Suburban rally seeks to derail train plan

[midwest rail]

No more freight trains wrote:

Your correct, yet I think in the end the 'will' will find a way.
The energy issues we face are really pushing the politicians this time.
I watch congress a whole lot and although they are fighting overtly, behind all the rhetoric, it actually appears they are getting things done. We never get to see when they actually talk to each other.

Agreed, the media only show us the infighting, sniping and such - looks better in a made-for-TV soundbite. My main concern remains the way Amtrak is managed - poor leadership, woeful misspending, lack of morale from the top down, and this legislation imposes no oversight on these monies. That, to me, should worry ALL taxpayers, but especially those in favor of increased passenger rail use.

[Train Wreck]

As has been mentioned before, the price CN is proposing to pay for the EJ&E will seem like a drop in the bucket compared to what Illinois taxpayers will have to fork over for CN's PRIVATE MONOPOLISTIC Chicago bypass.

http://www.ble.org/pr/news/headline.asp...

[Train Wreck]

Look, CN is screwing Canadian ports through the Rupester:

"Whether the rail change creates greater efficiency remains to be seen, but there is uneasiness in Halifax over the role CN is playing in the new Prince Rupert container terminal in British Columbia. The concern here is that the railway may be focused on building up traffic at the West Coast port at the expense of its East Coast business.

One critic told me recently that CN can make more money hauling cargo to Central Canada from Prince Rupert than it does bringing containers from the East Coast to the same destination. Therefore, he argues, it is only natural the railway would be tempted to encourage more West Coast business."

http://www.ble.org/pr/news/headline.asp...

[No more freight trains]

Well sure, but, people moving has to be better than freight in the case of the J.
But like most things that the government runs, it seems wrought with corruption. How all the graft goes on year after year, ie:Illinois, I'll not ever understand.
If we could actually see the funding in it's entirety get to the projects, this country would look like the Land of Oz.
Each new admin. goes right in and does what the last got thrown out for. It isn't for a term or two. It is for the life of the office. Look at Daley, Rostenkowski, Ryan, Blaogovich, Stoger, Obama, Clinton, all involved in graft. Rezko is right at the center of the Obama, Clinton, Blagovich involvement.
Shameless. And now one puts the pinch on em. If I ran my company that way the feds would be in here in a New York minute.
Shameless.

[railham]

The Deal Stopper wrote:

<quoted text>
railham-still on CN's payroll I see.
How's Hunter? You know this deal is looking iffy for ya. Lots of hurdles. Ask the H man if he is backing out after the Roskum legislation passes or is he going to waste money on lawyers. Either way this could take some time. Aye?

As far as I know, HH is fine. As far as the deal taking time, it will be all wrapped up by November with some signaling work being done before the snow flies.

[Ratchet]

The Doc wrote:

Let's figure this one out. The railroad was there before the people moved in. Not all railroads are abandoned. In fact, with the high price of fuel, we will need railroads more.
So people protest when the tracks will be used? After they move in?
That's like going out into a field of cows, stepping in cow #@&! and then saying it was the cow's fault that you were walking around in the field.
Dumb.

LOL........agreed

[Gunnar]

Ratchet wrote:

<quoted text>
LOL........agreed

Your moodahr vears lederhosen, dummkopf.

[Train Wreck]

Hey wait a minute here. Just caught something on the press wire.

"CN is consistently delivering fifth morning availability of containers in Chicago and sixth morning availability in Memphis, a leading U.S. distribution hub."

CN SAID IT TOOK A DAY (24 HRS) TO CLEAR CHICAGO! What, they get from Chicago to Memphis in half an hour???

Further...

"James M. Foote, CN's executive vice-president, Sales and Marketing, said:'The CKYH alliance second weekly vessel is testament to the logistics value of the CN-Port of Prince Rupert-Maher Terminals service offering to the international shipping community. Together, we have created a new, highly competitive gateway for goods entering North America and transiting CN's network to the U.S. Midwest and Central Canada.'"

Full story:

http://biz.yahoo.com/iw/080709/0414369.html

WHAT THE HECK HAPPENED TO THE CN WHINING ABOUT DELIVERIES IF THEY'RE 'CONSISTENTLY' MAKING IT FROM CHICAGO TO MEMPHIS IN A DAY??????

