How paying people's way out of povert...

How paying people's way out of poverty can help us all

There are 28 comments on the Globe and Mail story from May 6, 2011, titled How paying people's way out of poverty can help us all. In it, Globe and Mail reports that:

Behind corridors lined with contemporary Canadian art, sitting at a dark wooden table in his downtown Toronto office, Ed Clark offers some economic advice that might not typically come from Bay Street.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Globe and Mail.

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cat

Toronto, Canada

#1 May 7, 2011
cat

Cambridge, Canada

#2 May 9, 2011
people really dont want to be in a situation where they cant help themselves. it is in the society's best interest not to let them fall deeper into hunger thus finally losing the energy & acceptability to work. this way they become a permanent burden instead of becoming additional consumers of various products or clients of the different businesses in society's mainstream.
cat

Cambridge, Canada

#3 May 9, 2011
many of these unfortunate jobless are entrepreneurially inclined. they take on commission jobs to keep active, without any reasonable expectation of return. what does it take for society to support their efforts?
QUITTNER

Toronto, Canada

#4 May 9, 2011
10:54 am, Monday May 9, 2011:
RE: How paying people's way out of poverty can help us all
..... Poverty is caused by too much spending and/or by insufficient income, and the health of the economy depends on at least sufficient buying; only those buy most of the "stuff" who have a job.
There are many unemployed people willing to work who, despite trying hard, are unable to get accepted to fill one of the available jobs. Maybe they got the "wrong" background, or they are "chronically" going to be out of work for years for other reasons.
..... Then there is also the problem that far too much "stuff" is being bought here that has been produced in Asia because it is cheaper, causing local firms to have to reduce their local labour force. Producers, in theory, will all(?) soon have to relocate to Asia most of their operations because wage/salary rates are lower there, leaving only sales and marketing personnel in Canada. The number of available local jobs therefore is getting reduced too much. In theory, for maximum happiness there should always be a near-balance between the number of available jobs and the number of people fully qualified to do whatever is needed in those jobs. Maybe the education systems are turning out too many "wrong" people taking too many "wrong" courses?
paul shykora calgary

Calgary, Canada

#5 May 9, 2011
..POVERTY is Also ..a State-of Consciouness,....eh,....Self-M ade...
QUITTNER

Cambridge, Canada

#6 May 9, 2011
right you are...there is a certain amount of patronizing your own community's businesses that will ensure the vibrancy of your community's people.
here

Toronto, Canada

#7 May 9, 2011
UselessBeggars

Toronto, Canada

#8 May 10, 2011
Some of the unemployed are unfortunate, and some of them are useless morons with no work ethic.

If the government eliminated the minimum wage, more jobs would be available. The minimum wage is grossly unfair to employees, as it prevents people who are unemployed and willing to work for less than the minimum wage from working. It would only be fair if the government offered to pay the unemployed the equivalent of minimum wage, but EI is only 55% of average earnings.

If the government made it easier for companies to fire people, companies would be less afraid to take chances on hiring people. By reducing the penalties companies face for firing people, companies could drop dead weight and hire people who've had a taste of unemployment and are ready to work hard.

All of the morons who object to these ideas are either retarded socialists or lazy, unqualified imbeciles who deserve their jobs less than the unemployed.
May

Toronto, Canada

#9 May 10, 2011
guest

North York, Canada

#10 May 11, 2011
UselessBeggars wrote:
Some of the unemployed are unfortunate, and some of them are useless morons with no work ethic.
If the government eliminated the minimum wage, more jobs would be available. The minimum wage is grossly unfair to employees, as it prevents people who are unemployed and willing to work for less than the minimum wage from working. It would only be fair if the government offered to pay the unemployed the equivalent of minimum wage, but EI is only 55% of average earnings.
If the government made it easier for companies to fire people, companies would be less afraid to take chances on hiring people. By reducing the penalties companies face for firing people, companies could drop dead weight and hire people who've had a taste of unemployment and are ready to work hard.
All of the morons who object to these ideas are either retarded socialists or lazy, unqualified imbeciles who deserve their jobs less than the unemployed.
how can you suggest to get rid of minimum wage? So you want employers to be able to pay whatever they choose? So with your idea people can be working for a lot less and you think that's a good idea?
Ending Poverty

Walnut Grove, CA

#11 May 11, 2011
The way to end poverty is to give people money. It's simple!
UselessBeggars

