REVOLUTIONARIES in AA Forum: ARE ther...

Since: Jun 12

Hoddesdon, UK

#46 Mar 28, 2013
Savant wrote:
When racism and exploitation disappears, then we can move on. But it will not just disappear, we must abolish it.
Competition will NEVER end..therefore racism/discrimination will NEVER end.. we learn to roll with the punches, and when it all comes on top all we can do is riot.
Savant wrote:
When the degradation of women ends, then we can move on. Bu tit won't end by itself. We must end it.
You are talking about a music genre that denigrates our women..that will pass..it is a fad,unfortunately.
Savant wrote:
When there are no longer 12 million children going to bed hungry every night in the world's richest country, then we can move on.
Don’t forget Africa where millions have died over the past decades simply becuase are so called brothers have failed to get their act together.
Savant wrote:
But this won't happen automatically. WE must END hunger and the rapacious economic system which causes it.
I agree.. I live in the England and I’m being asked to donate money to staving kids in England while at the same time donating to staving kids in Africa..go figure.
Savant wrote:
When militarism and imperialism disappears, then we can move on. But it won't happen automatically. We must abolish militarism and imperialism.
LMAO..so long as we stave for oil there will never be an end to imperialism..think about imperialism the next time you are pissed in a queue at the gas station waiting to fill up your car and raising he!! about the price of gas.
Savant wrote:
When have a free, just and cooperative society, then we can move FORWARD. But that won't happen automatically. We must CREATE such a society, such a COMMUNITY OF FREEDOM which affirms not only the dignity of our people, but the dignity of every man, woman and child on earth.
Damn you sure as he!! like to complicate things..what happened to the quickest route between two point is a straight line..you are going all the way around Australia dude.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#47 Mar 29, 2013
Savant wrote:
<quoted text>
Capitalism crushes the spirit, and it is capitalism which makes the welfare state necessary.
Therefore, we must also end capitalism to end the corporate welfare state. In short, we need revolution.
Whether or not competition ever ends, COOPERATION is the foundation of society and civilization. Aa the founding principle of society, competition is the law of savagery, not civilization. Hence, in any decent and humane society, competition will be secondary to cooperation and free mutual association.
As for racism and discrimination, they are historical social inventions, evil fabrications of human origins. Not creations of nature. What some humans have created, other humans can abolish. Why should we assume that racism is man's eternal fate? Wasn't aboluste monarchy, the Roman Empire, feudalism and numerous other now extinct evils once thought eternal? Wasn't an argument among defenders of slavery in America that Abolitionism is impractical because slavery had always existed, and would continue into eternity?
You speak of some musical genre degrading to women. I don't recall talking about music, and do not know what you're alluding to. But I do know that all degradation of women is an unspeakable abomination, and that goes especially for the ultra degradation of women of color by the twin evils of racism and patriarchy. Like racism, patriarchy is an abomination. Death to patriarchy!
As for millions starving in Africa (and elsewhere), they're mainly victims of the very system of global exploitation and racial imperialism that the Revolution must eliminate. Even those corrupt African leaders are products of that system and largely, in Fanon's words, criminal "junior partners of capitalism." These black jackals, these venal TRAITORS, must be neutralizd. To hell with them! But their example do confirm Martin Luther King's obseration that "The BOURGEOISIE--white, black or brown--behaves about the same the world over."(AUTOBIOGRAPHY OF MARTIN LUTHER KING, p.125). This old order must be ended and a more humane society, a community of freedom created

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#48 Mar 29, 2013
@ Freddie47.

You mention also being asked to donate to starving people in England and Africa.
But why do people go hungry in rich countries, and why are other countries kept destitute, famished and superexploited? It is the same system causing social miseries in England and in African countries. Only the miseries in the wealthy global north are cushioned, while the miseries in the destitute global south and naked and unmitigated.
Revolution now, and until such miseries everywhere ends; until every man, woman and child on earth can enjoy liberated lives of freedom, dignity and happiness.
The means of ending tyranny and social miseries exist. We must summon up the courage and the willm abd a sense of human decency and compassion.
Michele Yeoh

