4 firms hired to plan levee project

[DupoFan2]

There you go again leveewaste. I take back that apology. You are stupid. We haven't neglected responsibilities. Our pumps are currently operating just fine. I own 30 out of tens of thousands of acres here. The other members just own their homes. It has nothing to do with taxing ourselves. Another one of your stupid accusations. No one forced the biggest companies to locate in the bottoms. They came here because of location and the levees that were built and guanteed by the Federal Government. Like I said several times before, you refuse to deal with facts. Only lies, innuendo and false accusations of our intent. That is why your little organisation will go nowhere.

Hi Krissy. All I can say is just go back to the whole conversation between myself and leveewaste. You can draw a conclusion from there.

[Krissy]

DupoFan2 wrote:

There you go again leveewaste. I take back that apology. You are stupid. We haven't neglected responsibilities. Our pumps are currently operating just fine. I own 30 out of tens of thousands of acres here. The other members just own their homes. It has nothing to do with taxing ourselves. Another one of your stupid accusations. No one forced the biggest companies to locate in the bottoms. They came here because of location and the levees that were built and guanteed by the Federal Government. Like I said several times before, you refuse to deal with facts. Only lies, innuendo and false accusations of our intent. That is why your little organisation will go nowhere.
Hi Krissy. All I can say is just go back to the whole conversation between myself and leveewaste. You can draw a conclusion from there.

Hi DF2, just didn't see how private peeps can "profit" other than no flooding. There's always someone to "knock" someone else trying to do some good.

[www_leveewaste_c om]

Krissy, I'm fine with people helping other people. But don't take my money, my children's money and my grandchildren's money to do it. Sure it's great that people serve on the levee district and protect the land, homes and businesses behind the levees. But he's not helping me or many of the 300 million people whose money he is taking.

DupoFan2, I quoted you and the East West Gateway reports concerning the pumps. They should have been replaced and were not. Whose responsibility was that? It was and is your responsibility. You failed to do it. Now you expect the federal government to give you money to fix the levees.

[wondering]

Levee waste you are from Indiana? What area so we know what kind of projects we are paying for there?

[easy now]

Not too much from our robot tonight (levee_waste)

So I think I'll get a good night sleep here below a significant river elevation. Like I have done hundreds of times before. Today is a good day to remember stuff like this.

[www_leveewaste_c om]

DupoFan2, honest question here. What kind of work did you have to do during the flood of 1993? If the levees were holding and the pumps were working, what was there to do on the Prairie Dupont or Fish Lake levees. I know that Alton was flooded and the Wood River Levee had sand boils that required sandbagging. What kind of work were you doing on the two levees to the south?

[wondering]

Levee waste should come clean and tell everyone where and who they are. I would suggest everyone quit responding to them until that happens. For all you know you could be arguing with your neighbor, this person is targeting Columbia not the rest of the towns protected by levees in the metro area. If they lived in Indiana they would have just said where by now.

Hiding really doesn't help their cause, and arguing with an unknown is not worth any of the time you guys are putting into it.

[Country Boy]

Leveewaste,even if Dupo Fan 2 would tell you what he was doing on those levees during the flood of 93, you are still too stupid to understand it anyways. He has repeatedly debated this subject over and over with you,but nothing can get past your thick skull. Give it up.You lose.Dupo Fan 2 is way more knowledgeable than you will ever be.

[Krissy]

wondering wrote:

Levee waste should come clean and tell everyone where and who they are. I would suggest everyone quit responding to them until that happens. For all you know you could be arguing with your neighbor, this person is targeting Columbia not the rest of the towns protected by levees in the metro area. If they lived in Indiana they would have just said where by now.
Hiding really doesn't help their cause, and arguing with an unknown is not worth any of the time you guys are putting into it.

sounds smart to me.

money to keep the levees from flooding our homes and businesses isn't worth it??? huh?? maybe we could block their runoff water and keep it in their neighborhood and see what's not important.

[Krissy]

www_leveewaste_com wrote:

Krissy, I'm fine with people helping other people. But don't take my money, my children's money and my grandchildren's money to do it. Sure it's great that people serve on the levee district and protect the land, homes and businesses behind the levees. But he's not helping me or many of the 300 million people whose money he is taking.
DupoFan2, I quoted you and the East West Gateway reports concerning the pumps. They should have been replaced and were not. Whose responsibility was that? It was and is your responsibility. You failed to do it. Now you expect the federal government to give you money to fix the levees.

Your runoff water comes to us. We maintain it. How is that not benefitting you, your kids, your grandkids?

[Levi Ottwell]

I asked leveewaste to say who they were in another discussion and that went no where. Their website says they are a group of people, with no one person, let alone a whole group coming forward I find that suspect.

