AMR pilots cite 'potential' for imminent labor deal

Oct 30, 2012 Full story: Reuters 26

The pilots union at American Airlines said on Tuesday that a labor deal could be close if the bankrupt airline is willing to make certain key concessions.

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steve

Rocky Mount, VA

#1 Oct 31, 2012
Wanting industry parity on wages but wanting to merge with an airline (US) that pays less than the industry standard is not making sense. People like to believe something when it sounds good. Something like the politicians who promise a better economy,more jobs,higher wages and lower taxes and yet the masses fall for it every November.
I hope the pilots and AA can come to an agreement very soon and come out of chapter 11 a stronger carrier and with the new aircraft coming on line and new routes just announced,AA can be a great airline and compete with the best of them.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#2 Oct 31, 2012
AMR management is not negotiating in good faith, and have not....in recent history.

Tomorrow is NOV 1st. APA ( the members) should do what is needed.

Stay safe and stay strong! NOW is the time

Since: May 08

Santee CA

#3 Oct 31, 2012
steve wrote:
Wanting industry parity on wages but wanting to merge with an airline (US) that pays less than the industry standard is not making sense. People like to believe something when it sounds good. Something like the politicians who promise a better economy,more jobs,higher wages and lower taxes and yet the masses fall for it every November.
I hope the pilots and AA can come to an agreement very soon and come out of chapter 11 a stronger carrier and with the new aircraft coming on line and new routes just announced,AA can be a great airline and compete with the best of them.
Most any employee at AA will take any deal that involves the current management team and BOD resigning. Yes they will pay themselves very well to leave. Fact is the only chance AA has to be a force in the indusrty long term is if the greedy pay themselves, cut ties and let someone else run the airline
steve

Rocky Mount, VA

#4 Nov 1, 2012
Prost wrote:
<quoted text>Most any employee at AA will take any deal that involves the current management team and BOD resigning. Yes they will pay themselves very well to leave. Fact is the only chance AA has to be a force in the indusrty long term is if the greedy pay themselves, cut ties and let someone else run the airline
Do you really think Doug Parker and company will be better than current management? There much discord at US with pilots and flight attendants and labor unrest with the two regional carriers owned by US.
Merging with US will bring on a new set of problems and layoffs will come as this is what is hoped that will make the so called synergies work.

Since: May 08

Santee CA

#5 Nov 1, 2012
steve wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you really think Doug Parker and company will be better than current management? There much discord at US with pilots and flight attendants and labor unrest with the two regional carriers owned by US.
Merging with US will bring on a new set of problems and layoffs will come as this is what is hoped that will make the so called synergies work.
Doug Parker is no better. He is a college buddy of Tom Horton. But yes. I said anyone but the current AA management. The mistrust of management of AA runs deep. Every time a manager offers you a hand you look at the other one to see what the true intentions are. That is no way to have your employees view you. Union, non union, it doesn't matter. The California Dairy council has an ad about how good thier product is because thier cows are happy they don't live in frigidly cold Wisconsin. The fact is happy employees make for a good company. The cows at AA are VERY unhappy, and that attitude will only change when the old regime goes away.
steve

Rocky Mount, VA

#6 Nov 1, 2012
Prost wrote:
<quoted text>Doug Parker is no better. He is a college buddy of Tom Horton. But yes. I said anyone but the current AA management. The mistrust of management of AA runs deep. Every time a manager offers you a hand you look at the other one to see what the true intentions are. That is no way to have your employees view you. Union, non union, it doesn't matter. The California Dairy council has an ad about how good thier product is because thier cows are happy they don't live in frigidly cold Wisconsin. The fact is happy employees make for a good company. The cows at AA are VERY unhappy, and that attitude will only change when the old regime goes away.
There are times when one has to make a decision,AA employees need to either stay or leave the airline. I wish things were different but most management at most corporations are all cut out of the same cloth. I tend to look beyond today and look down the road. Is what I have now better than what might be available tomorrow?
Its easy to rant and rave but when the dust clears,will you be better off staying or leaving? Its not an easy choice for some,but in today's economy,one needs to consider very carefully his or her options as one wrong move can affect families for decades.
The devil you know is better than the devil you don't know.
I wish there was a quick fix for AA and its employees,but look how many airlines took a trip through chapter 11,CO twice,US twice,UA in chapter 11 for about 3 years,EA,PA,TW all gone and that's not even counting the many smaller carriers who are also gone.
Its not the same world it was 20 or 30 years ago and this is the result of capitalism,long live the stock holders at the expense of the employees.
Best wishes for all at AA.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#7 Nov 1, 2012
some folks are 'sheep'....and others are NOT.