Laredo, TX

#49 Mar 29, 2013
Savant wrote:
Once the national black community was full of revolutionaries. I've even met a few of the 1960s revolutionaries in the middle or old age: Angela Y. Davis, Huey P. Newton, Stokely Carmichael, Kathleen Cleaver & even CLR James.
These were/are men and women devoted to bring about a fundamental change in the sociel order, and in our order of values.
Freedom, self-determination, the transcendence of racism and economic exploitation. And, in Fanon's words, the settting "afoot of the New Man."
What they seek is as much a moral and spiritual revolution as an economic and political one.
In the 1960s, many gave their lives for the liberation of our people, black people, and indeed oppressed people throughout the land and throughout the world.
Even thier idea of freedom was different, as in no. 1 of the Ten Point Prgoram of the Black Panther Party: "We want FREEDOM. We want the power to determine the destiny of our Black community."
Community was at the heart of the very conception of freedom. And then you had Dr. King with his idea of Beloved Community.
Do we have it in us now to be revolutionaries? Or are we totally immersed and bemused by the toxic culture of consumerism and narcissism?
Have we a vision of a better life transcending the Established order?
Revolutionaries? lol Please, your Rebels would betray in a NYC minute to get with an Ugly low self-esteem having White Fat chick.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#50 Mar 29, 2013
@Freddie47

I rcall your saying that so long as we starve for oil ther will be no end to imperialism.(Or do you mean "slave" for oil? I think ther's a misspelling which may make your intended meaning unclear).
I'd like to remind you that imperialism preceded the current oil dependent industries and economies. Once tobacco, sugar and slaves were the big things. Now it's oil. But a rapacious economic system supported by militarism is the common denominator of modern imperialism. WE must break the power of BP, Haliburton, and other bastions of the corporate oil plutocracy. We must move toward a cooperative society, and in the process explore alternatives oil dependency and oil addiction---alterantive not for corporate profit, but for human need. And in our radical social transformation we must develop a new ethic which cherishes and respects the earth, an ethic which does not regard Nature as a mere thing or tool for human exploitation. There may be much we can learn from the cultures of some Native Americans, native Africans and others in reorienting our relationship with nature.
As for imperialism--oil driven or not--it must end. Death to imperialism!

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#51 Mar 29, 2013
@Freddie47

As to your last point: Human relations, human community, is more involving than two points connected by a line. A new human community is what I've got in mind. It is an active relation of self with others and the world. There can be no "I" without a "thou".
In part, I have in mind something like Dr. King's idea of the World House, if you're familiar with WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE, CHAOS OR COMMUNITY? And I find myself in stream with the moral sentiments implied in the following words of Black revolutionary humanist Frantz Fanon:"What we want to do is to go forward all the time....in the company of Man, in the company of ALL men."
This is the fundamental meaning of a new Revolution. FREEDOM RISING!!!

Level 6

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#53 Mar 29, 2013
I was communist.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#57 Mar 30, 2013
Harrisson wrote:
<quoted text>
LOVE is one of the most fundamental values of all. It has to be a love that transcends the current worship of money and materialism.
My current love interest is Caucasian but is an educator like yourself. She educates primarily minority youngsters and I know that she pours her heart into her work with a kind of dedication that she could likely never muster for the benefit of a Wall Street investment firm.
So, I would immediately say that LOVE and EDUCATION or learning would be foremost among the values of the new society.
Of Course, Dr. King's vision of a new revolutionary social order he articulated in terms of the BELOVED COMMUNITY. The WORLD HOUSE that he speaks of is a vision of global justice and brotherhood, the Beloved Community gone global.
Even Che Guevarra wrote somewhere that it is essential that the revolutionary be motivated by loved for the oppressed.
I would say that at the very least a Revolution should seek to create sonditions in which people are at least better ENABLED to love. The Agapic love of which King speaks so often.
And perhaps, brother Harrisson, we may pause with these words from the young Frantz Fanon:

"I, the man of color, want only this: That the tool never possess the man. That the enslavement of man by man cease forever...That it be possible for me to discover and to LOVE man, wherever he may be." (BLACK SKINS, WHITE MASKS, p. 231)

So let it be, so let it be.

Level 2

Since: Jul 08

Location hidden

#58 Mar 30, 2013
Savant wrote:
<quoted text>
Of Course, Dr. King's vision of a new revolutionary social order he articulated in terms of the BELOVED COMMUNITY. The WORLD HOUSE that he speaks of is a vision of global justice and brotherhood, the Beloved Community gone global.
Even Che Guevarra wrote somewhere that it is essential that the revolutionary be motivated by loved for the oppressed.
I would say that at the very least a Revolution should seek to create sonditions in which people are at least better ENABLED to love. The Agapic love of which King speaks so often.
And perhaps, brother Harrisson, we may pause with these words from the young Frantz Fanon:
"I, the man of color, want only this: That the tool never possess the man. That the enslavement of man by man cease forever...That it be possible for me to discover and to LOVE man, wherever he may be." (BLACK SKINS, WHITE MASKS, p. 231)
So let it be, so let it be.
Che Guevara your hero was a cold blooded killer.

http://brookesnews.com/072210fontova.html

You poor deluded old man.

