Once slow-moving threat, global warmi...

Once slow-moving threat, global warming speeds up, leaving litt...

There are 63581 comments on the Newsday story from Dec 14, 2008, titled Once slow-moving threat, global warming speeds up, leaving litt.... In it, Newsday reports that:

When Bill Clinton took office in 1993, global warming was a slow-moving environmental problem that was easy to ignore.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Newsday.

Teddy R

San Francisco, CA

#32568 Oct 3, 2012
SpaceBlues wrote:
<quoted text>Gee. Thanks, Teddy, gosh, you're annoying some people.
The subject was not whether engineering is science or not. Actually, it's based firmly on science and mathematics. Did you know that a PhD in engineering is considered a scientist? As a fact, the man in charge of our NAS (National Academy of Sciences), Dr Cicero is a PhD in Electrical Engineering.
Thanks again for the opportunity to discuss.
Well, where's the fun if one is not annoying people? This is Topix! To annoy and to be annoyed is why we're all here after all, innit?

Certainly one can point to many fine engineers and scientists like your Dr. Cicero who have distinguished themselves both as Engineers and as Scientists through their work in each field, just as there are many talented MD-PhDs in the medical field.

Yet the two pursuits remain fundamentally different in nature. The practice of medicine and engineering are Arts - the Art of applying scientific principles and knowledge to solving practical problems through sound professional judgement grounded in practical experience; one does not "experiment" in engineering or clinical practice. A very different game than the pursuit of scientific knowledge.

That there are many talented men and women who are capable of crossing over between science and engineering (or, similarly, between science and clinical practice), to do leading work in both does not make the fundamental difference between science and engineering any less distinct. Those folks I'm sure would agree, and are generally never in doubt about which "hat" they are wearing to work in any given pursuit, whether as scientist vs. engineer or researcher vs. physician.
Teddy R

San Francisco, CA

#32569 Oct 3, 2012
Fair Game wrote:
<quoted text>
Then why cite a model from an obscure corner of computer science?
I didn't - you did.
SpaceBlues

United States

#32570 Oct 3, 2012
Teddy R wrote:
<quoted text>
I respectfully disagree, team-mate.
Experimental variables are not known to be "independent" until experimental results show they are. Until the experiment is performed, any "independence" of variables can only be a presumed independence, and thus any experimental design that depends upon such a presumed independence of experimental variables pre-supposes the result, and is flawed.
It is therefore sufficient for good experimental design that control can be exercised over a single variable - it is redundant and unnecessary to insert "independence" as a qualifier.
<quoted text>
Again I must respectfully reject your editorial comment.
Reproducible and repeatable results do not mean identical results - in fact since all experiments involve some degree of experimental error, any repeat experiment that produced "the same" results - i.e., perfectly identical results with zero experimental error - would be highly suspect.
So "same" would not be correct - "similar" is not incorrect, though there may be better adjectives. But I don't have sufficient appetite for pedantry to go in search of one for Topix.
<quoted text>
Awfully sweet of you to clean up my word, whatever it was, team-mate. In fact I'm in search of a secretary atm - are you interested in the job?
I quite agree on my last sentence, and i have withdrawn it in a previous post.
Toodles.
Toodles, already.

I stand by my first cut. Now you're nit-picky qualitatively, which means unncessarily, ceteris paribus..

Read up on "similar" .. a more sensitive term than 'same' because a required error analysis takes care of all that in a real situation.

Sorry that you're not a careful reader for yourself. Thanks for the job offer but just try harder. As to "atm," what is it?

“CO2 is Gaseous Love”

Since: Dec 08

Home, sweet home.

#32571 Oct 3, 2012
SpaceBlues wrote:
Why why good grief! No, not all experiments are repeatable.
You think not? Can you cite a non-repeatable experiment?

.
SpaceBlues wrote:
No, good experiments don't mean you can be certain of getting results within an error range.
Isn't that what repeatable means? If you do an experiment and get different result every time, that means you aren't controlling independent variables, you don't have a good experiment. Can you cite a good experiment where you can't be certain of getting results with the accustomed error range?

.
SpaceBlues wrote:
No, there's always uncertainty with or without experiments.
Yes, but good experiments reduce uncertainty.

.
SpaceBlues wrote:
Conclusion: it shows that you don't understand science. Btw, there's no pseudoscience but there are people like you who don't know science.
PSEUDOSCIENCE : a system of theories, assumptions, and methods erroneously regarded as scientific
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pse...

“CO2 is Gaseous Love”

Since: Dec 08

Home, sweet home.

#32572 Oct 3, 2012
Northie wrote:
...Science depends on observations and evidence, not necessarily on experiments. One cannot perform experiments on black holes, for example, but that doesn't prevent researchers from drawing conclusions about them based on observed evidence.[URL deleted]
You notice, there is no policy to mitigate black holes so experiments aren't essential in otiose science. If you had a theory on how to mitigate black holes, an experiment would be the only way to test it.

.
Northie wrote:
In the case of our responsibility for cooking the climate, the evidence comes from experiments, from the fossil record, from computer models, and from observed physical phenomena...such as the minor facts that global temperatures are breaking all records decade after decade, and most of the Arctic's sea ice is now friggin' GONE.
I like to call it,'defrosting the climate', it's more descriptive than 'cooking the climate'. The issue is climate change mitigation, the 'act' you expect from Obama. Before anyone acts, let's see some experimental data.

