Level 1

Since: Apr 11

Malawi

#43 Jun 7, 2011
Garrig wrote:
<quoted text>
Y-dna R1b.... Mtdna H, U6 V
Take a look at the dna of the Kabyle Berbers.
"Y-Dna haplogroups, passed on exclusively through the paternal line, were found at the following frequencies in Kabylie : E1b1b1b (E-M81)(47.36%), R1*(xR1a)(15.78%)(later tested as R1b3/R-M269 (now R1b1b2)[5]), J1 (15.78%), F*(xH, I,J2,K)( 10.52%) and E1b1b1c (E-M123)(10.52%)[6]. The North African pattern of Y-chromosomal variation (including both E1b1b and J haplogroups) is largely of Neolithic origin.
MtDNA Haplogroups, by contrast, inherited only from the mother, were found at the following frequencies : H (3.65%), U*(29.03% with 17.74% U6), preHV (3.23%), preV (4.84%), V (4.84%), T*(3.23%), J*(42%), L1 (3.23%), L3e (4.84%), X (3.23%), M1 (3.23%), N (1.61%) and R (3.23%). The mtDNA makeup of Kabyles is : 70.96% general Western Eurasian (H, J, U, T, K, X, V, N and I), 20.97% specific Eurasian-North African (U6, M1) and 8.07% sub-Saharan gene flow (L)."
^ Arredi B, Poloni ES, Paracchini S, Zerjal T, Fathallah DM, Makrelouf M, Pascali VL, Novelletto A, Tyler-Smith C.(2004). "A predominantly neolithic origin for Y-chromosomal DNA variation in North Africa."
http://wn.com/Kabyle_people
Hi Garrig!
There are numerous berber tribes. The kabyle are one of the most "eurasian" looking. Even they have almost 50% e1b1b which originated in east africa.Berbers originated in east africa not eurasia. Are you denying that e1b1b is the most common haplogroup in berber men? R1B originated in asia not western europe. It is also found in frequencies as high as 90% in cameroon. R1b is more common in cameroon then in berber men.

http://nilevalleypeoples.blogspot.com/2010/05...

http://digitalcommons.wayne.edu/humbiol/vol82...

These studies from 2010 cover all your arguements....
GIGASET

Kaiserslautern, Germany

#44 Jun 7, 2011
berber are mixed with vandals. the vandals came from north west europe they where germanic
GIGASET

Kaiserslautern, Germany

#45 Jun 7, 2011
among others not only vandal of coursse

Level 1

Since: Apr 11

UK

#46 Jun 10, 2011
GIGASET wrote:
berber are mixed with vandals. the vandals came from north west europe they where germanic
Yes the berbers did mix with vandals but eurocentrics claim that the vandals,greeks, romans etc didn't leave any offspring! They just disappeared without leaving dna!
Barros Serrano

Silver City, NM

#47 Jun 10, 2011
The majority of Berber DNA comes from 3 waves of migration from the Mideast, all in prehistoric times: one 30,000 years ago which brought early Mideasterners identical to the closely related Cro-Magnon of Europe, another 10,000 years ago called "Capsian", and the Neolithic migrations of around 7,000 years ago. There are also lesser amounts of Iberian DNA, and smaller amounts resulting from historical peoples such as Carthaginians, Vandals, and Arabs.

This describes the majority of ancestral DNA found in the Berbers, that of Eurasian origin.
Perp

Renton, WA

#48 Jun 10, 2011
Barros Serrano wrote:
The majority of Berber DNA comes from 3 waves of migration from the Mideast, all in prehistoric times: one 30,000 years ago which brought early Mideasterners identical to the closely related Cro-Magnon of Europe, another 10,000 years ago called "Capsian", and the Neolithic migrations of around 7,000 years ago. There are also lesser amounts of Iberian DNA, and smaller amounts resulting from historical peoples such as Carthaginians, Vandals, and Arabs.
This describes the majority of ancestral DNA found in the Berbers, that of Eurasian origin.
Fking web archaeologist. STFU you all over the place.

Level 5

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#49 Jun 10, 2011
Barros Serrano wrote:
The majority of Berber DNA comes from 3 waves of migration from the Mideast, all in prehistoric times: one 30,000 years ago which brought early Mideasterners identical to the closely related Cro-Magnon of Europe, another 10,000 years ago called "Capsian", and the Neolithic migrations of around 7,000 years ago. There are also lesser amounts of Iberian DNA, and smaller amounts resulting from historical peoples such as Carthaginians, Vandals, and Arabs.
This describes the majority of ancestral DNA found in the Berbers, that of Eurasian origin.
...remember 90% of the berbers have the native african E1B1B1B
Planet of the Chimps

