Whirlpool case highlights how smoker fees for health insurance ...

S moking is a lightning rod for controversy, as is the question of whether workers who smoke should have to pay more for their health insurance.

[Jackson]

The real discrimination is against non-smokers. Not only do they pay higher insurance premiums to cover the greater health care costs of smokers but they also have to take up the slack of employees leaving their workplace to grab a smoke. I observe one high rise office building in downtown Chicago where I often see the same people standing outside in bitter cold, snow or rain to smoke. It takes them up to 10 minutes to go to the elevator, wait for the elevator, travel down 40-60 stories, take 15 minutes for their cigarette and then go back to their desks. Total work time lost: 35 minutes. If non-smokers were to leave their desks for 35 minutes multiple times a day, they would be called to account. If people can sit on an airplane for up to 11 hours without smoking, they certainly can go four hours until lunch break to fill their lungs with tar.

[babybu2da]

whirlpool has a siren that tells you when to take your break or lunch and the workers were on a lunch break when they were PHOTOGRAPHED! Only 1 employee ask for her rebate. BUT THE UNION TREATED THEM AS 1 PERSON and not individually.
Funny that for these people to get there jobs back they have to pay $1000 to whirlpool by May 9 2008 in a certified check NO CREDIT CARDS OR CASH WILL BE ACCEPTED. They are suspended without pay till May 12 and have to sign a final letter stating that if they mess up again they will be fired.
Funny this paper hasn't beed seen since 2002 and there is no where in the Whirlpool contract, Insurance benefits contract, nor posted any where in the plant. THey are referring and we have it on paper that it is called SHOP RULE #1. THat is what the suspension paper has on it. Why aren't the shop rules posted anywhere in the plant??
Funny our insurance company doesn't require us to report whether we are smokers or not! Definity health insurance does not require you to report this!! Go ahead and check with the insurance company.

DO you remember everything you signed 6 years ago??

Why is it ONLY THE EVANSVILLE PLANT? I am sure they aren't the only ones that had to sign this paper.
and by the way MOST OF THE PEOPLE DID NOT SMOKE IN 2002.Plus you are supposed to have thirty days to report changes and a couple of the guys had started smoking in the last 3 weeks! But this paper isn't required to be signed YEARLY. Don't you think that it should be required to sign yearly!!

Plus our insurance has changed hands since 2002 so why when the new insurance went in affect why didn't they require them to sign the paper again??

How about the new news that you are not seeing. Last week Whirlpool decided to punish their employees that have spouses who work for a comapany that offer insurance and they refuse it then the employee that work at Whirlpool will be charged $400-$800 a year!! But you aren't reading about that are you!!

Read between the lines its not just smokers they are after.

[Brian]

Perhaps getting some reading and writing skills might be in order before trying to convince people that you are a font of knowledge with regard to written policy and legal documents you've signed. Perhaps?

[David]

Just quit smoking. I did years ago and I feel better for it. Also, with gas prices the way they are, how can anyone afford to smoke? Its a nasy, filthy habit that will kill you. Save your money, get some fresh air and enjoy life. Most companies are just looking for some reason to can you nowadays anyway.

[Barbara Rose]

Thanks for the additional information, babybu2da. To reach me directly, you can email [e-mail].

[kris13]

Great job and well stated! Good luck staying smoke free.

David wrote:

Just quit smoking. I did years ago and I feel better for it. Also, with gas prices the way they are, how can anyone afford to smoke? Its a nasy, filthy habit that will kill you. Save your money, get some fresh air and enjoy life. Most companies are just looking for some reason to can you nowadays anyway.

[jimbo55]

Barbara Rose wrote:

The suspended workers drew attention to their smoking when they asked for the rebates, prompting the company to check to see whether they had paid the fees. Apparently they hadn't.

So, this is less a smoking issue, and more a fraud issue? If so, I would fire them.

[Enough already]

I can't wait for the day that employers demand a surcharge for health insurance premiums for all employees, and family members, with a BMI of 30 and above.

The really sad part of that will be that those being hit with the surcharge will not even understand that they opened the door to this type of action with their hate of smokers.

You deserve what you get.

[Concerned]

Exactly Enough already!

Where will this end? Overweight people should be paying a surcharge. Just to be thorough, so should anyone with a family history of heart disease, diabetes, cancer, etc.

Smokers are the easy target. Enjoy that cheeseburger, you're next.

[Almost got it right]

For Jackson in post #2 -

If you ask an actuary who deals with health care premiums, you find that over their lifetimes, smokers actually are less of a drain on the healthcare system. They die of cancer or heart disease at an early age so they don't have all of expensive, chronic health issues of the aged.

