Controversial Issue - Homosexuality?

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Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#1 Jun 11, 2007
Although not usually discussed openly in AA communities, homosexuality is very much apart of them.

Is it an abomination to God? Is there such a thing as a gay gene? Is it a choosen lifestyle? Points of view like these (as well as others) are prevalent in our communities.

Although I am very much aware that this is a very sensitive, sometimes devisive, and often times controversial issue, I decided to put this out on a thread to invoke an interesting, thought provoking dialogue from all sides of the aisle.

While I invite all opinions on this subject, it is my hope that everyone will put forth his or her view in a thoughtful and respectful manner. It is my personal opinion that no one's belief is superior to any other.

With that in mind, "What say you?"
MDJ

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#2 Jun 12, 2007
Same sex relationships, have never been an issue for me. What two same sex couples, choose to do in the privacy, of there home is not my business. And i definitely, do not discriminate, if same sex couples, are in a relationship, It's just not that serious for me.

My uncle was gay, and he meant everything to me. He had earned, his Master's degree, and he was a Pyschologist. And i was so proud of him. He's no longer, with us. But when he was....loving him meant more to me, than judging him for being gay.

And if homosexuality, is a abomination, to God. Then let God be the Judge. But I hope my uncle, is not in heaven, being punish, for being gay. But rewarded, for his accomplishments, when he was here.

Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#3 Jun 12, 2007
MDJ wrote:
Same sex relationships, have never been an issue for me. What two same sex couples, choose to do in the privacy, of there home is not my business. And i definitely, do not discriminate, if same sex couples, are in a relationship, It's just not that serious for me.
My uncle was gay, and he meant everything to me. He had earned, his Master's degree, and he was a Pyschologist. And i was so proud of him. He's no longer, with us. But when he was....loving him meant more to me, than judging him for being gay.
And if homosexuality, is a abomination, to God. Then let God be the Judge. But I hope my uncle, is not in heaven, being punish, for being gay. But rewarded, for his accomplishments, when he was here.
Thank you, MDJ, for your response. I both agree with you and think that you're right on point with your comments. I, too, had an uncle who was gay (in the closet gay).

In my humble opinion, I honestly believe that the AA communities are doing themselves a great dis-service by ostracizing homosexuals.

It seems that the two most commonly expressed opposition to homosexuality is that (1) it's unnatural and (2) a marriage should be between one man and one woman. From where did these points of view originate? The Bible?

I submit that the Bible makes references to many other types of marriages that are contrary to the way that it's practiced today in AA communities.

Again, thank you for making one of your personal experiences apart of this discussion.
DFW girl

Dallas, TX

#4 Jun 12, 2007
I do not have an issue with homosexuality. Like MDJ, I believe what two consenting adults do is their business. However, I do not believe in the gay gene. I think it is more nurture than nature.

Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#5 Jun 12, 2007
DFW girl wrote:
I do not have an issue with homosexuality. Like MDJ, I believe what two consenting adults do is their business. However, I do not believe in the gay gene. I think it is more nurture than nature.
Thank you DFW for your response. I interpret your comment to mean that homosexuality is/can be a chosen lifestyle for consenting adults. Am I correct?

If I may ask, "Do you believe that homosexuality is an abomination to God?" Regardless of how you answer this question, would you be so kind as to tell why you feel that way?

Again, thank you for sharing your perspective about this often-time controversial issue.
La Diabla

Aspen, CO

#6 Jun 12, 2007
Hi there gundeee. I missed this thread. Well, as a bisexual woman myself, I feel that I didn't choose this lifestyle, but then again....scientists have not proven that there's a "gay" gene either...not that I know of yet. A "gay" gene is something I just don't believe in for some reason even though I'd NEVER actually "choose" the way I am. I don't want to be bisexual, but I've learned to accept it for what it is and don't care what others may think of me. I do have a question though gundee, when a person is only 10 years old and was raised going to church three times a week, in a strict religious home, she's attracted to females (as well as males), what does that mean exactly? How can someone so young have feelings like this when they were never exposed to "the gay lifestyle" whatsoever, not even by watching tv? I still haven't figured that one out yet. I'm speaking of myself in case you haven't noticed. I didn't "act" on my sexuality until I was 19. I am now 24. I didn't realize the full meaning of "bisexuality" until that age :\. I can tell you that you are right....homosexuality/bisexua lity is definitely something that's in the AA community as well as other communities.
La Diabla

Aspen, CO

#7 Jun 12, 2007
Oh, to answer your question gundee, I don't believe in going to church or following the scriptures, but in my heart I do think that homosexuality/bisexuality is an abomination to God. My parents taught me so and it stuck with me.