Coseley, UK

#50 Jun 10, 2011
Berbers were immigrants from IBERIA, (Spain and Portugal). They also emigrated to Ireland and Britain. They were the inhabitants of the British Isles before the advent of the Celts. They are NOT Negroes.
GIGASET

Kaiserslautern, Germany

#52 Jun 11, 2011

Level 1

Since: Apr 11

Malawi

#53 Jun 11, 2011
Planet of the Chimps wrote:
Berbers were immigrants from IBERIA,(Spain and Portugal). They also emigrated to Ireland and Britain. They were the inhabitants of the British Isles before the advent of the Celts. They are NOT Negroes.
80% of berber men belong to haplogroup e1b1 which originated in east africa.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_E1b1_ (Y-DNA)

http://www.thegeneticatlas.com/E1b1_Y-DNA.htm
husayn

Victoria, Canada

#54 Jun 17, 2011
Planet of the Chimps wrote:
Berbers were immigrants from IBERIA,(Spain and Portugal). They also emigrated to Ireland and Britain. They were the inhabitants of the British Isles before the advent of the Celts. They are NOT Negroes.
NOPE they mixed
pn2cladelover

Tilbury, UK

#55 Jul 5, 2011
they are a multi ethnic group of people, so people trying to desperately say they are eurasian so that means the moors were not black are deluded.

1.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki /Berber_people

2.Ancient Local Evolution of African mtDNA Haplogroups in Tunisian Berber Populations

Frigi et al.

Human Biology

August 2010

3.Biocultural Emergence of the Amazigh in Africa: Comment on Frigi et al.(2010)
S. O. Y. Keita

Frigi et al.[2010

Level 3

Since: Jul 10

Newport Beach, CA

#57 Jul 5, 2011
I think I may have jumped in a little late. But From the Frigi article it states that African mtDNA arrived in N.Africa 20,000 BP, which is after 30,000 BP, the date submitted for Eurasians arrival...

Level 3

Since: Jul 10

Newport Beach, CA

#58 Jul 5, 2011
GIGASET wrote:
STFU, kraut. We don't take kindly to your type around here.
pn2cladelover

Tilbury, UK

#59 Jul 5, 2011
ottomaddox wrote:
I think I may have jumped in a little late. But From the Frigi article it states that African mtDNA arrived in N.Africa 20,000 BP, which is after 30,000 BP, the date submitted for Eurasians arrival...
how do you think the eurasians got there

Level 3

Since: Jul 10

Newport Beach, CA

#60 Jul 5, 2011
pn2cladelover wrote:
<quoted text>
how do you think the eurasians got there
By foot, over a long period of time... why do you ask?
pn2cladelover

Tilbury, UK

#61 Jul 5, 2011
ottomaddox wrote:
<quoted text>
By foot, over a long period of time... why do you ask?
yes i know by foot but where did they come in africa, here from the levant or??????

what culture did this eurasian people have,

“WARRIOR WOMAN-->THE BLACK XENA”

Level 5

Since: Jul 07

$Money Makin' Manhattan$

#62 Jul 5, 2011

Level 3

Since: Jul 10

Newport Beach, CA

#64 Jul 5, 2011
pn2cladelover wrote:
<quoted text>
yes i know by foot but where did they come in africa, here from the levant or??????
what culture did this eurasian people have,
Right. Honestly I don't believe that where they came from is very relevant for people today to be concerned with, and the same goes for culture. With that said, I believe that they came from somewhere in the middle east. Whether the levant, or inland Arabia, even Egypt could be plausible, they could have been nomads that traveled between N.Africa and Arabia, since the environment was the same. I don't really think that it's important though.

As far as the original inhabitants' culture goes, it was that of hunter gatherers, which was more or less the same every where, I'd reckon, with the only differences being based on what was there to eat, and whatever vernacular or superficial differences developed over time. From there it appears to be a home grown culture that probably changed with contact to outsiders.

It's interesting that the date (20000BP) posited for African mtDNA arriving in N. Africa is around the same time that the Iberomaurusian culture/industry arose. It could just be a coincidence, but it's interesting. That's my two-cents atleast.

And I'm curious. I think I already have an idea of what you believe, but how would you answer this question: From where did they come? What was their culture?
c diddy

Alexandria, LA

#65 Jul 5, 2011
pn2cladelover wrote:
they are a multi ethnic group of people, so people trying to desperately say they are eurasian so that means the moors were not black are deluded.
1.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki /Berber_people
2.Ancient Local Evolution of African mtDNA Haplogroups in Tunisian Berber Populations
Frigi et al.
Human Biology
August 2010
3.Biocultural Emergence of the Amazigh in Africa: Comment on Frigi et al.(2010)
S. O. Y. Keita
Frigi et al.[2010
Breh....Socalled Berbers a group of North African mongrels whom are a mixture of black original North Africans, the decendents European slaves and arab settlers whom are teh dominant group.

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