[No CN RR]

Train Wreck wrote:

Hey wait a minute here. Just caught something on the press wire.
"CN is consistently delivering fifth morning availability of containers in Chicago and sixth morning availability in Memphis, a leading U.S. distribution hub."
CN SAID IT TOOK A DAY (24 HRS) TO CLEAR CHICAGO! What, they get from Chicago to Memphis in half an hour???
Further...
"James M. Foote, CN's executive vice-president, Sales and Marketing, said:'The CKYH alliance second weekly vessel is testament to the logistics value of the CN-Port of Prince Rupert-Maher Terminals service offering to the international shipping community. Together, we have created a new, highly competitive gateway for goods entering North America and transiting CN's network to the U.S. Midwest and Central Canada.'"
Full story:
http://biz.yahoo.com/iw/080709/0414369.html
WHAT THE HECK HAPPENED TO THE CN WHINING ABOUT DELIVERIES IF THEY'RE 'CONSISTENTLY' MAKING IT FROM CHICAGO TO MEMPHIS IN A DAY??????

More outright deception from CN. No mention of a bottleneck slowing service????

[Train Wreck]

Directly from CN's web site:

"Snail’s pace travel: It can take a freight train more than 24 hours to travel the 30 miles from Chicago’s north side to its south side. During that same time period, a CN freight train can travel from Chicago to Winnipeg in Western Canada (approx. 860 miles)"

Notice the two key word, "It CAN." Sure if you park the train on a siding for 22 hours, then proceed. You know, it CAN take me 24 hours to get to Chicago from Huntley (if I walk).

[midwest rail]

Train Wreck wrote:

Directly from CN's web site:
"Snail’s pace travel: It can take a freight train more than 24 hours to travel the 30 miles from Chicago’s north side to its south side. During that same time period, a CN freight train can travel from Chicago to Winnipeg in Western Canada (approx. 860 miles)"
Notice the two key word, "It CAN." Sure if you park the train on a siding for 22 hours, then proceed. You know, it CAN take me 24 hours to get to Chicago from Huntley (if I walk).

Not only CAN it take a freight train that long, it usually does take that long. Traffic in and out of the yards, connection tracks, etc, are often gridlocked worse than the Dan Ryan on a holiday Friday afternoon. This mess is real, and common knowlege.

[Train Wreck]

midwest rail wrote:

<quoted text>
Not only CAN it take a freight train that long, it usually does take that long. Traffic in and out of the yards, connection tracks, etc, are often gridlocked worse than the Dan Ryan on a holiday Friday afternoon. This mess is real, and common knowlege.

So how do you explain this statement referenced in my earlier post regarding delivery times from Port of Prince Rupert???

"CN is consistently delivering fifth morning availability of containers in Chicago and sixth morning availability in Memphis, a leading U.S. distribution hub."

[midwest rail]

Train Wreck wrote:

<quoted text>
So how do you explain this statement referenced in my earlier post regarding delivery times from Port of Prince Rupert???
"CN is consistently delivering fifth morning availability of containers in Chicago and sixth morning availability in Memphis, a leading U.S. distribution hub."

I'd have to know where the quote originated - if it came from their website or from a press release, then of course it will be optimistic. Every business does that, not just CN. I know you guys have concerns, and are looking for any deception on their part, but in this instance i just dont see it - the gridlock is real, i experience it every day i go to work.

[No Liberal]

I've gone back and re-read several articles as well as what little there is about CREATE. First of all, if we penalized a foreign company (in this case CN) for "doing business" here, there would be no Honda and Toyota assembly plants (not the same as GM and Ford but they employ 1000's) just for obvious starters. There would be no Budweiser now. And 1000's of other foreign owned companies either based here or set up here in U.S. operations.

I am convinced CREATE can't happen as outlined. It will never get the funding, I am not clear on how it will alleviate rail congestion, and it leaves open the jobs issue as well. So let's talk about that. No one knows what jobs will be created by either proposal, where they would be, or how many.