so capitalism is the root of all evil?

maybe you should consider moving.

the pilots should strike, before the TRO is issued.

they can operate with fewer flight attend, fewer gate agents, fewer mechanics.

but ya cant operate an airline without pilots.

can you say leverage, unity

Since: Apr 08

Tulsa, OK

#8 Nov 1, 2012
Betsy wrote:
some folks are 'sheep'....and others are NOT.
so capitalism is the root of all evil?
maybe you should consider moving.
the pilots should strike, before the TRO is issued.
they can operate with fewer flight attend, fewer gate agents, fewer mechanics.
but ya cant operate an airline without pilots.
can you say leverage, unity
Betsy,

As my son recently told a pilot when he was on a flight that was obviously delayed because of the pilot slowdown, quit holding us hostage!

Correct, you can't run an airline without a pilot! Time for AA to shutdown and end the pilot hostage situation. Send them packing and they can resume their career somewhere else.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#9 Nov 1, 2012
tulaaretired wrote:
<quoted text>
Betsy,
As my son recently told a pilot when he was on a flight that was obviously delayed because of the pilot slowdown, quit holding us hostage!
Correct, you can't run an airline without a pilot! Time for AA to shutdown and end the pilot hostage situation. Send them packing and they can resume their career somewhere else.
tell your son to fly another airline. take a bus, maybe a car...

interesting that you folks love to keep blaming the pilots. send them packing you say....I am packing for vacation as we speak...

you stated 'the obviously delayed flight because of pilot slowdown'
what was the pilot doing? having coffee at the gate, taking a nap in a chair, a jog on the runway.....just wondering? how did your son determine it was an obvious pilot slowdown.
Dana

Houston, TX

#10 Nov 1, 2012
steve wrote:
<quoted text>
There are times when one has to make a decision,AA employees need to either stay or leave the airline. I wish things were different but most management at most corporations are all cut out of the same cloth. I tend to look beyond today and look down the road. Is what I have now better than what might be available tomorrow?
Its easy to rant and rave but when the dust clears,will you be better off staying or leaving? Its not an easy choice for some,but in today's economy,one needs to consider very carefully his or her options as one wrong move can affect families for decades.
The devil you know is better than the devil you don't know.
I wish there was a quick fix for AA and its employees,but look how many airlines took a trip through chapter 11,CO twice,US twice,UA in chapter 11 for about 3 years,EA,PA,TW all gone and that's not even counting the many smaller carriers who are also gone.
Its not the same world it was 20 or 30 years ago and this is the result of capitalism,long live the stock holders at the expense of the employees.
Best wishes for all at AA.
Name ANY other industry in the United States where after management makes a mess of the company and the business and makes EVERYONE including the customers miserable, the employees are expected to take the hit, a pay cut, little or no benefits, and the VERY people who caused the mess STILL get their salary and golden parachutes, and maybe even keep their job. Most any place else, you f*ck it up and you are gone management, being NO exception, sometimes even an example, as it SHOULD be!
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#11 Nov 1, 2012
Dana wrote:
<quoted text>
Name ANY other industry in the United States where after management makes a mess of the company and the business and makes EVERYONE including the customers miserable, the employees are expected to take the hit, a pay cut, little or no benefits, and the VERY people who caused the mess STILL get their salary and golden parachutes, and maybe even keep their job. Most any place else, you f*ck it up and you are gone management, being NO exception, sometimes even an example, as it SHOULD be!
AMEN Dana,

Thanks for the post!!!

