick your head down into a bucket of dihydrogen monoxide for ten minutes or so.
Then, there's the Southern Company, a rather large utility, that hopefully, won't be making a profit.

Kemper County Coal Plant

The Kemper County Lignite Plant is planned to be built in the Chickasawhay flood plain, meaning that any runoff from the project will impact the Pascagoula River system. What Mississippi Power wants to do is dig a 100-foot hole in the ground to extract lignite, a wet, woody, low-energy coal and then burn it in a 500-megawatt plant to be built next door. 20,000 acres of prime forest land and small farms will have to be eliminated from existence in order to build this plant and dig the giant hole in the ground.

The Kemper County area where the electricity is generated is not in Miss. Power's service area, so the electricity will be supplied to that county and surrounding areas while the citizens in the 26 counties served by Miss. Power will actually have their rates increased in order to pay for the construction of the plant-- even if the plant does not generate a single kilowatt of electricity! This will be the first plant ever built in MS to be paid for by rate increases before it is put on line.

The technology to derive electricity from this wet, fossil wood called lignite is experimental. As a result, Miss. Power has already charged ratepayers to send the plans to China where a pilot project is underway to build a plant and see if it can generate more electricity than the power consumed in its operation. Miss. Power claims that if this technology works it can sell it around the world, but if China is developing the pilot project, it seems obvious that China will be selling the technology around the world, not Miss. Power.

cont...

Since: Mar 09

Wichita, KS

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#35377
Apr 26, 2013
 
Teddy R wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you saying this is a bad thing they should be reviled for? Or are your touting ExxonMobil stock as a "buy?"
I can't tell which.
Your point is ...?
The Rogue made a comment that Exxon was not one of the top ten oil corporations then went on to make statements about profits. I was only showing that Exxon was in fact one of the top ten in profits. The rest of your meandering is off the subject. Go ahead and buy whatever you like. Be cognizant that we may be approaching the big bubble in carbon investments.
gcaveman1

Laurel, MS

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#35378
Apr 26, 2013
 

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This plant will at least triple the rate electricity costs in the 26 coastal counties since the plant will cost at least $4 billion dollars. This cost is applied to citizens and small business only, since shipyards, casinos, refineries and other large businesses have been guaranteed to have no rate increase as a result of building this plant.

The rate of electricity will have to go up considerably higher than Miss. Power projects because average citizens will likely switch to using more natural gas and other alternatives if the rate is increased. This should eliminate any "all electric homes" from our service area.

Our Public Service Commission is going to decide by May 1 if rates can be increased in order to build this plant. If it is approved, the Sierra Club and concerned citizens may go to court to continue trying to stop this boondoggle from being built. We also hope to convince the DOE that this is not a suitable project for receiving government financial assistance as currently planned.

Southern Company (MS Power's parent) is a major client of Haley Barbour's lobbying firm. Haley Barbour's history with the Southern Company includes aiding Cheney in going back on W's promise to cut emissions ( http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php... ). More recently, the lobbying firm arranged to have federal funds from a similar IGCC plant that was planned in FL and canceled, to be transferred to MS Power. They brag about it on their web site ( http://www.bgrdc.com/clients.html--the second bullet under "Successes"), but transfer of funds to a project before the Environmental Impact Statement is approved is illegal. The Sierra Club intends to file a lawsuit.

<><><>< ><><><> <><>

News comes today that the Sierra Club's predictions are coming true. When first proposed, the plant's construction cost was estimated at $2.4 billion. That was revised fairly soon afterward to $2.88 billion. Now, the latest is that MPC's contractors "underestimated" material and labor costs and have given a new figure of $3.45 billion. Sierra has said all along that it would cost about $4 billion.
litesong

Everett, WA

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#35379
Apr 26, 2013
 
gcaveman1 wrote:
When first proposed, the plant's construction cost was estimated at $2.4 billion. That was revised fairly soon afterward to $2.88 billion. Now, the latest is that MPC's contractors "underestimated" material and labor costs and have given a new figure of $3.45 billion. Sierra has said all along that it would cost about $4 billion.
Yeah, but they wouldn't have gotten the contract if they had bid $4 billion.
gcaveman1

Laurel, MS

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#35380
Apr 26, 2013
 

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litesong wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, but they wouldn't have gotten the contract if they had bid $4 billion.
Surely you're not suggesting that lies were told, similar to those of lyin brian? Or perhaps, mathematical mistakes on a par with lyin brian"s?

Do you think maybe lyin brian was involved?
litesong

Everett, WA

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#35381
Apr 26, 2013
 

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gcaveman1 wrote:
Surely you're not suggesting that lies were told, similar to those of lyin brian? Or perhaps, mathematical mistakes on a par with lyin brian"s?
Do you think maybe lyin brian was involved?
Cost overruns? How can you calculate for that until you run the course? At least, that's what a lot of companies say.

Lookheed won the wondrous C-5A contract, saying they could build the plane for $16 million per copy. Final costs for the C-5A, one of the worst designed airplanes ever, with crippled lifespan & air-hours, was almost 10 times the cost. Further variations were even higher.

Boeing lost the C-5A contract. Boeing then, turned their C-5A proposal into an airliner...... the 747, one of the best designed airplanes ever, with an incredible lifespan.

The C-5A is a monument to the fact, if you spend enough money & hide enough details, you can turn a 'really poor device' into a 'device'.