The STAR line, which I would support entirely, I still see as a wet dream that has never materialized due to political dicking around and, again, no funding. Add an overtaxed Metra and lack of rolling stock and other equipment and there you have it. Just my opinion.

What I see that makes the most sense, and there were articles on the RR website to that effect, is working to a compromise. By that I mean forcing the CN to limit the number of trains. Or limiting train length or type of trains. Work to get CN to pay more toward crossing safety and sound issues.... things like that. If this is THAT important to CN, I can't see them using a take it or leave it approach. And remember, the ramifications of this affect me too.

[Train Wreck]

midwest rail wrote:

<quoted text>
I'd have to know where the quote originated - if it came from their website or from a press release, then of course it will be optimistic. Every business does that, not just CN. I know you guys have concerns, and are looking for any deception on their part, but in this instance i just dont see it - the gridlock is real, i experience it every day i go to work.

MR - I am MORE than familiar with the disclaimers at the end of PR's that warn of, "Forward looking statements," but Foote is quoted as the situation is present day fact. He uses the word CONSISTENTLY.

You can find the link to the PR on the post I made earlier,#472. If Foote is lying about the present day situation relating to deliveries, then it goes without saying that the assumption is all CN management should be suspect.

[Train Wreck]

No Liberal wrote:

I've gone back and re-read several articles as well as what little there is about CREATE. First of all, if we penalized a foreign company (in this case CN) for "doing business" here, there would be no Honda and Toyota assembly plants (not the same as GM and Ford but they employ 1000's) just for obvious starters. There would be no Budweiser now. And 1000's of other foreign owned companies either based here or set up here in U.S. operations.
I am convinced CREATE can't happen as outlined. It will never get the funding, I am not clear on how it will alleviate rail congestion, and it leaves open the jobs issue as well. So let's talk about that. No one knows what jobs will be created by either proposal, where they would be, or how many.
The STAR line, which I would support entirely, I still see as a wet dream that has never materialized due to political dicking around and, again, no funding. Add an overtaxed Metra and lack of rolling stock and other equipment and there you have it. Just my opinion.
What I see that makes the most sense, and there were articles on the RR website to that effect, is working to a compromise. By that I mean forcing the CN to limit the number of trains. Or limiting train length or type of trains. Work to get CN to pay more toward crossing safety and sound issues.... things like that. If this is THAT important to CN, I can't see them using a take it or leave it approach. And remember, the ramifications of this affect me too.

OK, I appreciate the time you took to review the articles, and you knew I would have a rebuttal.

Honda of America, Toyota, BMW, Isuzu and Mercedes-Benz CREATED tens of thousands of taxpaying jobs in the US. They also created thousands more jobs from local suppliers.

I have enjoyed a three decade business relationship with Honda of America. At their Marysville, OH assembly plant I've seen cold rolled steel at the start for the bodies to the test fire of the engine at the end of the line. I've seen it four times now. Honda of America has over 300 suppliers within a 100 mile radius in OH and IN that make anything from brakes to car seats.

My team and I were responsible for creating the standardized maintenance training program for all mentioned (and I don't mean janitors - I mean the professional technicians that keep the lines running). The Technician training program was so good that the Japanese management came over to take notes, but enough of that.

What US taxpaying jobs is CN proposing to create? Matter of fact, I would think they can eliminate jobs in the Chicago area through this transaction due to lack of need for engineers and support staff.

If you didn't read it before (post #466), Plainfield estimates $300 million for improvements as a result of the trains - http://www.ble.org/pr/news/headline.asp... . That's a dollar for every man, woman and child in the United states right now. Sure that means CN would create jobs, but they're not paying for it, damn it! AND, Plainfield is only one of 34 communities.

Finally, I suppose when more freight is handled through Port of Prince Rupert, longshoremen, engineers and support people can emigrate to Canada for jobs they've been trained for. That's just more 'service oriented' jobs leaving our country like customer service at United Airlines, Dell Computer, Microsoft, H&R Block, etc.

Thanks for your time if you took it to read this rant.