Since: May 07

Washington, DC

#8 Jun 12, 2007
gundee123 wrote:
Although not usually discussed openly in AA communities, homosexuality is very much apart of them.
Is it an abomination to God? Is there such a thing as a gay gene? Is it a choosen lifestyle? Points of view like these (as well as others) are prevalent in our communities.
Although I am very much aware that this is a very sensitive, sometimes devisive, and often times controversial issue, I decided to put this out on a thread to invoke an interesting, thought provoking dialogue from all sides of the aisle.
While I invite all opinions on this subject, it is my hope that everyone will put forth his or her view in a thoughtful and respectful manner. It is my personal opinion that no one's belief is superior to any other.
With that in mind, "What say you?"
As for this subject, homosexuality in the AA community is a rather touchy issue. We heard time after time and again and afain that us blacks think being gay is a bad thing. I am feeling convinced that both genetics as well as social factors play a role in homosexuality. However, I'm noticing somewhat of a double standard gender wise in regards to this homosexuality issue. Haven't you guys been noticing that black men are more shunned by the black community but never gay black women that act like dykes aren't? I've heard more blacks bash gay black men than gay black women. I don't think I have any gay relatives that I know of on either side of my families, but I don't have a problem with homosexuality whatsoever. However, there is one catch. I don't mind if a black person is genetically homosexual as that's something you don't have control over but however, I hate any black person who chooses to be that way as a form of lifestyle. There's no excuse for it and you're setting yourself up for ridicule just by doing it. To elaborate on the social upbringing cause of homosexuality, I'll say that for example, you may have a 3 year old black boy that may have been hanging around his bigger sister for long periods of time doing female things to the point where he begins to believe that he's a girl and assumes there's nothing wrong with it. It's sort of on par with an identity crisis, where these black men and women are confused about their sexual orientation.

Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#9 Jun 12, 2007
La Diabla wrote:
Hi there gundeee. I missed this thread. Well, as a bisexual woman myself, I feel that I didn't choose this lifestyle, but then again....scientists have not proven that there's a "gay" gene either...not that I know of yet. A "gay" gene is something I just don't believe in for some reason even though I'd NEVER actually "choose" the way I am. I don't want to be bisexual, but I've learned to accept it for what it is and don't care what others may think of me. I do have a question though gundee, when a person is only 10 years old and was raised going to church three times a week, in a strict religious home, she's attracted to females (as well as males), what does that mean exactly? How can someone so young have feelings like this when they were never exposed to "the gay lifestyle" whatsoever, not even by watching tv? I still haven't figured that one out yet. I'm speaking of myself in case you haven't noticed. I didn't "act" on my sexuality until I was 19. I am now 24. I didn't realize the full meaning of "bisexuality" until that age :\. I can tell you that you are right....homosexuality/bisexua lity is definitely something that's in the AA community as well as other communities.
Thank you, La Diabla, for your comments and for joining in on this discussion. Let me start by commending you for accepting who you are as it relates to your sexual orientation in spite of what others might think.

Please know that I am not presenting myself as an expert on this topic---my opinions are just like everyone else's. With that in mind, I will attempt to answer your question.

Simply said, "I do not know why a 10-year girl would develop a sexual attraction for someone (be it female or male). From a scientific perspective, we do know that human beings develop a biological urge to have sex. It can be argued as to when this urge kicks in, but it is believe that it's around puberty.

For heterosexuals, homosexuals, and bisexuals, this biological urge (I would argue) is considered natural. The question, in my mind, is: Would it be natural for a person to be attracted to someone of the same sex in order to fulfill this biological urge?

I personally believe that the environment, exposure, nurturing, modeling, moral beliefs, religious views, etc., would possibly best explain how people go about fulfilling their sexual urges. Whether there is a gay gene or not is something that will probably be debated for years to come.

It has been revealed that some people do not have a biological urge to have sex at all (asexual). Do you think this should be labeled as being natural or unnatural--or perhaps something else?

Again, thank you for sharing your personal experience with the AA community.

Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#10 Jun 12, 2007
La Diabla wrote:
Oh, to answer your question gundee, I don't believe in going to church or following the scriptures, but in my heart I do think that homosexuality/bisexuality is an abomination to God. My parents taught me so and it stuck with me.
Thank you for your comment. I agree with you, except that I do not believe that homosexuality/bisexuality is an abomination to God.

The reason that I make this statement is because Jesus never condemned it. However, AA communities have vehemently condemned it.

It's kind of interesting to me that the bible (KJV) uses the word Sodomites in referring to homosexuality. I wonder if most people in the AA communities realize that sodomy (Sodomites) is not limited to same sex partners. Actually, it's a term used to define anal and oral sexual intercourse. Do you think that heterosexual couples ever indulge in sodomy? If so, do you think that it's anyone else's business?

