Russian: The Language of Grammatical ...

Russian: The Language of Grammatical and Linguistic Perfection

There are 247 comments on the www.tnr.com story from Feb 23, 2009, titled Russian: The Language of Grammatical and Linguistic Perfection. In it, www.tnr.com reports that:

The Classical Russian Language has long been famous and known as the Language of Grammatical and Linguistic Perfection. Unlike the Romance languages, concerned with accents and syllabi, the Russian Language concerns itself with perfect relationships between words and meaning, such as genders, inflexions, antecedents, and noun traces. The Russian language is known to be the most difficult and complex language in the world, creating the most sophisticated of creative works, especially in Russian Formalistic Poetry and Novels. Not always incorporating Formalistic approaches to literary and poetical texts, the Russian language has become the dominant language of The Commonwealth of Independent States, but not the only language thereof by any means. By having had created Russian as the common bond of tongue amongst the Commonwealth, trade and industry, education and arts have more easily transcended the boundaries of internationalism.

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Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#1 Feb 23, 2009
http://www.topix.com/member/profile/stephanym... <--- "Stephany McDowell" ya you !

We went through this before with you last year and I'm calling you out on it again. If you want to keep being a mod on this forum, you had better post the story without your personal observations involved. You want to post them, then do it on a thread like everyone else on here and not like it was part of the actual story. Now you either fix it, or your going to be reported...AGAIN.

Here let me quote what you posted, and what is NOT in that article.

" Not always incorporating Formalistic approaches to literary and poetical texts, the Russian language has become the dominant language of The Commonwealth of Independent States, but not the only language thereof by any means. By having had created Russian as the common bond of tongue amongst the Commonwealth, trade and industry, education and arts have more easily transcended the boundaries of internationalism."

Now fix it. This had better be the last time someone on this forum points has to point this out to you.

Since: Jan 09

Novokuznetsk

#2 Feb 23, 2009
Well, the really big difference between Russian and English or German, etc. is the power of word endings and suffixes. By using them, you can more emotionaly express your words, endowing them with such qualities of an object you describe: size, gender, your sympathy (for example, using affectionate diminutive suffixes with person name you describe how lovely the person is), etc. Yeah, the language is kind of tough, not everyone in Russia speaks quite correct, especially low-lives.
Cecilia

Bradford, PA

#3 Feb 23, 2009
You have too much time on your hands.
Cecilia

Bradford, PA

#4 Feb 23, 2009
^That was addressed to the bloated Alaskan Why_Me, by the way.

Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#5 Feb 23, 2009
Dmitry wrote:
Well, the really big difference between Russian and English or German, etc. is the power of word endings and suffixes. By using them, you can more emotionaly express your words, endowing them with such qualities of an object you describe: size, gender, your sympathy (for example, using affectionate diminutive suffixes with person name you describe how lovely the person is), etc. Yeah, the language is kind of tough, not everyone in Russia speaks quite correct, especially low-lives.
Russian...atleast for me is a very difficult langauge. German was easy to learn...English is a offshoot of German. Spanish wasn't so bad, but Russian...beautiful langauge and hard on the tongue if your not used to speaking it. My wife has tried to teach me Russian over the years and still no luck other than a few sentences wich are still mingled with English words.

But again, Russian is a beautiful language to listen to.

Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#6 Feb 23, 2009
Cecilia wrote:
^That was addressed to the bloated Alaskan Why_Me, by the way.
I don't think you understood my post...I'm not surprised after reading some of your other post on here. This mod...Stephany McDowell" has put her own opinion...words into the story header. It's not what mods are supposed to do.

I am a advocate of the Belarusian language not to mention I donate money to the Skaryna museum in Polatsk, Belarus. If you knew anything about Russfication in Belarus you would understand what the mod was implying with her words. It's called "propaganda" and not telling the truth.

She knows exactly what she was doing when she wrote that crap on there...she's done this kind of thing before.

Since: Jan 09

Novokuznetsk

#7 Feb 24, 2009
[QOUTE]
I am a advocate of the Belarusian language not to mention I donate money to the Skaryna museum in Polatsk, Belarus. If you knew anything about Russfication in Belarus you would understand what the mod was implying with her words. It's called "propaganda" and not telling the truth.
[/QOUTE]

Belarussians and Ukrainians know their languages pretty good, they study them at schools, and in families. Of course during the Soviet era and the Imperial ages our nations became closer and small countries started to speak Russian more widely.
But there wasn't any intention to steal their languages from them and force them to speak only Russian. The truth is that after the collapse of the USSR in Ukraine Russian language suffer from being banned, etc. The Russian-speaking people of ex-USSR republics take a huge part of population of those republics, so they shouldn't be opressed.
I said it already: for me, officially bilingual countries seem as the best solution.
The good point is that our languages have almost the same structure and roots, so we understand each other very good.