[No Liberal]

Oh Hell... I NEVER miss a good rant and enjoy laying them down myself. Since I'm connected with GM, we don't want to go there with Honda and Toyota though there's no doubt they have created a good deal of American jobs. You will never convince me they are more than assemblers, but anyway. But they use American trucking firms, railroads, and so on. And still there's no doubt that when someone buys a Honda or Toyota (or other imported product), the PROFIT goes back to the country or origin. But we insisted that if they were going to see here they had to "build" here.... careful of what you wish for I guess.

I don't know what jobs CN would create. I wish I did and I wish they would offer more detail. Conversely, I wish CREATE would as well.

I am not sympathetic to longshoremen. I think the unions have outlived their usefulness in this country and won't go there.'Nuff said. That's a different forum unless you want to continue it here.

Will read the article in the link.

What are a few of the things Honda and Toyota looked for when opening plants? BMW? MB of America? Hey... How about Ford's Torrence Avenue plant? Tick... Tick.... Tick....(sorry). Access to RAIL and Interstate highways. Ya gotta have rail.

I believe in compromise. You see it every time a big box store tries to open. Small scale? Sure. But the principle is the same.

[No Liberal]

"Canadian National officials have said instead of blaming their company for potential traffic gridlock, local officials should focus on solving their transportation problems."

Well... there IS a ring of truth here in a statement like this, after all. Anyone tried to drive east-west in Lake County lately?

[Train Wreck]

BTW, I couldn't help but notice that NO ONE in favor of the CN purchase has posted to the article regarding the Aurora, Plainfield and Naperville rally scheduled for this Wednesday:

http://www.topix.net/forum/source/chicago-tri...

Ken, Mowog, midwest rails, and Mike, does this indicate you're Gordy-Whipped? In other words, was my initial supposition correct when I assumed Gordy said hands off, too close to home?

Heck, you've all jumped on every other article and Topix board related to the EJ&E, haven't you? Boy, I'd hate to be in your 'positions' and I'll leave it with that (no ankle grabbing saying, "Thank you sir may I have another").

[railham]

No Liberal wrote:

Oh Hell... I NEVER miss a good rant and enjoy laying them down myself. Since I'm connected with GM, we don't want to go there with Honda and Toyota though there's no doubt they have created a good deal of American jobs. You will never convince me they are more than assemblers, but anyway. But they use American trucking firms, railroads, and so on. And still there's no doubt that when someone buys a Honda or Toyota (or other imported product), the PROFIT goes back to the country or origin. But we insisted that if they were going to see here they had to "build" here.... careful of what you wish for I guess.
I don't know what jobs CN would create. I wish I did and I wish they would offer more detail. Conversely, I wish CREATE would as well.
I am not sympathetic to longshoremen. I think the unions have outlived their usefulness in this country and won't go there.'Nuff said. That's a different forum unless you want to continue it here.
Will read the article in the link.
What are a few of the things Honda and Toyota looked for when opening plants? BMW? MB of America? Hey... How about Ford's Torrence Avenue plant? Tick... Tick.... Tick....(sorry). Access to RAIL and Interstate highways. Ya gotta have rail.
I believe in compromise. You see it every time a big box store tries to open. Small scale? Sure. But the principle is the same.

Create is dead unless funding can be found somewhere, and with the current state of the economy I don't for see that happening anytime soon.
As far as Honda, Toyota, GM, Ford, and CN go, they are all publicly traded companies (NYSE) and have thousands of shareholders in the USA who share in the profit (or losses) of being a part owner of the company. Some are headquartered overseas, and some are bases in this country. The fact is, all business is an international affair these days and the majority of these companies and thousands of others that do business here depend on trade for a good portion of their profits. Their profits belong to the shareholders who are rewarded for investing their capital in the business, regardless of where they live.
The state of Illinois had years to develop the Star line, and never made an offer to USS for the EJ&E, if they really want it badly, they should come up with the cash to top the CN offer. If not, withdraw and not interfere with private enterprise.
As far as a group of homeowners attempting to subvert private property rights by telling a corporation that they cannot use their property in the manner that it was intended to be used is wrong and will never hold up to legal scrutiny. This whole exercise by these various groups that wish this to just go away is an exercise in futility, but thank goodness that they still have the right to protest.