Quarry operators deny environmental c...

Quarry operators deny environmental concerns

There are 64 comments on the Las Cruces Sun-News story from Dec 7, 2009, titled Quarry operators deny environmental concerns. In it, Las Cruces Sun-News reports that:

A company operating a plant that had been crushing rock for Spaceport America construction denies that it was behind the shut-down of a controversial Truth or Consequences quarry.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Las Cruces Sun-News.

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Sue Abare-Gritter

United States

#1 Dec 8, 2009
The runway will be 10,000 feet long, not 10,000 square feet. At 10,000 square feet and 200 feet wide, the runway would only be 50 feet long!!!!! Somebody didn't do their math!

“Springtime In New Mexico, YES!”

Since: Jun 09

Elephant Butte Sierra County

#2 Dec 9, 2009
Sue Abare-Gritter wrote:
The runway will be 10,000 feet long, not 10,000 square feet. At 10,000 square feet and 200 feet wide, the runway would only be 50 feet long!!!!! Somebody didn't do their math!
At this stage of the construction, how do YOU know, or anyone else for that matter if the Las Cruces Newspaper miq-quoted or mis printed what the spokesperson said. I can see how you conclude the math is flawed. Someone obviously doesn't know what they're talking about, maybe it's the newspaper.

A 200 ft. wide runway? ok
But it's more like 10,000 feet in length.
How do I know? I was in the Air Force, and most, but, not all runways for jet aircraft are at least 2 miles in length. Some are longer. Some have paved and unpaved over-runs of 1,000 feet or more.

The newspaper goes on and from the interview saying something about there not being enough gravel (base materials) to satisfy the contract job. If this is the case, the contractor should try to pull materials from the hatch quarry, or even from an El Paso quarry, it would seen these two locations are much closer than the one already contracted. And, that is just my observation and opinion.

“Springtime In New Mexico, YES!”

Since: Jun 09

Elephant Butte Sierra County

#3 Dec 9, 2009
BTW,
the dust from a rock crushing operation CAN BE an environmental ISSUE, especially if there are homes nearby. I think somebody isn't being totally honest here.
18 wheel trucks used to haul base materials on a gravel road can also be a nuisance to local residents too, especially if some resident has COPD or other respiratory ailments. New Mexico has a great deal of dust problems, one can plainly see that whenever winds blow 20 m.p.h. or more like they have the past 2 days.
Henry Lightcap

Las Cruces, NM

#4 Dec 9, 2009
The contractor is located in Albuquerque - the quarry is in T or C. Any quarry in Hatch or El Paso would be much, much further away, which would add to the transportation costs significantly.

And the quarry operation has (or had) the proper environmental certification. That is now the point in question; if it was issued properly or not.

“Springtime In New Mexico, YES!”

Since: Jun 09

Elephant Butte Sierra County

#5 Dec 9, 2009
I know where both contractor and quarry are located. The spokesperson for the contractor said something to the affect that they do not know if the present quarry contract can be fulfilled or not, that is why it is shut down. Not due to air quality, but it seems now that is an issue, although they're not openly saying so.

A limestone quarry is about 30 miles south of T or C on I-25 at the Hatch exit. If the T or C quarry cannot fulfill it's contract obligation for whatever reasons, the Spaceport may find itself acquiring either a new contractor, and quarry both. Now, if the contractor quarry cannot deliver, the Spaceport will definitely have to find another source for gravel. It remains to be seen if the Spaceport Authority will sever ties with it's present runway builder, they may sue for breach of contract.

One would have thought that someone would have done a more indepth study of available materials, NMED laws and regulations, and options in case something didn't work out, a plan B if you will.

