Jena Six Rally in Baltimore

[LISA IN LINTHICUM MD]

I WAS BORN AND RAISED IN BALTIMORE CITY AND ALL I KNOW IS IF ITS MORE THEN ONE ON ONE YOU ARE A PUNK SO 6 ON ONE MEANS THE JENNA 6 ARE A BUNCH OF PUNKS WHO COULDNT FIGHT ONE BIG MOUTH WHITE BOY ONE ON ONE

[Tom]

Supporter wrote:

You speak as though the other incidents were of the past. It was not. They are all related. Our whole system is based on past cases, previous rulings and judgements.
Let the boy go, give him probation and community service. Have all of them clean the school together while tied together. Give the other boys the same. Stop putting all the blame in one place. Start with the parents. You said when do we start, just like with anything else, after you clean up your mess.
I understand your point but you refuse to see mine. But I get that and it's okay.

No, I honestly do see your point, but there has to be a time and place that all this silly finger pointing has to stop. I have no problem with anything you suggest above, just can't abide by "let them go because they're black" mentality, or because their civil rights were violated and thus makes it ok for them to walk away. The parents are the starting point, as you say.
You're right when you say our judicial system is corrupt; I agree with you 100% but that doesn't mean that street justice should prevail and criminals be allowed to walk away just because it's what's easiest. I want nothing more than an equal, truly blind judicial system. but that will never come about when we have incidents such as this. Or Rodney King, Or the Duke LeCrosse team, or any other incident that has not seen justice rightfully completed. but that doesn't mean we stop trying. It doens't mean we allow criminals to go free because we have some collective guilt over their treatment in the past. Double standards have to stop on all sides or we will never progress as a society, and like it or not there has to be a time and place that all sillyness has to stop and people fess up and do what they know is right as people, not at blacks, whites, latinos, asians, etc...but as people. there comes a time when all of us must look ourselves in the mirror and lay judgement on what we see; and live with what we know is looking back at us.

[Supporter]

Tom wrote:

<quoted text>No, I honestly do see your point, but there has to be a time and place that all this silly finger pointing has to stop. I have no problem with anything you suggest above, just can't abide by "let them go because they're black" mentality, or because their civil rights were violated and thus makes it ok for them to walk away. The parents are the starting point, as you say.
You're right when you say our judicial system is corrupt; I agree with you 100% but that doesn't mean that street justice should prevail and criminals be allowed to walk away just because it's what's easiest. I want nothing more than an equal, truly blind judicial system. but that will never come about when we have incidents such as this. Or Rodney King, Or the Duke LeCrosse team, or any other incident that has not seen justice rightfully completed. but that doesn't mean we stop trying. It doens't mean we allow criminals to go free because we have some collective guilt over their treatment in the past. Double standards have to stop on all sides or we will never progress as a society, and like it or not there has to be a time and place that all sillyness has to stop and people fess up and do what they know is right as people, not at blacks, whites, latinos, asians, etc...but as people. there comes a time when all of us must look ourselves in the mirror and lay judgement on what we see; and live with what we know is looking back at us.

I here you loud and clear, but what do you think should be done in this case. How do we fix it now and have justice served at the same time. He should go free because the charges were dropped. They are holding him so they can charge him as a juvenile. That's fine but he should have a bail and then set free pending a trial. No one is suggesting he should get off scott free. Well at least I'm not. I look at the effects this has done to people and it's not good. I've noticed on these blogs that hatred and racism has been openly and blunt from both sides. I don't know if the honesty is a good thing or not, but I do know that it's causing major separation among races, friends, and even families. Resentment is has made a home in too many. Yes, double standards need to stop but I really don't have any faith that things will get better. Sad to say but the truth.

[Tom]

Supporter wrote:

<quoted text>
I here you loud and clear, but what do you think should be done in this case. How do we fix it now and have justice served at the same time. He should go free because the charges were dropped. They are holding him so they can charge him as a juvenile. That's fine but he should have a bail and then set free pending a trial. No one is suggesting he should get off scott free. Well at least I'm not. I look at the effects this has done to people and it's not good. I've noticed on these blogs that hatred and racism has been openly and blunt from both sides. I don't know if the honesty is a good thing or not, but I do know that it's causing major separation among races, friends, and even families. Resentment is has made a home in too many. Yes, double standards need to stop but I really don't have any faith that things will get better. Sad to say but the truth.

Unfortunately, you're probably more right than you realize.
As for what should be done? There really is no reason to hold him without bail unless the judge has reason to believe that there is a flight risk. Don't know enough about those circumstances to say one way or the other without the facts behind the decision. He should be tried accordingly for the crime he is accused of. and if anyone violated his civil rights, they should be standing trial for those crimes they are accused of. and the same should take place every single time. Plain and simple.