Level 8

Since: May 08

Pacific Northwest

#59 Mar 30, 2013
Spock Adams Mathers wrote:
<quoted text>
Che Guevara your hero was a cold blooded killer....
It's the nature of the job, you brain-damaged hypocrite.

What makes you think that a patriotic American Revolutionary like George Washington wasn't also a "cold blooded killer?"

Do you think he really cried himself to sleep every night thinking about all the poor British souls who had to die in order to win the War of Independence?

What about William Tecumseh Sherman and his "total war" on the state of Georgia?
http://www.history.com/topics/shermans-march

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#60 Mar 30, 2013
Spock Adams Mathers wrote:
<quoted text>
Che Guevara your hero was a cold blooded killer.
http://brookesnews.com/072210fontova.html
You poor deluded old man.
You are an incredibly SIMPLEMINDED person. In order to show the importance of a prospect of humanistic love in a new society wrought by Revolution, I simply pointed out the emphasis on such by TWO different revolutionaries with CONTRASTING methods and ideologies.
That BOTH Dr. King and Guevarra emphasized the importance of love, of brotherhood, seemed to me to REINFORCE Harrisson's point that perhaps love is the most revolutionary force of all.
Have you NO imagination? Must everything be spoon fed to you like a child?

"L'imagination au pouvoir"--from the French '68 revolt, must be a battle cry of any new revolution.
Capitalism mixed (at least in America) with racism has clearly dulled the imagination and intellects of far too many Americans.
Our Revolution must recover human critical intelligence and creative imagination.

Since: Jun 12

Hoddesdon, UK

#62 Mar 30, 2013
Savant wrote:
You mention also being asked to donate to starving people in England and Africa.
But why do people go hungry in rich countries, and why are other countries kept destitute, famished and superexploited?
People go hungry in rich countries becuase capitalism in its current form has failed..the trickledown theory has failed. Other countries are kept destitute by their respective governments..in both cases I put it down to crony capitalism..just note the difference between market and political entrepreneurs...it really is as simple as that.
Savant wrote:
It is the same system causing social miseries in England and in African countries. Only the miseries in the wealthy global north are cushioned, while the miseries in the destitute global south and naked and unmitigated.
LOL..please..I think your stretching now..I doubt very seriously Brits would tolerate the level of corruption that exists in Africa...I agree us Brits are cautioned with a safety net. What is happening in Africa is totally different..to put it simply Africa continues to be stripped of its wealth by political entrepreneurs.
Savant wrote:
Revolution now, and until such miseries everywhere ends; until every man, woman and child on earth can enjoy liberated lives of freedom, dignity and happiness.
I agree..we should start by holding these despotic African leaders accountable for their actions instead of placing them on a pedestal.

Since: Jun 12

Hoddesdon, UK

#63 Mar 30, 2013
Savant wrote:
As to your last point: Human relations, human community, is more involving than two points connected by a line. A new human community is what I've got in mind. It is an active relation of self with others and the world. There can be no "I" without a "thou".
Well lead by example then.. suburban and urban Blacks in the US can’t even find common ground..the former being fearful of the later...you all thought the grass was greener out in the suburbs and now there is a distinct division. So before you go talking about a global community can I suggest get your own house in order first.
Savant wrote:
In part, I have in mind something like Dr. King's idea of the World House, if you're familiar with WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE, CHAOS OR COMMUNITY? And I find myself in stream with the moral sentiments implied in the following words of Black revolutionary humanist Frantz Fanon:"What we want to do is to go forward all the time....in the company of Man, in the company of ALL men."
This is the fundamental meaning of a new Revolution. FREEDOM RISING!!!
Look, I think we need to stop standing on the shoulders of past revolutionists..the real revolution died with MLK , MX and the real Black Panthers IMO..now just admit it you all failed to follow through and, that is why you are still harping on about MLK...you all are left with the likes of Bill Cosby and Cornel West...all they care about is money and prestige. In the UK so called Blacks in high places remain silent becuase they are scared of being labelled trouble makers.

Since: Jun 12

Hoddesdon, UK

#64 Mar 30, 2013
@Savant..IMO we have been too lax and now we are paying the price. Maybe your hopes and aspiration will come to pass a few generations down the line.

I still say conservatives in the US (in cahoots with Euro conservatives) caused the mayhem in the US and it rippled across the pond..those very same conservatives are now in control in Europe..oh dear.