But if you listen to folks like Steve and others,.... the employees( esp pilots) should stop ranting and raving and be happy that they have a job in these hard times. Suck it up, be treated like sh#*t, work for less pay and no benefits, and let management sit back and laugh, and collect millions. And we all should just accept it, because that is the way capitalism works.

I say he*#ll NO! Have a little character, alot of integrity, be tenacious, and give it a great fight. The chips will fall where they may...but at least I know that I went down fighting. Dont sell your soul. Dont except their BS, dont be a sheep.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#12 Nov 1, 2012
Prost wrote:
<quoted text>Doug Parker is no better. He is a college buddy of Tom Horton. But yes. I said anyone but the current AA management. The mistrust of management of AA runs deep. Every time a manager offers you a hand you look at the other one to see what the true intentions are. That is no way to have your employees view you. Union, non union, it doesn't matter. The California Dairy council has an ad about how good thier product is because thier cows are happy they don't live in frigidly cold Wisconsin. The fact is happy employees make for a good company. The cows at AA are VERY unhappy, and that attitude will only change when the old regime goes away.
Unless you are in the trenches with AMR , you have no idea how deep the history really is. Mistrust is putting it politely.
GAME OVER.
steve

Rocky Mount, VA

#13 Nov 1, 2012
Betsy wrote:
<quoted text>
AMEN Dana,
Thanks for the post!!!
But if you listen to folks like Steve and others,.... the employees( esp pilots) should stop ranting and raving and be happy that they have a job in these hard times. Suck it up, be treated like sh#*t, work for less pay and no benefits, and let management sit back and laugh, and collect millions. And we all should just accept it, because that is the way capitalism works.
I say he*#ll NO! Have a little character, alot of integrity, be tenacious, and give it a great fight. The chips will fall where they may...but at least I know that I went down fighting. Dont sell your soul. Dont except their BS, dont be a sheep.
Its a fight the pilots will never win. Face reality,as far as what Dana said,other industries acts the same as the airlines,how about GM,Chrysler,Advance auto parts,GE and time doe not permit me to name them all.They have all cut pay and benefits,outsourced jobs overseas and downsized. Big brave talk but when the job actually ends and the cheering stops,then the magnitude of the situation sets in.Little character,integrity and being tenacious will mean nothing when receiving unemployment checks,just the realization of what the pilots left behind.
It all comes down to this,1.Keep your job at AA or 2.Look for another job. Management will collect millions whether the airline survives or shuts down,but the employees won't.You keep talking as if the employees can change the way corporations work.All the bravado that you spout means nothing,I did not say the pilots have to be happy with a new contract,just as the other labor groups who agreed on new contracts are not happy,its just the way life is today and all your tough talk will melt away when the checks stop.
I can tell you have never been through tough times and I hope you never have to but I have and its sad when you are willing to work and can't find a job that will pay the bills and or have such watered down benefits that are not worth the premiums.When a person is over 50,they are viewed as past their prime and not worth hiring and yet its a time of their life when they have garnered much experience in their field and can teach younger workers much,but they are not given the chance to show what they can do. All those who worked at Eastern thought they could control their destiny but in January 1991 it all came to an abrupt end and they all hit the pavement.Those who don't learn from the past are bound to repeat it.
steve

Rocky Mount, VA

#14 Nov 1, 2012
Betsy wrote:
<quoted text>
Unless you are in the trenches with AMR , you have no idea how deep the history really is. Mistrust is putting it politely.
GAME OVER.
By the way,I WAS in the trenches for years at Usairways and went through two chapter 11's in the span of about two years.