[Dave]

babybu2da wrote:

whirlpool has a siren that tells you when to take your break or lunch and the workers were on a lunch break when they were PHOTOGRAPHED! Only 1 employee ask for her rebate. BUT THE UNION TREATED THEM AS 1 PERSON and not individually.
Funny that for these people to get there jobs back they have to pay $1000 to whirlpool by May 9 2008 in a certified check NO CREDIT CARDS OR CASH WILL BE ACCEPTED. They are suspended without pay till May 12 and have to sign a final letter stating that if they mess up again they will be fired.
Funny this paper hasn't beed seen since 2002 and there is no where in the Whirlpool contract, Insurance benefits contract, nor posted any where in the plant. THey are referring and we have it on paper that it is called SHOP RULE #1. THat is what the suspension paper has on it. Why aren't the shop rules posted anywhere in the plant??
Funny our insurance company doesn't require us to report whether we are smokers or not! Definity health insurance does not require you to report this!! Go ahead and check with the insurance company.
DO you remember everything you signed 6 years ago??
Why is it ONLY THE EVANSVILLE PLANT? I am sure they aren't the only ones that had to sign this paper.
and by the way MOST OF THE PEOPLE DID NOT SMOKE IN 2002.Plus you are supposed to have thirty days to report changes and a couple of the guys had started smoking in the last 3 weeks! But this paper isn't required to be signed YEARLY. Don't you think that it should be required to sign yearly!!
Plus our insurance has changed hands since 2002 so why when the new insurance went in affect why didn't they require them to sign the paper again??
How about the new news that you are not seeing. Last week Whirlpool decided to punish their employees that have spouses who work for a comapany that offer insurance and they refuse it then the employee that work at Whirlpool will be charged $400-$800 a year!! But you aren't reading about that are you!!
Read between the lines its not just smokers they are after.

Another retarded smoker, the company is being too nice FIRE ALL OF YOU, YOU COST ALL OF US MONEY WITH YOUR CHEATING! MAKE YOU PAY WHIRLPOOLS LEGAL BILLS TOO, YOU ARE CHEATING EMPLOYEE SHAREHOLDERS TOO.

[Dave]

Almost got it right wrote:

For Jackson in post #2 -
If you ask an actuary who deals with health care premiums, you find that over their lifetimes, smokers actually are less of a drain on the healthcare system. They die of cancer or heart disease at an early age so they don't have all of expensive, chronic health issues of the aged.

Not for employers they don't die early before they retire. They are way less productive and should get paid less than nonsmokers to be fair.

[Dont Go In Alone]

Dave wrote:

<quoted text>
Not for employers they don't die early before they retire. They are way less productive and should get paid less than nonsmokers to be fair.

Way less productive than the non-smoker sitting at his desk, playing fantasy sports? Checking the lastest stats for his favorite team. Or how about the non-smoking employee micro-managing his 401K making shifts and trades every hour? Or the non-smoker shopping online or watching YouTube videos or text messaging all day long? Or the non-smoker on the phone all day conducting personal business?(remember cubicle walls don't go to the ceiling and they're certainly not soundproof). Downloading Mp3's to their Ipods?

There's enough wasted employer time happening for everyone to take blame. At least when the smoker leaves his desk, he's not pretending to work. Cut the holier than though cr*p.

[Brava]

Concerned wrote:

Exactly Enough already!
Where will this end? Overweight people should be paying a surcharge. Just to be thorough, so should anyone with a family history of heart disease, diabetes, cancer, etc.
Smokers are the easy target. Enjoy that cheeseburger, you're next.

Very true we are set on a slippery slope where all of our health issues will be micromanaged by corporate bean counters.

Next time I buy appliances, they won't be from Whirlpool.

[Jimbozi]

So sad. Too bad.Actually, considering health care costs the non-smokers are getting a discount instead of the smokers being penalized. Look at it that way and it makes more sense.

[Wes Tuside]

This is frightening -- not only the events at Whirlpool, but the blind acceptance of it by the majority of those commenting. So, smokers start paying a penalty now; is it too crazy to think that, say, homosexuals might pay a penalty because they just might get HIV? It may seem like a ridiculous stretch, but is it really? And when does the stretch actually start to effect the majority?

[Pelon]

Here is a solution, don't hire smokers to begin with.

New Hires must take a nicotine test just like they take drug tests now! Flunked nicotine test equals no job! Insurance companies use these nicotine test now for life insurance policies they write.

Then a non smoking policy would be easy to enforce!

[Start Tazing]

Smokers are filthy, disgusting animals.

[Start Tazing]

Guess what smokers do after their extended break? play fantasy sports, and checking the stats on his/her favorite teams. Even more unproductive.

Dont Go In Alone wrote:

<quoted text>
Way less productive than the non-smoker sitting at his desk, playing fantasy sports? Checking the lastest stats for his favorite team. Or how about the non-smoking employee micro-managing his 401K making shifts and trades every hour? Or the non-smoker shopping online or watching YouTube videos or text messaging all day long? Or the non-smoker on the phone all day conducting personal business?(remember cubicle walls don't go to the ceiling and they're certainly not soundproof). Downloading Mp3's to their Ipods?
There's enough wasted employer time happening for everyone to take blame. At least when the smoker leaves his desk, he's not pretending to work. Cut the holier than though cr*p.

[Kate]

Overweight employees or employees that drink are bigger health risks than smokers.
All the fat people and the drinkers are next so all of you holier than thou fat drunks should shut your traps. You are up next.