By the way, there surely are language schools with Russian faculties, and you can study there when you have spare time. Your wife is from Slavic country? What a lucky you are :)

I was fascinated to see some American woman speaking Russian very clear, she was interviewed in TV news program as a political expert during US presidential elections.

Since: Jan 09

Novokuznetsk

#8 Feb 24, 2009
QOUTE
oh, snap, that's what happens when you try to quote by yourself :)

Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#9 Feb 24, 2009
Dmitry wrote:
[QOUTE]
I am a advocate of the Belarusian language not to mention I donate money to the Skaryna museum in Polatsk, Belarus. If you knew anything about Russfication in Belarus you would understand what the mod was implying with her words. It's called "propaganda" and not telling the truth.
[/QOUTE]
Belarussians and Ukrainians know their languages pretty good, they study them at schools, and in families. Of course during the Soviet era and the Imperial ages our nations became closer and small countries started to speak Russian more widely.
But there wasn't any intention to steal their languages from them and force them to speak only Russian. The truth is that after the collapse of the USSR in Ukraine Russian language suffer from being banned, etc. The Russian-speaking people of ex-USSR republics take a huge part of population of those republics, so they shouldn't be opressed.
I said it already: for me, officially bilingual countries seem as the best solution.
The good point is that our languages have almost the same structure and roots, so we understand each other very good.
By the way, there surely are language schools with Russian faculties, and you can study there when you have spare time. Your wife is from Slavic country? What a lucky you are :)
I was fascinated to see some American woman speaking Russian very clear, she was interviewed in TV news program as a political expert during US presidential elections.
Do you know why Russian was spoken more widely in Belarus and Ukraine? Because Belrusian and Ukrainian was banned...that's why. It was banned from Government jobs, teaching jobs, and civil service jobs. Do a google search on " Russification ". Right now Belarus has a president/dictator who can't even speak his country's language. Infact this idiot Lukashenko gave a speech to the press on how the great Belarusian writer/printer Skarnya was born and raised in St. Petersburg. Funny thing about it was Skarnya was dead before St. Petersburg was founded.

So now you know why there are so many Russian speakers in Belarus and Ukraine.

btw, we have alot of Russian speaking people in Alaska. There are Russians of the "Old Faith". Nice people, and they are bi lingual.
Lukashenko is Dr Phil

Tampere, Finland

#10 Feb 24, 2009
Russia is a filthy language mixed by slavic, mongolic and turkic BS. ;)
By the way

Moscow, Russia

#11 Feb 24, 2009
Why_Me wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you know why Russian was spoken more widely in Belarus and Ukraine? Because Belrusian and Ukrainian was banned...that's why.
Was it really banned?
Jazz singer

London, UK

#12 Feb 24, 2009
Why_Me wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you know why Russian was spoken more widely in Belarus and Ukraine? Because Belrusian and Ukrainian was banned...that's why. It was banned from Government jobs, teaching jobs, and civil service jobs.
It is not that these were banned, but that Russian was adopted as the main language. It was, after all, the language of the majority of the population in the Russian Empire and subsequently the Soviet Union.

Could one imagine a civil service where officials from different parts of the country can't communicate, or an army where orders are given in different languages depending where the regiments are from?

Most countries did the same.
Modern French is the dialect from Ile de France, which has been adopted instead of Langue d'Oc, langue d'Oil, Occitan, Norman, Breton, Corsican, etc....
Modern Italian is the Piedmontese language adopted when Italy united against Florentin, Roman, Napolitan, Sicilian, Latin, Lombard, Etruscan, etc...

Countries need to have a national language, most of the time the one spoken by the majority.

Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#13 Feb 24, 2009
By the way wrote:
<quoted text>
Was it really banned?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russification

* Russification * <--- read on. references and links to this are posted at the bottom of that link. Or any simple google search on the subject will suffice also.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ded_Moroz

* Ded Moroz *

" In 1916, in Imperial Russia the Holy Synod called to boycott Christmas trees as a tradition, originating from Germany (Russia's enemy during World War I). In the Russian SFSR and the Soviet Union Christmas trees were banned until 1935 because they were considered to be a "bourgeois and religious prejudice". In 1928 Ded Moroz was declared "an ally of the priest and kulak".. Nevertheless, the image of Father Frost took its final shape in the USSR: he became the main symbol of the New Year’s Holiday that replaced Christmas as the most favourite and fairy holiday in the pre-revolutionary Russia. The New Year's tree was revived in the USSR after the famous letter by Pavel Postyshev, published in Pravda on December 28, 1935, where he asked for New Year trees to be installed in schools, children's homes, Young Pioneer Palaces, children's clubs, children's theaters and cinema theaters. Postyshev believed that the origins of the holiday, which were pre-Christian in any case, were less important than the benefits it could bring to Soviet children. In 1937, Ded Moroz for the first time arrived at the Moscow Palace of Unions. In subsequent years, an invitation to the New Year Tree at the Palace of Unions became a matter of honor for Soviet children. The image of “Soviet” Father Frost was established by Soviet filmmakers in the 1930s. The color of the coat that Ded Moroz wore was changed several times. So as not to be confused with Santa Claus, it was often blue. Joseph Stalin ordered Palace of Unions' Ded Morozes to wear only blue coats. During the times of the Soviet Union's dominance over Eastern Europe, Ded Moroz was officially introduced in many national traditions, despite being alien to them. Following the fall of the Soviet Union, there have been efforts to revive local characters. Russia has other gift givers like baboushaka and kolyada.

Unlike in Russia, in Belarus Dzied Maroz is not a traditional character and is never mentioned in national folklore. This character was introduced during Soviet times in order to replace the traditional &#346;viaty Nika&#322;aj (Saint Nicholas), whom the anti-religious Soviet government considered inappropriate. Unlike &#346;viaty Nika&#322;aj, who arrived at Christmas, Dzied Maroz was a New Year guest. All his habits and looks were borrowed from Russian traditions, with Belarusian ones being abandoned.
Although some people are making attempts to bring &#346;viaty Nika&#322;aj back, Dzied Maroz remains a popular winter holiday character, mainly because most people are familiar with Soviet customs, and know almost nothing about older Belarusian national traditions."
Russian Agressor

Ural, Russia

#14 Feb 24, 2009
Ukrainian and Belorussian languages are only dialects of russian language. We russians could understand them without any translator and dictionary though we have never learned their languages.

Ukrainian and Belorussian, as well as other republic's lang-s have never been banned during USSR time in ex-republics.
Small Town America

United States

#15 Feb 24, 2009
Why_Me wrote:
<quoted text>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russification
* Russification * <--- read on. references and links to this are posted at the bottom of that link. Or any simple google search on the subject will suffice also.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ded_Moroz
* Ded Moroz *
" In 1916, in Imperial Russia the Holy Synod called to boycott Christmas trees as a tradition, originating from Germany (Russia's enemy during World War I). In the Russian SFSR and the Soviet Union Christmas trees were banned until 1935 because they were considered to be a "bourgeois and religious prejudice". In 1928 Ded Moroz was declared "an ally of the priest and kulak".. Nevertheless, the image of Father Frost took its final shape in the USSR: he became the main symbol of the New Year’s Holiday that replaced Christmas as the most favourite and fairy holiday in the pre-revolutionary Russia. The New Year's tree was revived in the USSR after the famous letter by Pavel Postyshev, published in Pravda on December 28, 1935, where he asked for New Year trees to be installed in schools, children's homes, Young Pioneer Palaces, children's clubs, children's theaters and cinema theaters. Postyshev believed that the origins of the holiday, which were pre-Christian in any case, were less important than the benefits it could bring to Soviet children. In 1937, Ded Moroz for the first time arrived at the Moscow Palace of Unions. In subsequent years, an invitation to the New Year Tree at the Palace of Unions became a matter of honor for Soviet children. The image of “Soviet” Father Frost was established by Soviet filmmakers in the 1930s. The color of the coat that Ded Moroz wore was changed several times. So as not to be confused with Santa Claus, it was often blue. Joseph Stalin ordered Palace of Unions' Ded Morozes to wear only blue coats. During the times of the Soviet Union's dominance over Eastern Europe, Ded Moroz was officially introduced in many national traditions, despite being alien to them. Following the fall of the Soviet Union, there have been efforts to revive local characters. Russia has other gift givers like baboushaka and kolyada.
Unlike in Russia, in Belarus Dzied Maroz is not a traditional character and is never mentioned in national folklore. This character was introduced during Soviet times in order to replace the traditional &#346;viaty Nika&#322;aj (Saint Nicholas), whom the anti-religious Soviet government considered inappropriate. Unlike &#346;viaty Nika&#322;aj, who arrived at Christmas, Dzied Maroz was a New Year guest. All his habits and looks were borrowed from Russian traditions, with Belarusian ones being abandoned.
Although some people are making attempts to bring &#346;viaty Nika&#322;aj back, Dzied Maroz remains a popular winter holiday character, mainly because most people are familiar with Soviet customs, and know almost nothing about older Belarusian national traditions."
Ha! Why_me ! Isn't it interesting how some people tend to underestimate! Then again, most don't realize that it takes "Brains" to survive in Alaska. I do respect your digging for gold. You have hit pay dirt regarding this forum. Very, very, interesting. very revealing. And, your results show you are a Master Pumber!!
Chloe