If you want to fight for a cause I support that but you have to be willing to stand up for that cause and show your face to give that cause some credibility.

[www_leveewaste_c om]

Wondering, I'm working on similar projects in two areas up the river. It's not just Columbia, not even just Metro East.

Country boy, DupoFan2 should be more knowledgeable about the levees than I. I never claimed otherwise. My point is that from the looks of things, this is a local project that should be handled with local dollars. Nobody has convinced me otherwise. Frankly, few people have really tried. So much of the argument seems to concentrate on how stupid I am about levees.

I said long ago that my arguments rely on logic, not who I am or who else agrees with me. I don't think my name or background or political leanings mean a thing when I'm asking people to convince me that our federal money should go to a local project like this. Using personal information is what's wrong with so many discussions in our country today. We dismiss people or support people because of what they've said in the past. Too often we don't even listen to what they are saying now to decide if it makes sense or not. "He's a Democrat, therefore, I agree. I voted for him, so I'm on board with whatever he's saying." That's a cop out. Use your brain and decide if the content is sensible.

Krissy, you may have missed my point earlier. I have no beef with the levees, canals, levee boards, drainage ditches, local politicians, Corps of Engineers or FEMA. Do what you want with your levees. Just don't use federal money for it.

[realistic]

i have just sat back and watched this argument because as a person living in columbia, i feel that my opinion is going to be biased in favor of levees.
i do now realise that the argument is actually about who pays for repairing them. i know it will result in a verbal lynching, but i have to agree with the idea it is a local cost.
a few years ago i gave my sister a free car. it now needs shocks. why should i pay for them? just because i gave her a free car does not obligate me to pay for maintainance. we got free levees a while back, we should say thank you and pay for the maintainance.

[www_leveewaste_c om]

Realistic, that's exaclty my argument. The levees are local projects.

Throughout this discussion, DupoFan2 has claimed that federal money should be used because the federal government created this problem. He says that the feds changed the way they determine the strength of the levees. That’s true. DupoFan2 says that the measuring stick really should be that the levees did what they were expected to do in 1993. That’s not true.

According to the Illinois Department of Natural Resources (http://dnr.state.il.us/owr/Reports/FloodStage... ), four of the five levees in Metro East had significant trouble containing the 1993 flood. The Wood River levee was overtopped. The Metro East levee had underseepage problems and trouble dealing with local runoff. In the Fish Lake levee district, seepage and sandboils were controlled by sand bags.

Finally, the Prairie DuPont Levee. According to this report, that levee district had serious problems with seepage and sand boils.“The worst sand boil caused by the seepage was nearly 1,000 feet from the levee and required 15,000 sandbags to control. Two additional pumps were brought in to assist the pumping station in controlling the stages inside the district. About 12 residences and 1 business sustained damage within the district.”

This is DupoFan2’s levee. He has been on the board there for some time and claims that the levees do not deserve to be decertified. I applaud him and others who worked the sandbags and spent hours protecting property, but let’s not ignore the obvious. These levees did not do the job. They needed significant help for days, weeks and months.

FEMA’s big change in measuring the levees for certification is if they need sandbags and other outside assistance to survive a flood. That makes sense to me. Can property owners rely on volunteers, endless availability of sand, luck to spot every sand boil, cooperation from all land-owners, and FEMA’s help to prevent their property from flooding. Maybe. For the most part that combination came together in 1993 near Columbia. However, that mixture failed in so many other areas nearby in 1993 and may fail in the future. Maybe isn’t good enough. These levees need to be fixed or people need to be made aware of the risks so they can take action. DupoFan2 says that the levees don't need to be fixed.

I applaud FEMA in determining that the levees are not adequate. They seem to be concerned about protecting people. I’m not sure what DupoFan2 is protecting.

[Krissy]

I've heard DF2 say we already have $180 million for us to put into the levee. We can get it certified to the 100yr mark which should keep us from being forced into flood ins. From there the Corps could bring it up to the 500yr mark. Why not allow us to do this?? If we can keep it from costing $750 mil., like they're saying it will if it's left up to them, then, why stop us from doing it?? The corps are stopping us from going further because they're behind on their engineering. This is what I've gotten from the public meeting. Too many higher up hands in the cookie jar??

[www_leveewaste_c om]

Krissy: why should the corps--federal money--be used to do anything with these levees? I'm fine with local dollars going to the levees. I'm not arguing how much it should cost or what level--100 or 500--the work should go to. They are your levees, therefore a local project. Let local money pay for whatever you want to do with the levees. If you decide not to do anything, though, the Corps should not continue to tell people that they are protected to a greater level than they really are. That will lead to flooding disaster with lives lost and a federal response to save people and property.

