Oxnard student declared brain dead, 15-year-old Gay Teen Murdered in Class

[guido el mala]

BUCK wrote:

<quoted text> The motives you refer to are a moot point. Any act of premeditated murder is a hate crime, to treat it in a way, because of this or that, makes it more, or less, legitimate is absurd,and demeaning to the victims, and society.

wrong.
the motives are not moot. look at every type of muder case put on the books... the motives are paramount to the cases.
you're also trying to change the conversation into one about hate crimes. that is irrelevant here as i'm not talking about the legality of hate crime law... i'm simply pointing out that saying in one post that heterosexual kids are killed as a comparison to the crime being discussed here is simply false.

motives are paramount in any murder case and do not insult the victims or our society in any way. to say that motives are a moot point in a murder case is simply untrue.

have a nice day,
t.

[The Golem]

Hesed wrote:

I'm sure he's committed sins against God, just as we all have.
We all will be judged for our sins.
Again, I hope he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator.

Then certainly you must have enough "sins" of your own to keep yourself occupied, instead of fantasising about a 15 year old gay or trans kid.

[Single gay man-x]

My mate and I were reading this story and we wee talking about how no matter what his reason for beating up this boy. He needs to be punished according to the crime. If the boy who was beaten dies...then murder is murder...

Of course on a twisted side...drop his @$$ in a cell with a pedophile for 72 hours...I think he'd learn a lot about how not to treat someone. And before you all jump me for being a horrible person...his parents should bear some of the blame. Children learn what they are taught.

I'm sure I'll be flamed so lets have it.

[Hesed]

The Golem wrote:

<quoted text>
Then certainly you must have enough "sins" of your own to keep yourself occupied, instead of fantasising about a 15 year old gay or trans kid.

As I said before.
Hopefully he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator before he died.
If not, he will receive justice for his sins.

[ACLU-Tom]

All I see in your post is a slightly less offensive Fred Phelps. You are in no position to judge this victim or comment on his "sins".

Hesed wrote:

I'm sure he's committed sins against God, just as we all have.
We all will be judged for our sins.
Again, I hope he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator.

[Hesed]

ACLU-Tom wrote:

All I see in your post is a slightly less offensive Fred Phelps. You are in no position to judge this victim or comment on his "sins".
<quoted text>

I don't judge him. It's a fact, as with all, that we have sinned and come short of the Glory of God.
The wages of sin is death. Eternal.
I hope he made peace with his Creator and repented of his sins, so that he will receive a reward not a just punishment for his choices.

[willi silver]

Hesed wrote:

I'm sure he's committed sins against God, just as we all have.
We all will be judged for our sins.
Again, I hope he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator.

and if she doesnt believe in your mythological belief system, she might not have done anything wrong and has no need to go thru the machinations you describe...

[ACLU-Tom]

In your belief system, not everybody shares your personally chosen beliefs.

Again, you are in no position to say that this young man was a sinner or to comment on rewards or punishment.

Hesed wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't judge him. It's a fact, as with all, that we have sinned and come short of the Glory of God.
The wages of sin is death. Eternal.
I hope he made peace with his Creator and repented of his sins, so that he will receive a reward not a just punishment for his choices.

[The Golem]

ACLU-Tom wrote:

In your belief system, not everybody shares your personally chosen beliefs.
Again, you are in no position to say that this young man was a sinner or to comment on rewards or punishment.
<quoted text>

Hesed needs to sniff out the sins of others like one dog with another's butt.

[Hesed]

willi silver wrote:

<quoted text>
and if she doesnt believe in your mythological belief system, she might not have done anything wrong and has no need to go thru the machinations you describe...

Belief in the truth or not doesn't change the facts.

It'll all be clear in the end.

[Hesed]

ACLU-Tom wrote:

In your belief system, not everybody shares your personally chosen beliefs.
Again, you are in no position to say that this young man was a sinner or to comment on rewards or punishment.
<quoted text>

Sorry, just repeating the clear teachings of the Bible.

It was offensive in Jesus' day, it's still offensive now.

Glad to oblige.

[MichelleMC]

This is very sad this happened to the young boy. He had a right to live and live happily just as the other students did.
I will pray for rest for his soul, consolation for his family and friends, and the conversion of the one who shot him.

[The Golem]

Hesed wrote:

<quoted text>
As I said before.
Hopefully he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator before he died.
If not, he will receive justice for his sins.

Hesed proclaiming the need for justice. Clearly you do not know what you are talking about. Hesed is on the opposite end of the scale from strict justice.

You are right though. It would help if you understood the meaning of Hebrew words in context.