United States

#16 Feb 24, 2009
Cecilia wrote:
You have too much time on your hands.
But, he appears to be making the best of it. Very constructive and interesting.

“UG X”

Since: Jan 09

Location hidden

#17 Feb 24, 2009
Why_Me wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you know why Russian was spoken more widely in Belarus and Ukraine? Because Belrusian and Ukrainian was banned...that's why. It was banned from Government jobs, teaching jobs, and civil service jobs. Do a google search on " Russification ". Right now Belarus has a president/dictator who can't even speak his country's language. Infact this idiot Lukashenko gave a speech to the press on how the great Belarusian writer/printer Skarnya was born and raised in St. Petersburg. Funny thing about it was Skarnya was dead before St. Petersburg was founded.
So now you know why there are so many Russian speakers in Belarus and Ukraine.
btw, we have alot of Russian speaking people in Alaska. There are Russians of the "Old Faith". Nice people, and they are bi lingual.
HE knows that very well.He is just being a jerk and looking for a fight, just like Stefania/Cecilia does all the time.

Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#18 Feb 24, 2009
Russian Agressor wrote:
Ukrainian and Belorussian languages are only dialects of russian language. We russians could understand them without any translator and dictionary though we have never learned their languages.
Ukrainian and Belorussian, as well as other republic's lang-s have never been banned during USSR time in ex-republics.
And it could be said that "Russian is a dialect of the langauge of the "Kyiv Rus". All three langauge are related. Russian has Finno-Ugric words, and a few Turkish words from the effects of the Mongols. Ukrainian also has a few Turkic words and Polish words, and Belarusian has a few Polish words.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_East_Slavic

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Slavic_langu...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_languages

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_langua...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belarusian_langu...

No language is above the other. And yes those langauges were banned. Infact I will show you seeing how you failed to read the link I posted.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_language
Cecilia

Bradford, PA

#19 Feb 24, 2009
Chloe wrote:
<quoted text>
But, he appears to be making the best of it. Very constructive and interesting.
Spending hours excavating old threads on a second-rate Internet forum is constructive? Honey, playing Second Life or Dungeons & Dragons RPG is more constructive than that.

Why_Me

“Privet”

Since: Apr 07

Big Lake, Alaska USA

#20 Feb 24, 2009
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russification

* Russification *

" One example of 19th century Russification was the replacement of the Ukrainian, Polish, Lithuanian, and Belarusian languages by Russian in those areas, which became part of the Russian Empire after the Partitions of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. It intensified after the 1831 uprising and, in particular, after the January Uprising of 1863. In 1864, the Polish and Belarusian languages were banned in public places; in the 1880s, Polish was banned in schools and offices of the Congress Kingdom, and research and teaching of Polish language, history or Catholicism were forbidden. This led to the creation of a Polish underground education network, which included the famous Flying University.

Russian language gained greater emphasis. In 1938, Russian became a required subject of study in every Soviet school, including those in which a non-Russian language was the principal medium of instruction for other subjects (e.g., mathematics, science, and social studies).

Although many non-Russian languages were still offered as a subject of study at a higher class level (in some cases through complete general secondary school – the 10th class), the pattern of using Russian language as the main medium of instruction accelerated after Khrushchev's parental choice program got under way.
Pressure to convert the main medium of instruction to Russian was evidently higher in urban areas. For example, in 1961-62, reportedly only 6% of Tatar children living in urban areas attended schools in which Tatar was the main medium of instruction. Similarly in Dagestan in 1965, schools in which the indigenous language was the medium of instruction existed only in rural areas. The pattern was probably similar, if less extreme, in most of the non-Russian union republics, although in Belarus and Ukraine schooling in urban areas was highly Russianized.

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