Again, that you for sharing your perspective with us.
Peace Out

Midway City, CA

#11 Jun 12, 2007
gundee123 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for your comment. I agree with you, except that I do not believe that homosexuality/bisexuality is an abomination to God.
The reason that I make this statement is because Jesus never condemned it. However, AA communities have vehemently condemned it.
It's kind of interesting to me that the bible (KJV) uses the word Sodomites in referring to homosexuality. I wonder if most people in the AA communities realize that sodomy (Sodomites) is not limited to same sex partners. Actually, it's a term used to define anal and oral sexual intercourse. Do you think that heterosexual couples ever indulge in sodomy? If so, do you think that it's anyone else's business?
Again, that you for sharing your perspective with us.
I know a person who did it up in the butt and wern't a homosexual. She weren't a lady though but she sayed she liked it,. She cursed a lot.

Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#12 Jun 12, 2007
Mack the Great wrote:
<quoted text>
As for this subject, homosexuality in the AA community is a rather touchy issue. We heard time after time and again and afain that us blacks think being gay is a bad thing. I am feeling convinced that both genetics as well as social factors play a role in homosexuality. However, I'm noticing somewhat of a double standard gender wise in regards to this homosexuality issue. Haven't you guys been noticing that black men are more shunned by the black community but never gay black women that act like dykes aren't? I've heard more blacks bash gay black men than gay black women. I don't think I have any gay relatives that I know of on either side of my families, but I don't have a problem with homosexuality whatsoever. However, there is one catch. I don't mind if a black person is genetically homosexual as that's something you don't have control over but however, I hate any black person who chooses to be that way as a form of lifestyle. There's no excuse for it and you're setting yourself up for ridicule just by doing it. To elaborate on the social upbringing cause of homosexuality, I'll say that for example, you may have a 3 year old black boy that may have been hanging around his bigger sister for long periods of time doing female things to the point where he begins to believe that he's a girl and assumes there's nothing wrong with it. It's sort of on par with an identity crisis, where these black men and women are confused about their sexual orientation.
Thank you, Mack the Great, for your comments. I agree that there is a perceived double standard as it relates to gay Black males, as opposed to lesbian Black females in AA communities. Why do you think it's that way?

I noticed that you are somewhat harsh on gays if they were gay by choice. You said if that was the case, they would be setting themselves up for ridicule just by doing it." What if they were really in love (agape) and didn't mind the ridicule. If I may ask, "Would you still feel the same way?"

Again, thank you for bringing your perspective in to this discussion.
Peace Out

Midway City, CA

#13 Jun 12, 2007
gundee123 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you, Mack the Great, for your comments. I agree that there is a perceived double standard as it relates to gay Black males, as opposed to lesbian Black females in AA communities. Why do you think it's that way?
I noticed that you are somewhat harsh on gays if they were gay by choice. You said if that was the case, they would be setting themselves up for ridicule just by doing it." What if they were really in love (agape) and didn't mind the ridicule. If I may ask, "Would you still feel the same way?"
Again, thank you for bringing your perspective in to this discussion.
gundee, I don't know were you going with this but if you interested in a good time email me at hot4you@hotmail.com

Level 1

Since: Jun 07

United States

#14 Jun 12, 2007
Peace Out wrote:
<quoted text>gundee, I don't know were you going with this but if you interested in a good time email me at hot4you@hotmail.com
Thank you for comment. You said that you don't know where I'm going with this. Please read paragraph #3 of post #1. For your convenience, I've posted it below. It reads as follows:

Although I am very much aware that this is a very sensitive, sometimes divisive, and often times controversial issue, I decided to put this out on a thread to invoke an interesting, thought provoking dialog from all sides of the aisle.

If the good time that you're referring to is discussing this topic, then I am interested. Otherwise, I am not interested.

Thank you again for becoming apart of this discussion.
DFW girl

United States

#15 Jun 13, 2007
gundee123 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you DFW for your response. I interpret your comment to mean that homosexuality is/can be a chosen lifestyle for consenting adults. Am I correct?
If I may ask, "Do you believe that homosexuality is an abomination to God?" Regardless of how you answer this question, would you be so kind as to tell why you feel that way?
Again, thank you for sharing your perspective about this often-time controversial issue.
I don't think it is as simple as someone just waking up one day and saying he or she is homosexual. I think it has more to do with the mothers hormone levels and external stimuli from birth. I do find it odd though that in many sets of twins, one is homosexual. I do not think that this is just a coincidence.