[DupoFan2]

The Wood River Levee overtopped?. More lies and mis-information. Don't you get tired of being wrong leveewaste?. As far as what we did during the flood of 93, we did our job. Hundreds of hours protecting the system. The pumps that you are so wrong about have to be greased every 4 hrs. Statistics recorded, debris removed from the grates. One employee took the 8 to 4 shift. the other the 4 to 12 shift. Me and Mike Sullivan shared the 12 to 8 shift. We were in charge of security. Mayor Herb Simmons was an enormous help there. Sand bag operations, closures were all directed by us.The decision to evacuate, or not, was our call. Do you have any idea of that kind of responsibility...obviously not. Like I said, the dedicatiuon that we have to these levees are something that you will never be able to comprehend in your life leveewaste, and you definetely anger me with your stupid accusations of alterior motives and poor maintenance. All levees have underseepage issues. Thats how they work. Again, my only reply is to address another one of your lying comments. The Wood river Levee definetely did not overtop. Where in the hell do you get your info. No one can be that wrong on purpose.

No verbal lynching 'realistic'. I can accept your opinion. Just remember though, it was the City of Columbia talking the Prairie Dupont Levee and the C.O.E. into extending the levee south to give the Columbia Bottoms the same industrial levee. If not for that, our situation would be much simpler. Our system also takes all of the storm water from Columbia developements, which overpower our system and flood people down here. I can respect your reasoning though. Leveewaste has chosen to make it personal with his innacurate accusations, lies, and plain insults on the excellent job that we, and those before us, have done on this Levee System. We need the Federal Levee to be upgraded. If the Federal Government can't afford it, who can? I know we can't. FEMA and leveewaste want us to abandon our homes and properties and move out of the valley. All those people and businesses. Are you ready for that?. Thanks for your view though. We realise it's a tough sell for us.

[DupoFan2]

Another wrong assumption leveewaste. The boil that you refer to was found by me and mike on one of the helicpter flights that we were able to get. The ten thousand sand bags that you refer to were not used to address that boil alone. We decided to build a sandbag damn to address and stabalise that whole area. Problem was solved. Maybe I'll tell you about why those flights originated, But I'm sure that you would just ignore that too. What two pumps are you referring to?. We had to bring in a huge generator to feed the Palmer Creek pump station when the Transmission lines where negated by the overtopping of the Columbia system. There were no additional pumps there. Just a note leveewaste, that agricultural system designed to hold a 48 ft river held a 49.7 river stage before it simply overtopped. I know that. I was there. Another one of your lies is quoting me as saying that these levees don't need fixing. I've always stressed that these levees need upgrading. You pride yourself in saying that your arguements rely on logic. I've probably pointed out at least a dozen or more major errors by you in your so called logic. Very flawed in my opinion. You never admit your mistakes, which are many. Maybe you should think that your sources may not be as accurate as the information provided by one that was there. Wood River overtopped?....just plain stupid logic.

[DupoFan2]

The Fish Lake Levee had only two small boils in their entire system. Underseepage was normal and controlled. The Praireie Dupont system had some boils, and normal underseepage for the length of the flood event. According to the C.O.E., a normal flood event is a week to 10 days. In 93 it was 5 months. About 12 residences and 1 business?.Real good statistic there leveewaste. If you keep on reading those government reports, they will have you believing that this levee will become a socialist movement soon.lol. Those reports are generated by the very people that want to profit from the repairs. What do you expect them to report. You obviously just believe anything that you read as long as it serves your purpose. I could sit here all night and pick out your errors leveewaste,but I just don't have that kind of time.FEMA changed their ways of decertification based on sandbags and outside help?. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds. FEMA is an organisation that was decimated by the Bush administration. Bush gave top positions to those that financially supported his campaign that had no experience. The result was the debacle of Katrina. You go ahead and support that innept agency leveewaste, as for me, I'll will depend on what I personally experience,in person. I will protect those that elected me. Not FEMA. They are extortionists in my opinion. Look it up. An abuse of authority. As far you're logic?, just keep believing everything you read. I'll just keep making you look ridiculous in your so called logic. After all, I was there, and continue to be there. Meeting after meeting.

[DupoFan2]

The Corps are military thinkers leveewaste. During the flood of 93, they sent botanists to our levees to advise us. They knew very little. In the saving of the Prairie Durocher levee system, the Corps were absolutely wrong. When the Columbia system overtopped, the next two systems failed at the flank levees by the soutward surge. The commissioners of the Prairie Durocher levee system decided to cut their levee at the river to relieve the surge at the flank levee. The Corp used all kinds of threats to prevent that. That levee system cut the levee. It proved to save the system and its citizens. The Corps had major egg on their face. They don't like to discuss it. We have found the Corp to be very innept, along with FEMA in their assessments. I think you will find that out when the lawsuits are filed based on their own mistakes and assessments.