Research thatcher and reagan.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#66 Apr 1, 2013
freddie47 wrote:
<quoted text>
People go hungry in rich countries becuase capitalism in its current form has failed..the trickledown theory has failed. Other countries are kept destitute by their respective governments..in both cases I put it down to crony capitalism..just note the difference between market and political entrepreneurs...it really is as simple as that.
<quoted text>
LOL..please..I think your stretching now..I doubt very seriously Brits would tolerate the level of corruption that exists in Africa...I agree us Brits are cautioned with a safety net. What is happening in Africa is totally different..to put it simply Africa continues to be stripped of its wealth by political entrepreneurs.
<quoted text>
I agree..we should start by holding these despotic African leaders accountable for their actions instead of placing them on a pedestal.
I partly agree, and partly disagree with your comments. I will give the reasons when I get a minute. I will say right now that I do see those African despots as part of the system of global capitalism, and part o fthe legacy of imperialism. They are trash, and so is the system which they uphold.
Revolution must do away with them.

Level 6

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#67 Apr 1, 2013
Spock Adams Mathers wrote:
<quoted text>
Che Guevara your hero was a killer.
He only fought for the safety of his beloved friends and relatives.

Since: Jun 12

Hoddesdon, UK

#68 Apr 2, 2013
"....Revolution must do away with them"

I agree my friend but which side do we listen to. Take Libya for example..some Libyans cried for the death of Gaddafi and praised French British intervention. I know where I live the local Libyans celebrated Gaddafi‘s death. IMO we should just butt the fu..ck out of other countries business and leave them to it.

I am all in favour of the 5th US Fleet stationed in the Persian Gulf though albeit at the US tax payers expense, sorry.

All this US imperialism you talk about is all based on keeping you yanks in creature comforts.

Think about Great Britain as they colonised the world..Brits back home were living in squalor...you could be walking down the street and someone would throw a bucket of p!ss on your head...by rights we should have all been living in the lap of luxury.

IMO Black Americans lead the pack becuase they have endured and then overcame adversity in a very short period of time..that is becuase they are strong minded..they may appear to be aggressive but one can easily confuse aggression and assertiveness...it is a fine fu..cking line.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Level 8

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#69 Jan 23, 2015
Brother Realist wrote:
We have a bunch of no good Arm-Chair Revolutionaries who prey on the ignorance of our people just to sell bogus DVDs, stage comical debates at twenty dollars an ignorant black face and sell books better used as toilet paper..smh
Mr. Savant,
Please spare us the revolutionary crap. It's all a fantasy. We need to talk about our real problems of why we cannot function in modern western society.
Here listen to Dr. Manning and Mr. 5723Michael
and let me know how we can move foward.
You seem like a intelligent individual, but I believe just misguided.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =AuwlqeNRElIXX
https://www.youtube.com/watch...
https://www.youtube.com/watch...
Here is Mr.5723Michael
https://www.youtube.com/watch...
https://www.youtube.com/watch...
https://www.youtube.com/watch...
https://www.youtube.com/watch...
Please take the time to listen to the message from both these strong brothers.
Frankly, these ranting preachers, long on rhetoric and short on analysis, are really old hat. We need clear, revolutionary analysis and sound grassroots organizing. We cannot function in Western society largely because Western society is itself dysfunctional. The capitalist system is dysfunctional and self-destructive.. Failure to find or create alternative will lead to our doom.As for that ranting void of social analysis, I leave for reflection the words of a revolutionary Black Christian minister, Martin Luther King, Jr.:
"I wish today, that Christians would stop talking so much about religion and starting doing something about it, and we would have a better world. But the problem is that the church has sanctioned every evil in the world. Whether it's racism, or whether it's the evils of monopoly capitalism, or whether it's the evils of militarism. And this is why these things continue to exist in the world today."
Dr. King, Ebenezer Baptist Church, Atlanta, January 7, 1968

Since: Jun 12

Manchester, UK

#70 Feb 8, 2015
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> I partly agree, and partly disagree with your comments. I will give the reasons when I get a minute. I will say right now that I do see those African despots as part of the system of global capitalism, and part o fthe legacy of imperialism. They are trash, and so is the system which they uphold.
Revolution must do away with them.
Revolution?...don't make me laugh....forget Africans and those despots...we are waiting for you "AA's" to make a move..forget those idiots LOL!!!!;

Since: Jun 12

Manchester, UK

#71 Feb 8, 2015
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> I partly agree, and partly disagree with your comments. I will give the reasons when I get a minute. I will say right now that I do see those African despots as part of the system of global capitalism, and part o fthe legacy of imperialism. They are trash, and so is the system which they uphold.
Revolution must do away with them.
You wouldn't dare confront me with that kind of BS off line so shut the he!! up.

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