Since: Apr 08

"the green troll"

#32573 Oct 3, 2012
Teddy R wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't - you did.
Hmmm..., that's right- yours was an unsourced quote.

I had to look up where it came from.
Teddy R

San Francisco, CA

#32574 Oct 3, 2012
SpaceBlues wrote:
<quoted text>Toodles, already.
I stand by my first cut. Now you're nit-picky qualitatively, which means unncessarily, ceteris paribus..
Read up on "similar" .. a more sensitive term than 'same' because a required error analysis takes care of all that in a real situation.
Sorry that you're not a careful reader for yourself. Thanks for the job offer but just try harder. As to "atm," what is it?
atm = "at the moment"
Northie

Spokane, WA

#32575 Oct 3, 2012
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text><quoted text>I like to call it,'defrosting the climate', it's more descriptive than 'cooking the climate'.
So is that what they did with witches and heretics during the Reformation; the authorities "defrosted" them?

“EnvironMENTAList ”

Since: Feb 07

Near Detroit

#32576 Oct 3, 2012
SpaceBlues wrote:
<quoted text>Learn science. You, lazy one.
You sound like a bible thumper. Need something to believe in and trust and worship? Doomsday is your worship and no different from a cave man doing the same thing.
PHD

Houston, TX

#32577 Oct 3, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
<quoted text>Spambrat couldn't find anything wrong with it either, he fires blank cartridges wildly for effect.
Much like you firing useless babble for effect. How is your visit with the care giver going?
litesong

Everett, WA

#32578 Oct 3, 2012
Latest about Arctic sea ice melt 'and recovery':

+Barely ABOVE 4 million km2, Arctic sea ice extent is still BELOW any recorded level in any previous year for ~6 weeks, presently at 4,166,563 km2 (October 2, 2012), fractionally gaining ~25,000 km2(a bit more than West Virginia area) of sea ice the previous day, despite the sun, unseen, from the North Pole for 10+ days, & temperatures above the 80th parallel, a bit above -13 degC, fractionally above normal. Much warmth built up in Arctic waters these past months is resisting its conversion back to sea ice, especially southern Arctic waters which have seen much more solar energy absorbed than northern Arctic clear waters.

Only along the Greenland east coast is sea ice extending greatly south. All other regions, including the Northwest Passage, Northeast Passage & Arctic waters, south of the Arctic Ice Pack, resist conversion back to Arctic sea ice.

IN ADDITION, for months, any downwellings in the Arctic waters that have been ice-free, have been conducting much captured solar energy radiating on those clear waters, to the depths of the continental shelves & Arctic Ocean.

This same Arctic Ocean warmth is & will continue to keep Arctic sea ice thinner through the coming winter & even spring. As of October 2, Arctic sea ice VOLUME is ~23% lower than any satellite recorded year AND indications of submarine-detected Arctic sea ice VOLUME.

Yes, the Arctic sea ice Volume is disappearing, day to day, & year to year, quicker than the Arctic sea ice extent, even in the time of Arctic sea ice increase.

“Happy, warm and comfortable”

Since: Oct 10

Mountain retreat, SE Spain

#32579 Oct 4, 2012
Spambrat wrote:
Now you're nit-picky qualitatively, which means unncessarily[sic], ceteris paribus..
All other things being equal and constant, you're a spambrat.
PHD

Houston, TX

#32580 Oct 4, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
<quoted text>All other things being equal and constant, you're a spambrat.
Well if all other things were equal and constant you're care giver should have found a cure for you a dirtling.
SpaceBlues

United States

#32581 Oct 4, 2012
Teddy R wrote:
<quoted text>
atm = "at the moment"
Nice.

Thanks.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#32582 Oct 4, 2012
Teddy R wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry. I still see only different language - making no material difference. Nor do I see anything "expressed incorrectly" in what I posted.
Perhaps this will expand and help to understand that that there are methods other than laboratory experiments.
http://www.experiment-resources.com/research-...

“Facts”

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#32583 Oct 4, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
<quoted text>All other things being equal and constant, you're a spambrat.
Tina and you are the queens of that

Still waiting for you to back up your claims..........LOL
SpaceBlues

United States

#32584 Oct 4, 2012
Earthling-1 wrote:
<quoted text>All other things being equal and constant,.
Is "warrat .. beging .. catsasstrophe" spanglish for 'rats are begging for war with cats?'
SpaceBlues

United States

#32585 Oct 4, 2012
Patriot AKA Bozo wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps this will expand and help to understand that that there are methods other than laboratory experiments.
http://www.experiment-resources.com/research-...
Nice. Hope we will cover more.

Btw, at the bottom, there's "Science Experiment" to click on. Would you believe Mitt's site shows up in the list?
Teddy R

San Francisco, CA

#32586 Oct 4, 2012
SpaceBlues wrote:
<quoted text>Nice.
Thanks.
np
Teddy R

San Francisco, CA

#32587 Oct 4, 2012
Patriot AKA Bozo wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps this will expand and help to understand that that there are methods other than laboratory experiments.
http://www.experiment-resources.com/research-...
Yes, correct.

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