Since: May 08

Santee CA

#15 Nov 1, 2012
Betsy wrote:
some folks are 'sheep'....and others are NOT.
so capitalism is the root of all evil?
maybe you should consider moving.
the pilots should strike, before the TRO is issued.
they can operate with fewer flight attend, fewer gate agents, fewer mechanics.
but ya cant operate an airline without pilots.
can you say leverage, unity
What happened to you? Lets look over this. The pilots cannot strike until a federal mediator declares an impasse. Then per the Railway Labor Act there is a 30 day cooling off period. Flight Attendant staffing is regulated by the FAA based on aircraft seating capacity and planned length of flight. You are correct, the airlines are outsourcing all other forms of labor. You were normally a good and smart poster, but you are slipping. Maybe someone is posing as you.

Since: May 08

Santee CA

#16 Nov 1, 2012
Betsy wrote:
<quoted text>
Unless you are in the trenches with AMR , you have no idea how deep the history really is. Mistrust is putting it politely.
GAME OVER.
I have 26 years on the ramp with AA. You don't get much deeper in the trenches. You may also be interested to know the corporate social media policy prevents me from portraying my company in a negative light. Hence the carefull posting.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#17 Nov 2, 2012
steve wrote:
<quoted text>
Its a fight the pilots will never win. Face reality,as far as what Dana said,other industries acts the same as the airlines,how about GM,Chrysler,Advance auto parts,GE and time doe not permit me to name them all.They have all cut pay and benefits,outsourced jobs overseas and downsized. Big brave talk but when the job actually ends and the cheering stops,then the magnitude of the situation sets in.Little character,integrity and being tenacious will mean nothing when receiving unemployment checks,just the realization of what the pilots left behind.
It all comes down to this,1.Keep your job at AA or 2.Look for another job. Management will collect millions whether the airline survives or shuts down,but the employees won't.You keep talking as if the employees can change the way corporations work.All the bravado that you spout means nothing,I did not say the pilots have to be happy with a new contract,just as the other labor groups who agreed on new contracts are not happy,its just the way life is today and all your tough talk will melt away when the checks stop.
I can tell you have never been through tough times and I hope you never have to but I have and its sad when you are willing to work and can't find a job that will pay the bills and or have such watered down benefits that are not worth the premiums.When a person is over 50,they are viewed as past their prime and not worth hiring and yet its a time of their life when they have garnered much experience in their field and can teach younger workers much,but they are not given the chance to show what they can do. All those who worked at Eastern thought they could control their destiny but in January 1991 it all came to an abrupt end and they all hit the pavement.Those who don't learn from the past are bound to repeat it.
You have no idea if I have been through tough times or not.
SHUT UP.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#18 Nov 2, 2012
steve wrote:
<quoted text>
By the way,I WAS in the trenches for years at Usairways and went through two chapter 11's in the span of about two years.
I said AMR, not USairways.

get over it, and move on
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#19 Nov 2, 2012
Prost wrote:
<quoted text>What happened to you? Lets look over this. The pilots cannot strike until a federal mediator declares an impasse. Then per the Railway Labor Act there is a 30 day cooling off period. Flight Attendant staffing is regulated by the FAA based on aircraft seating capacity and planned length of flight. You are correct, the airlines are outsourcing all other forms of labor. You were normally a good and smart poster, but you are slipping. Maybe someone is posing as you.
the RLA and other factors that play into this mess, are a bit more complex than you may think. i know what your saying about the mediator...i get it.

i am aware of the FAA regs for FA staffing. that is why the brillant amr management chose to reconfigure certain aircraft, to staff it with one less FA. thats great business and math.....loose millions in revenue, to save one salary.
Betsy

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#20 Nov 2, 2012
Prost wrote:
<quoted text>I have 26 years on the ramp with AA. You don't get much deeper in the trenches. You may also be interested to know the corporate social media policy prevents me from portraying my company in a negative light. Hence the carefull posting.
I understand. Thanks for your hard work on the ramp! Our family is 23 years in the same trench....

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