[jusdivinum]

Hesed wrote:

I'm sure he's committed sins against God, just as we all have.
We all will be judged for our sins.
Again, I hope he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator.

Before you can search the truth you must be interested in finding it! the exploration of various half-A$$ answers that you are attempting to give, sorting out which one of your clumsy statements might be closer to right,trying to find ways to convince those that disagree, can be left aside at the moment. If you have a heart, this was a terrible crime committed in a classroom. Since you are so God fearing, what does it take for your eyes to see or your ears to hear? You are blinded by mutually reinforcing patterns of private and Christio collective rebellions in your minds eye that are unable to see the truth. How dare you make those type of comments! Your type of religion is caught in a downward spiral corrupting, misdirecting, and is preparing a way for failure. Yes intellectual failure reinforcing the misdirection of your small mind and corrupt will.

[Hesed]

jusdivinum wrote:

<quoted text>
Before you can search the truth you must be interested in finding it! the exploration of various half-A$$ answers that you are attempting to give, sorting out which one of your clumsy statements might be closer to right,trying to find ways to convince those that disagree, can be left aside at the moment. If you have a heart, this was a terrible crime committed in a classroom. Since you are so God fearing, what does it take for your eyes to see or your ears to hear? You are blinded by mutually reinforcing patterns of private and Christio collective rebellions in your minds eye that are unable to see the truth. How dare you make those type of comments! Your type of religion is caught in a downward spiral corrupting, misdirecting, and is preparing a way for failure. Yes intellectual failure reinforcing the misdirection of your small mind and corrupt will.

I'm sure he's committed sins against God, just as we all have.
We all will be judged for our sins.
Again, I hope he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator before he died.
It's too late for him, his choice has been made.

[fuzi]

Hesed wrote:

<quoted text>
I'm sure he's committed sins against God, just as we all have.
We all will be judged for our sins.
Again, I hope he repented of his sins and made peace with his Creator before he died.
It's too late for him, his choice has been made.

You only speak for yourself and anyone else who believes in your idiotic anachronistic religion. Your religion is not absolute truth and your claims of it being so is a lie. It might be "truth" to you, but it is not to many others, so your pronouncements based on your illogical scribblings do nothing but spread hate and anger and sadness. You and those like you are what is wrong with much of the world today, you bring nothing but bad to society.

[BUCK]

guido el mala wrote:

<quoted text>
wrong.
the motives are not moot. look at every type of muder case put on the books... the motives are paramount to the cases.
you're also trying to change the conversation into one about hate crimes. that is irrelevant here as i'm not talking about the legality of hate crime law... i'm simply pointing out that saying in one post that heterosexual kids are killed as a comparison to the crime being discussed here is simply false.
motives are paramount in any murder case and do not insult the victims or our society in any way. to say that motives are a moot point in a murder case is simply untrue.
have a nice day,
t.

Motive is essential for conviction of a crime. The act of premeditated murder is hate.

[Rick in Kansas]

BUCK wrote:

<quoted text> Motive is essential for conviction of a crime. The act of premeditated murder is hate.

Not necessarily on both counts. Motive is only essential to prove if it is an actual element of the crime charged, or if if it would be difficult to prove that someone committed a specific crime if they didn't have a clear reason to do so. People are routinely convicted of crimes including murder based solely on factual evidence rather than the conjecture of why they did it. Also you do not have to hate someone in order to plan and kill them. People commit pre-meditated murder because of greed, power, love and any of a variety of reasons that hatred of the victim does not even play a role. Besides hate crimes are not based on hatred of the individual but on the hatred of the group that the victim represents to the perpetrator. More often than not, the victim is unknown to the person committing the crime and is only chosen as a target because of circumstance. Most importantly hate crimes are often marked by extreme brutality and their random nature making them especially deserving of additional punishment.

[Roni]

Hesed wrote:

<quoted text>
Sorry, just repeating the clear teachings of the Bible.
It was offensive in Jesus' day, it's still offensive now.
Glad to oblige.

You're such a good preacher. Please go preach in the Middle East.

[Hesed]

fuzi wrote:

<quoted text>You only speak for yourself and anyone else who believes in your idiotic anachronistic religion. Your religion is not absolute truth and your claims of it being so is a lie. It might be "truth" to you, but it is not to many others, so your pronouncements based on your illogical scribblings do nothing but spread hate and anger and sadness. You and those like you are what is wrong with much of the world today, you bring nothing but bad to society.

Glad to have made your day!
Enjoy!

Oh, and repent of your sins, for you haven't much time left.