Yes, it's going to cost a bundle more to truck gravel from Las Cruces or El paso.
If the Spaceport Authority would have played things smarter, maybe they could have contracted with BNSF to have railroad dump cars added to their line, and purchased all of the gravel they needed from BNSF, and had a small concrete batch plant built closer to the building site. Maybe that would have been more economical. Hindsight is always 20/20. I know in such large paving projects, closely located materials and a concrete batch plant are usually at the top of consideration.
Maybe too much haste to build? Now some planning could be wasted. I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Deb

Farmington, NM

#6 Jan 30, 2010
The rock crushing company is "RockCon." They had a portable crusher at the Bartoo Aggregate Pit Mine. The NMED permit had false maps submitted that omitted the nearby residences. Mining is not allowed in a residential area. In addition, RockCon was doing the rock crushing in TorC but had no business registration in TorC.(So the GRT wasn't coming to the community.)
While the rock crusher had no business registration and submitted false information on their permits with the NMEMNRD, the actual aggregate pit mine owned by Bartoo is also not registered to do business at that location and cannot get business registration there in a T-1 zone, which is residential. It is not true that they have been mining there since 1957, and the public records show it.
Oh, and Cloudynm...the issue at the P&Z was they were trying to have a decision without the required public hearing. When asked whether this was the public hearing as required, Howell tried to gavel down. No evidence was presented as it was not the hearing. It was simply an attempt by the P&Z (and City) to avoid the required public hearing. The mine is illegal, and that is a fact fully evidenced by the public record.
www.veoh.com/groups/week-in-review-torc #
Premiere episode, part 1.
(Censored by public access channel. They are afraid of the truth!!!)

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#8 Jan 30, 2010
cloudynm wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, you're wrong.
Bar-2 is operating within the laws of of the state. Bar-2 IS NOT IN A RESIDENTIAL AREA.
LIKE I SAID, YOU'RE ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE.
ARE YOU DRUNK KIMMY?
Is that your best defense? Calling someone drunk. You have no truth behind your words, only hatred and ignorance. The Morgan Street aggregate pit mine is in a residential area, T-1. That is a fact and not a matter of opinion.
And unlike you, I am not hiding behind a pseudonym like the coward you are. This is Deb (not Kim). If you've got something to say, be man enough to own up to your words of lies and stupidity, rather than hide behind the computer screen.
That's the difference between cowards like you and people like me: I own what I say!!!

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#9 Jan 30, 2010
Oh, and Bartoo is not operating within the federal laws, the state laws, or the laws of the City of Truth or Consequences. Do you have any documents to prove that he is? I have plenty of documentary evidence that proves Bartoo is not operating with the laws.(Committing perjury on forms is not proof of 'operating within the law,' but it is proof of operating outside the law.)

“Springtime In New Mexico, YES!”

Since: Jun 09

Elephant Butte Sierra County

#10 Jan 30, 2010
Deb2me wrote:
Oh, and Bartoo is not operating within the federal laws, the state laws, or the laws of the City of Truth or Consequences. Do you have any documents to prove that he is? I have plenty of documentary evidence that proves Bartoo is not operating with the laws.(Committing perjury on forms is not proof of 'operating within the law,' but it is proof of operating outside the law.)
God damn you're dumb.
State laws you idiot.
get the f out of here until you begin to make sense and stop using 6 user I'D.'s you drunk.
Go to be kimmy, it's been a long day for you.

“Springtime In New Mexico, YES!”

Since: Jun 09

Elephant Butte Sierra County

#11 Jan 30, 2010
I'd better not catch you trespassing at Bar-2, or I'll have your ass arrested.

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#12 Jan 30, 2010
cloudynm wrote:
<quoted text>
God damn you're dumb.
State laws you idiot.
get the f out of here until you begin to make sense and stop using 6 user I'D.'s you drunk.
Go to be kimmy, it's been a long day for you.
Are you as blind as you are dumb. Check out the picture. I am who I say I am, unlike you. Coward!!!

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#13 Jan 30, 2010
cloudynm wrote:
I'd better not catch you trespassing at Bar-2, or I'll have your ass arrested.
Coward or Howard...just one letter different.
The appeal with the P&Z has nothing to do with state law. It is disobedience to our LOCAL business and zoning ordinances.
And that permit application with NMEMNRD is perjury as it is signed under affirmation. Already have the documents to show that it is not "true." Explains why Rubin left after 30 years and took a job in Las Cruces. Refused to lie for ya.

“Old Sailors Never Die.”

Since: Aug 08

Land of The Brave

#14 Jan 30, 2010
While cloud and deb are spitting at each other here answer me this question:

Why did the Sun pull the article already? I am a retired powder monkey and have worked in every rock pit known to man in this state. I wanted to see who the contractor is and which pit they were trying to get the rock out of so I could have some imput into the conversation as to the folly of the Intergalictic Space Port.