Now,'lyin' brian' could have been involved in the C-5A debacle. It said, it was in the military.
gcaveman1

Laurel, MS

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#35382
Apr 26, 2013
 
litesong wrote:
<quoted text>
Cost overruns? How can you calculate for that until you run the course? At least, that's what a lot of companies say.
Lookheed won the wondrous C-5A contract, saying they could build the plane for $16 million per copy. Final costs for the C-5A, one of the worst designed airplanes ever, with crippled lifespan & air-hours, was almost 10 times the cost. Further variations were even higher.
Boeing lost the C-5A contract. Boeing then, turned their C-5A proposal into an airliner...... the 747, one of the best designed airplanes ever, with an incredible lifespan.
The C-5A is a monument to the fact, if you spend enough money & hide enough details, you can turn a 'really poor device' into a 'device'.
Now,'lyin' brian' could have been involved in the C-5A debacle. It said, it was in the military.
Parts of the C-5A were fabricated at the Lockheed plant in Meridian, MS. The tail assembly and parts of the wings.

Why would you fabricate parts of a single airplane in different places all over the country? Because Representatives wanted to bring home the bacon. Does that cost more than manufacturing and assembling the aircraft in one giant plant? Without a doubt.

Why didn't Re-pub-lickums compromise on the sequester, even though it took money away from their favorite child, the military? Because they wanted to slow the economy even more to help their chances in 2014 or 2016. Because, in our country today, if you cut the war machine, you hurt Willie the welder and Rosie the riveter.

Several years ago, a Mississippi redneck got pissed about the diversity/equality lectures and shot some of his co-workers, killing 6, I believe. If lyin brian really is a slimy steenking filthy vile reprobate rooting(& rotting) racist pukey proud pig AND 4-time alleged & 4-time proud threatener and we keep demonstrating how stupid he is and exposing his lies, he might go "Lockheed postal" on us when he gets back to the states. Maybe we should exchange phone numbers in case any of us start dropping off the screen. Then our widows can call the others and warn them about lyin brian.
gcaveman1

Laurel, MS

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#35383
Apr 26, 2013
 
Per Lockheed-Martin shooting, Meridian, MS, July, 2003:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_shootin...
Snow Bird

Paducah, KY

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#35384
Apr 26, 2013
 
gcaveman1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I stated at the outset that I did not know if a rapid transition could be made in turning northern forests into farmland. Of course everything will depend upon the pace of change.
But as stated by others, soil and temperature are only two of the factors influencing agriculture, with water being one of the big question marks in a changing climate. Will everything stay as reasonably synchronized as it has been? We don't know. We think we are seeing the synchronization getting screwed up now. What if the 2nd Dust Bowl has already started and we lose America's breadbasket in the next ten or twenty years? Will you and your buddies have all those forests clear cut and ready to plant by then? And if it all happens that fast, where are we going to get our spruce, fir, poplar, birch lumber from?
What we do know is that the systems in operation now, in the many locations they are now, are amazingly complex, and jacking with them would be dangerous and costly.
I think "Coal is King" is a fool for thinking that global warming is good, but a lot of people have been conditioned to think that way. I was born in Appalachia and not long ago the county where I grew up had a big "Pray for Coal" day.

However, he is probably right that humans will have to adapt. I don't think that global warming can be stopped. Even if the USA cuts carbon dioxide emissions places like China, India, and the Third World will still burn coal.

I just hope we have 500 years to do it, but I'm afraid that the crisis will come a lot sooner. Maybe in our children's or grandchildren's lifetimes.

If we are to adapt we have to stop denying that global warming is going to happen and start serious planning for the changes.

Since: Jul 11

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#35385
Apr 26, 2013
 

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Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>China's air quality problem isn't caused by CO2. There's no experiment showing man can change global climate in any measurable way and reproducible way.
All I can say is take your big a$$ truck and go live in Beijing for 12 mths doing the 3 hrs commute to work every day at 10 mph. Then decide that man cant do anything about climate change!

http://www.google.com.au/search...
litesong

Everett, WA

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#35386
Apr 26, 2013
 

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gcaveman1 wrote:
Parts of the C-5A were fabricated at the Lockheed plant in Meridian, MS. The tail assembly and parts of the wings.
Why would you fabricate parts of a single airplane in different places all over the country? Because Representatives wanted to bring home the bacon. Does that cost more than manufacturing and assembling the aircraft in one giant plant?

If lyin brian really is a slimy steenking filthy vile reprobate rooting(& rotting) racist pukey proud pig AND 4-time alleged & 4-time proud threatener and we keep demonstrating how stupid he is and exposing his lies, he might go "Lockheed postal" on us when he gets back to the states. Maybe we should exchange phone numbers in case any of us start dropping off the screen. Then our widows can call the others and warn them about lyin brian.
Lots of good stuff in your post. First, the C-5A was designed & wind tunnel tests started. Lockheed got in a time crunch. With management ruling over the engineers, they let-out sub-assembly contracts pre-maturely. Further wind tunnel tests showed Lockheed had to junk all their sub-assembly contracts. Wind tunnel tests continued, while Lockheed re-let sub-assembly contracts, again. Further tests showed Lockheed had to junk sub-assembly contracts...... again! However, Lockheed was far too deep into the project to start over. Lockheed named what they had, a hi-stress structure. They told the military, that they would repair it, AS IT FELL APART IN THE AIR.

Like your idea about 'lyin' brian'. You know I've been blowing the whistle on him for years. Many toxic topix AGW deniers, I don't trust. The worst is bob burns as far as threats, but 'lyin' brian' is in the running.

However, toxic topix(ALWAYS SMALL LETTERS) has a share of responsibility, too. Once in the past, a lawyer was on AGW topix forums. He said he would take my case against,'lyin' brian'. Someone(Fair Game?) actually found & divulged his name....Stewart?.... I can't remember now. brian pretended to be mad & had a hissy fit.

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