[Tom]

People also have to accept and realize that the statement of a fact doesn't neccessarily constitute racism or bigotry; sometimes that simple statement of a fact is just that, the statement of a fact. Shouldn't repress factual information simply because someone doesn't like how that fact reflects on them (A procrastinator may not like being told he can't be relied on to be on time, but that doesn't mean it is not an accurate statement; just because it reflects negatively on him doesn't mean it's wrong). We have become a society of a "Camp Kumbaiya" mentality; repress everything everybody might not ever want to hear for fear of offending them. That simply isn't healthy in anyway, shape or form. And simply because an unfavorable factual statement is made, does't mean it is inherently malicious, it's simply factual. Accept it and carry on.

[Supporter]

Did you hear? I know you did. He's out on bond. Maybe things will be done right this time. I like "Kumbaiya" (stole your spelling-hope you are correct).

[1blkbaltimorefem]

Supporter wrote:

You speak as though the other incidents were of the past. It was not. They are all related. Our whole system is based on past cases, previous rulings and judgements.
Let the boy go, give him probation and community service. Have all of them clean the school together while tied together. Give the other boys the same. Stop putting all the blame in one place. Start with the parents. You said when do we start, just like with anything else, after you clean up your mess.
I understand your point but you refuse to see mine. But I get that and it's okay.

Great suggestion supporter

[Tom]

Supporter wrote:

Did you hear? I know you did. He's out on bond. Maybe things will be done right this time. I like "Kumbaiya" (stole your spelling-hope you are correct).

Hopefully it will, one can only hope someone pulls their head from their butt.

[1blkbaltimorefem]

Tom wrote:

People also have to accept and realize that the statement of a fact doesn't neccessarily constitute racism or bigotry; sometimes that simple statement of a fact is just that, the statement of a fact. Shouldn't repress factual information simply because someone doesn't like how that fact reflects on them (A procrastinator may not like being told he can't be relied on to be on time, but that doesn't mean it is not an accurate statement; just because it reflects negatively on him doesn't mean it's wrong). We have become a society of a "Camp Kumbaiya" mentality; repress everything everybody might not ever want to hear for fear of offending them. That simply isn't healthy in anyway, shape or form. And simply because an unfavorable factual statement is made, does't mean it is inherently malicious, it's simply factual. Accept it and carry on.

well why is it that you never offer statements of facts about your people. You are as bad as you say black ppl are. its all generalizations at the end of the day

[Tom]

1blkbaltimorefem wrote:

<quoted text>
well why is it that you never offer statements of facts about your people. You are as bad as you say black ppl are. its all generalizations at the end of the day

I havene't said anything bad about black people; at least I don't think I said anything against someone based on their race. I don't care what color a person is, a criminal is a criminal is a criminal. I'm more than happy to make a factual statement about a criminal based on their actions, conviction in court, confessions, etc. What "nagative" statement would you like me to say about "my people" you don't even know what my people are and you cast judgement; and you talk about being biased. I don't know a thing about you and I refrain from basing anything I say on conjecture; I know for a fact that you are trying to justify something, not exactly sure what. The point of this forum centered around a crime that was committed and rooted in a racial bias; would you have me discuss the persons' height, or lack thereof in order to appease your sensibilities? Up until now, myself and the individual I was talking to kept things pretty evenly keeled. if you wish to attack someone, please make it a viable one.

[1blkbaltimorefem]

Tom wrote:

<quoted text>I havene't said anything bad about black people; at least I don't think I said anything against someone based on their race. I don't care what color a person is, a criminal is a criminal is a criminal. I'm more than happy to make a factual statement about a criminal based on their actions, conviction in court, confessions, etc. What "nagative" statement would you like me to say about "my people" you don't even know what my people are and you cast judgement; and you talk about being biased. I don't know a thing about you and I refrain from basing anything I say on conjecture; I know for a fact that you are trying to justify something, not exactly sure what. The point of this forum centered around a crime that was committed and rooted in a racial bias; would you have me discuss the persons' height, or lack thereof in order to appease your sensibilities? Up until now, myself and the individual I was talking to kept things pretty evenly keeled. if you wish to attack someone, please make it a viable one.