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#15 Jan 30, 2010
cloudynm wrote:
<quoted text>
State laws you idiot.
And care to explain the illegal domestic water well at the aggregate pit mine. That's a violation of State law, too. OSE has already been in town and it, too, is under investigation. Quickly covering it up with a small hill (knee-high) of gravel didn't fool anyone. Got the video and lack of water purchase from the City. Thief of water in the desert on top of everything else. See a picture of it in forum or video of it at

www.veoh.com/group/week-in-review-torc

Stupid is as stupid does.

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#16 Jan 30, 2010
cloudynm wrote:
I'll have your ass arrested.
We'll see who gets arrested

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#17 Jan 30, 2010
Whisky River Crabb wrote:
While cloud and deb are spitting at each other here answer me this question:
Why did the Sun pull the article already? I am a retired powder monkey and have worked in every rock pit known to man in this state. I wanted to see who the contractor is and which pit they were trying to get the rock out of so I could have some imput into the conversation as to the folly of the Intergalictic Space Port.
The rock crushing contractor is RockCon out of Albuquerque. They were registered with a portable crusher and using it out at the "Morgan Street Aggregate Pit Mine" operated by Bartoo Sand & Gravel. RockCon did have business registration to operate in TorC. And Bartoo's location at 1809 S. Broadway (the aggregate pit mine they were getting the aggregate from and the location where they had an illegal domestic water well stealing water from our acquifer) has no local business registration. Only their location out on Hwy 181 is reigstered. They do not and have not ever had business registration at 1809 S. Broadway (the "official" address of the aggregate pit mine--which is not a mine according to members of our P&Z...what a laugh).
I've got nothing against the Spaceport myself. Love the idea of private exploration of space. The problem is the zero-sum propositions by the Spaceport Authority that this community has to be harmed in the process of building this Spaceport, including by our local government allowing an illegal mine in a residential area because mommy-in-law is on the Commission.
I hear and read--but have not confirmed with my own eyes--that they will now be getting the aggregate from out by the Spaceport, less than four miles. Although originally when the community suggested getting the aggregate from elsewhere, this aggregate did not originally meet the "quality" requirements.
It is all nothing more than the attempts by some of our "bad ole boys and gals" to line their pockets at the expense of the community. They are not used to people who do their research before they speak and catching them in all their illegal activities and flat out lies.

Check out the public access channel show which uncovered all this (and was censored by the local channel) at

www.veoh.com/group/week-in-review-torc

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#18 Jan 30, 2010
oops...typed so fast I made a typo...should say

RockCon does NOT have business registration to operate in TorC.

They would not be able to get business registration (as Bartoo also cannot) as it is not allowed per zoning ordinances to operate a mine in a RESIDENTIAL ZONE, which the area is zoned as T-1.

“Springtime In New Mexico, YES!”

Since: Jun 09

Elephant Butte Sierra County

#19 Jan 30, 2010
Deb2me wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you as blind as you are dumb. Check out the picture. I am who I say I am, unlike you. Coward!!!
LOSER.
You lost in a court of law, who is the idiot?
Filing false allegations.
Making false allegations.
You dumbass CAVE BITCH, shut up f ing loser.
cave bitch, cave bitch, cave bitch, go get drunk again, it's saturday night....

“Liberty and justice for all”

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#20 Jan 30, 2010
cloudynm wrote:
<quoted text>
LOSER.
You lost in a court of law, who is the idiot?
Filing false allegations.
Making false allegations.
You dumbass CAVE BITCH, shut up f ing loser.
cave bitch, cave bitch, cave bitch, go get drunk again, it's saturday night....
Haven't lost in a court of law. This issue hasn't been brought to a court of law. And if you are still thinking--like the loser you are--that I am Kim and are too blind to see my picture, you really are pathetic.

Is this the best you can do...yell a bunch of names? Grow a set to replace the ones already in a jar on my bookshelf.

Ignorant, pathetic coward. You are a disgrace to mankind.
durablebrad

Lindrith, NM

#21 Jan 30, 2010
There are no indications that Bartoo is in compliance with any laws, state or local. The facts indicate that Bartoo is in violation of local zoning, and has failed to register with New Mexico Mining and Minerals as required by law.

CloudyNM (correct spelling) may continue to argue otherwise, but the facts are irrefutable.

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