I struggle with how God feels about this. It is not in the commandments handed down to Moses. It is however found in the law of Moses that was abolished when Christ came. If anything, I feel that Christians can learn a lot from the Gay community on how to be a neighbor and how to treat one another.
DFW girl

United States

#16 Jun 13, 2007
I think our response is going to differ in our locations. The Dallas is suppose to be more of a gay-friendly area. It is not uncommon here in the Black community to see gay Black males or females. There is even a controversy in a Fort Worth school where a gay male wanted to cross dress.
DFW girl

United States

#17 Jun 13, 2007
La Diabla wrote:
Hi there gundeee. I missed this thread. Well, as a bisexual woman myself, I feel that I didn't choose this lifestyle, but then again....scientists have not proven that there's a "gay" gene either...not that I know of yet. A "gay" gene is something I just don't believe in for some reason even though I'd NEVER actually "choose" the way I am. I don't want to be bisexual, but I've learned to accept it for what it is and don't care what others may think of me. I do have a question though gundee, when a person is only 10 years old and was raised going to church three times a week, in a strict religious home, she's attracted to females (as well as males), what does that mean exactly? How can someone so young have feelings like this when they were never exposed to "the gay lifestyle" whatsoever, not even by watching tv? I still haven't figured that one out yet. I'm speaking of myself in case you haven't noticed. I didn't "act" on my sexuality until I was 19. I am now 24. I didn't realize the full meaning of "bisexuality" until that age :\. I can tell you that you are right....homosexuality/bisexua lity is definitely something that's in the AA community as well as other communities.
By 19 many females have enough negative experience with men to want to go another way. I think for many females, homosexuality/bisexuality comes from bad experiences with men.
Sinajuavi

United States

#18 Jun 13, 2007
I agree that there are multiple causes of "gayness". Women being abused by men in a patriarchal culture which encourages macho idiocy is certainly one factor.

There also seems to be a biological factor...some people are "born gay". Others choose it.

This is a free country, choose what you like... and we should also work to eliminate not only prejudice against gays but the overriding patriarchy which poisons society in so many ways.

“The Lion of Judah”

Since: May 07

Wait and see

#19 Jun 13, 2007
gundee123 wrote:
Although not usually discussed openly in AA communities, homosexuality is very much apart of them.
Is it an abomination to God? Is there such a thing as a gay gene? Is it a choosen lifestyle? Points of view like these (as well as others) are prevalent in our communities.
Although I am very much aware that this is a very sensitive, sometimes devisive, and often times controversial issue, I decided to put this out on a thread to invoke an interesting, thought provoking dialogue from all sides of the aisle.
While I invite all opinions on this subject, it is my hope that everyone will put forth his or her view in a thoughtful and respectful manner. It is my personal opinion that no one's belief is superior to any other.
With that in mind, "What say you?"
This is a reality for all societies and has been since the creation of the human race. First, homosexuality is not an abomination to GOD, people (Not You) do not know how to read Scriptures. God said “Thou shalt not lay with a man as with a woman, for “IT” is an abomination unto me.” So here we see that GOD once again and consistently as ever, condemns the sin and not the sinner. In other words, if you partake in the sexual act, it is a sin and the sin is the actual abomination, and this is no different for adultery, for which you were also put to death in the Old Testament. I have observed from black women in particular, they fear homosexuality in their sons and in their boy friends (Not All) so much to the point where they scorn their young sons on the scene “Stop acting like a faggot,” such reprimands only serve to emasculate young males and confuses them, especially if the father is not their to provide a bases for which he is to immolate his own masculinity. Also, there is the prisons in which many young brothas are horribly raped by older males. I think this also explains a lot about the spread of HIV in the black community, leading many to believe that there are many black men that swing both ways, I still believe that bi-sexual and homosexual me are in the minority. The fact is, a young brotha that has been gang raped and sexually abused will die before he breaths a word of it to anyone. The first thing he is going to do when he is released, is have sex with the first female he can find to reaffirm his manhood. Inmates are five times more likely to become infected with HIV within 6 months to 1 year of incarceration in the prisons. Anyway, it is a fact of life that people are gay for whatever reason. I don’t think we as a community should turn our backs on our family, I don’t think that is what GOD would want us to do.

“Technical Anomaly”

Since: Apr 07

Youngstown, OH

#20 Jun 13, 2007
Wow [applause], I am surprised at the rather civil responses to this issue. good job.
Mack the Great wrote:
<quoted text>
As for this subject, homosexuality in the AA community is a rather touchy issue. We heard time after time and again and afain that us blacks think being gay is a bad thing. I am feeling convinced that both genetics as well as social factors play a role in homosexuality.
Yes, genetic, social, AND the person.

It is all in percentages, so the person with certain genes is *more likely*, in a *certain social situation* to be homosexual, but to say there is a GAY GENE is a bit misinformative.

I personally disagree with this, as I am straight, as in my sexuality is heterosexual.

However, I feel, that if someone is to do this, that is their choice.

Is it "an abomination"? Good question

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