Not attacking...I know for a fact that you dont know the details in the jena case, but you are so quick to declare their guilt and belittle any notion that the punishment did not fit the crime...nor have you acknowledged that the course America has been on...will not lead to a reconcillation between the races. I dont care to debate you. Just wanted you to know you are being disrespetful to a whole bunch of other law abiding black ppl that you want to characterize based on stats you found on the net

[Tom]

Well, if you were to read the entire string of email conversations, you would find that I mentioned a legal court of law, civil rights, right from wrong, etc. All of which were based on actions, not race. In fact the entire thread was mostly about Not letting criminal action be forgiven just because some knucklehead violated the suspects civil rights. In fact I even stated that above that I was glad the individual was released on bail. But if you wish: where was your outrage over the whole Duke incident. if you had been around for that conversation you would hava also seen me express a positive response to the DA being dis-barred, sent to jail, even though it was only one day) and he's white. So, if you wish to discuss disrespect based on race. Take a good look around you, it happens by everybody everywhere. Racism is universal. And I do agree with you, condemnation of racism needs to know no racial boundaries for we (collectively as a society) are guilty in perpetuating it actively or passively; but perpetuated it is.

[Tom]

1blkbaltimorefem wrote:

<quoted text>
Not attacking...I know for a fact that you dont know the details in the jena case, but you are so quick to declare their guilt and belittle any notion that the punishment did not fit the crime...nor have you acknowledged that the course America has been on...will not lead to a reconcillation between the races. I dont care to debate you. Just wanted you to know you are being disrespetful to a whole bunch of other law abiding black ppl that you want to characterize based on stats you found on the net

Well, I do know that it was a crime based on racial bias. I do know that massive amounts of people advocated that the suspects be allowed to go free and not be charged with anything because their civil rights were "reported" to have been violated. I won't bother to go back and rehash previous conversations on how simply forgiving a criminal activity due to a violation of their civil rights is garbage. If their civil rights were violated then the goof ball that violated them needs to be charged and stand trial, just as the individuals that are charged with a crime should be standing trial. For any group; black, white, red, brown, green, blue, orange, to decry racism and then hide behind their race and past injustices as an excuse for criminal actions is simply wrong. Plain and Simple. I don't care what your color is, if you are charged with criminal activity the the legal process needs to be exercised.

[Tom]

1blkbaltimorefem wrote:

<quoted text>
Not attacking...I know for a fact that you dont know the details in the jena case, but you are so quick to declare their guilt and belittle any notion that the punishment did not fit the crime...nor have you acknowledged that the course America has been on...will not lead to a reconcillation between the races. I dont care to debate you. Just wanted you to know you are being disrespetful to a whole bunch of other law abiding black ppl that you want to characterize based on stats you found on the net

Reread your post then tell me you didn't make any prejudgement against me. you don't know my color, race, "people" as you put it; you have no idea where, when, how, etc I received any information about this case and yet you sit in judgement against me simply for what reason? because I don't advocate allowing criminal activity be ignored because the suspected perpetrator is of a color other than "white"? and you say I'm disrespectful and racist? Me thinks you should take a good look at yourself and check what your house is made of before you begin to throw stones (people in glass houses analogy).

As far as I know, I have never harbored any ill will against anyone based on the color of their skin. I pay attention, their actions, motives, words, etc. all play a part in deciding what I think of someone; good or bad. I hope you can determine that based on the string of conversations in this forum. If not, maybe I wasn't clear enough for you or maybe you don't want to see it; that is only controlled by you.

[1blkbaltimorefem]

the duke rapers are suing. whats that all about. Are they justfied or should they just get over it.

[Sean]

1blkbaltimorefem wrote:

the duke rapers are suing. whats that all about. Are they justfied or should they just get over it.

Really, and if were three black kids would you be saying the same thing? Highly doubt it. you'd be screaming racism from on high and demanding blood, money, and more money to make amends for the evil white man still existing on the same earth as you.

[Sean]

Their lives, education, everything was destroyed because of overzealous media, a lying scam artist, hypocritcal spineless college leadership. They even had 80, count em, 80 college professors come out in writing can condemn them....OOOPS, it was all a lie...we'll just shut up and go away. Please do the same. No way! I hope they run every single one of those jerks from that college from that place. They deserve no less.

[Sean]

1blkbaltimorefem wrote:

the duke rapers are suing. whats that all about. Are they justfied or should they just get over it.

Just a tad bit WRONG to be calling them "duke rapers": They didn't rape anybody. they successfully defended themselves against a lying scam artist; which this was not the first time she'd done this very same thing prior to this. So, why are you condemning them as "rapers"? Not just a little bit biased are you?

[Sean]

1blkbaltimorefem wrote:

the duke rapers are suing. whats that all about. Are they justfied or should they just get over it.

So tell me honestly; just how fast were you spewing hatred and racist garbage around BEFORE they even went to trial or anything else. All it took was the the accusation, didn't it?

[Sean]

If you wanted to see Justification then why aren't you endorsing the idea of bring charges against the lying scam artist that got caught and admitted to lying and perpetuating this thing? would you be demanding she be brought up on charges if she were any color other than black?