Toronto, Canada

#12 May 11, 2011
guest wrote:
<quoted text> how can you suggest to get rid of minimum wage? So you want employers to be able to pay whatever they choose? So with your idea people can be working for a lot less and you think that's a good idea?
Employers can't "pay whatever they choose" if no one wants to work for that pay. The government can force a minimum wage, but it can't force employers to hire people. And the higher the minimum wage is, the less people companies will choose to keep on the payroll. So a minimum wage sounds like a good idea to someone who hasn't really thought about it much, but it's an enemy of the unemployed.
UselessBeggars

Toronto, Canada

#13 May 11, 2011
Ending Poverty wrote:
The way to end poverty is to give people money. It's simple!
Yes, give people money. It certainly worked for the Soviet Union!
guest

North York, Canada

#14 May 12, 2011
UselessBeggars wrote:
<quoted text>
Employers can't "pay whatever they choose" if no one wants to work for that pay. The government can force a minimum wage, but it can't force employers to hire people. And the higher the minimum wage is, the less people companies will choose to keep on the payroll. So a minimum wage sounds like a good idea to someone who hasn't really thought about it much, but it's an enemy of the unemployed.
I can admit that you seem to know what you're talking about so my question is let's say they do get rid of minimum wage- do the currently paid minimum wage employees keep their pay rate? For the new employees hired after minimum wage is elminated- is their pay going to be in line with the cost of living? That is really what I was wondering.
UselessBeggars

Canada

#15 May 14, 2011
you don't think that the system gives employers the upper hand as it is? wake up, employees have no say in anything. meanwhile the people on top are amassing all the money displaying no social conscience whatsoever. this is why the "economy" failed. it's just plain thievery.

Since: May 11

Calgary

#16 May 14, 2011
UselessBeggars,
are you an employer or an employee?
paul shykora arts

Calgary, Canada

#18 May 14, 2011
QUITTNER wrote:
right you are...there is a certain amount of patronizing your own community's businesses that will ensure the vibrancy of your community's people.
...YES.....WE ALSO ''MAKE-IT'' dHat Way,tooo....eh...
steve

Acworth, GA

#19 May 14, 2011
UselessBeggars wrote:
Some of the unemployed are unfortunate, and some of them are useless morons with no work ethic.
If the government eliminated the minimum wage, more jobs would be available. The minimum wage is grossly unfair to employees, as it prevents people who are unemployed and willing to work for less than the minimum wage from working. It would only be fair if the government offered to pay the unemployed the equivalent of minimum wage, but EI is only 55% of average earnings.
If the government made it easier for companies to fire people, companies would be less afraid to take chances on hiring people. By reducing the penalties companies face for firing people, companies could drop dead weight and hire people who've had a taste of unemployment and are ready to work hard.
such a system can only work if there is no subsidies of any kind in the rest of the economy, no political favors, no banks too big to fail ,ect.
All of the morons who object to these ideas are either retarded socialists or lazy, unqualified imbeciles who deserve their jobs less than the unemployed.
such a system can only work if there is no subsidies of any kind in the rest of the economy, no bands too big to fail, no political favors, price supports of any kind. your idea could work if prices would be allowed to fall. otherwise if your making like one dollar an hour and other prices are still politically favored, is a recipe for abject poverty as well as starvation.
Empty Grocery Shelves

Toronto, Canada

#20 May 14, 2011
Today's Urban Preparedness Message from Survival Joe...

On the first of May 2010 a water pipe ruptured 15 miles west of Boston.

Within hours all retail stores were sold out of bottled water.

"Don't bother going to the supermarket," said one women to ABC News.

"It's crazy. It's like a big brawl. Don't go."

The only way Boston got through those thirsty days was because the National Guard stepped in.

The National Inflation Association released a short documentary called "Empty Store Shelves Coming to America."

It shows how the ruptured water line in Boston was only a sneak preview of what will hit the nation when the economy crashes.

When hyperinflation hits, the NIA believes the government will issue price controls causing
major food shortages.

You can view the video here: http://survivaljoe.net/blog...
UselessBeggars

Toronto, Canada

#21 May 15, 2011
guest wrote:
<quoted text>I can admit that you seem to know what you're talking about so my question is let's say they do get rid of minimum wage- do the currently paid minimum wage employees keep their pay rate? For the new employees hired after minimum wage is elminated- is their pay going to be in line with the cost of living? That is really what I was wondering.
This is an example of a two-tier system. The employed are guaranteed a minimum wage, while without it they might be earning less. The unemployed have no employment and are not guaranteed a minimum wage, while if there were no minimum wage they would have more opportunities for employment and could have a higher income.

The proponents of the minimum wage posture as being anti-corporate, but the policy they support is actually anti-poor.

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