the moors were black africans not ara...
KiloEcho

Kinshasa, Congo, The Democratic Republic of the

#17866 Oct 7, 2013
African AE said

Romans built bath houses! Muslims are low IQ dumb idiots and still are!

KiloEcho replies

Typical Eurocentric ignorance and arrogance

How the Moors described their European foes: Sa-id of Andalusia wrote the following of his White Iberian opponents:

They “are nearer animals than men ... They are by nature unthinking and their manners crude.

Their bellies protrude; their color is white and their hair is long. In sharpness and delicacy of spirit and in intellectual perspicacity, they are nil.

Ignorance, lack of reasoning power and boorishness are common among them.”(Kitab Tabakat al Umaxn (Blachere K. p. 36. 1935).

Falsifying history or lying about the past is one of one the easiest ways to take over the world and maintain world dominance after centuries in servitude and in the Dark Ages.
African AE

Cape Town, South Africa

#17868 Oct 7, 2013
KiloEcho wrote:
African AE said
Romans built bath houses! Muslims are low IQ dumb idiots and still are!
KiloEcho replies
Typical Eurocentric ignorance and arrogance
How the Moors described their European foes: Sa-id of Andalusia wrote the following of his White Iberian opponents:
They “are nearer animals than men ... They are by nature unthinking and their manners crude.
Their bellies protrude; their color is white and their hair is long. In sharpness and delicacy of spirit and in intellectual perspicacity, they are nil.
Ignorance, lack of reasoning power and boorishness are common among them.”(Kitab Tabakat al Umaxn (Blachere K. p. 36. 1935).
Falsifying history or lying about the past is one of one the easiest ways to take over the world and maintain world dominance after centuries in servitude and in the Dark Ages.
The Spanish thought the Moors were a bunch of savages!
African AE

Cape Town, South Africa

#17869 Oct 7, 2013
LION wrote:
<quoted text>
A very black person can have any dna sequence unlike other races. If the moors were not black then how come there were 3 black moors in Shakespeare plays?
If the moors were not black then how come the SONG OF ROLAND only speak of black negro moors?
Nope, not really! The majority of the Moors were North African Berbers and Arabs with some Africans! The majority of Sub-Saharan Africans carry E1b1a. North Africans carry E1b1b and some Berbers who carry North African E1b1b look like Europeans!
African AE

Cape Town, South Africa

#17870 Oct 7, 2013
After the Spanish conquered the Moors, a lot of Moors stayed in Spain and converted to Christianity. If the Moors were black Africans PLEASE EXPLAIN WHY SPANISH PEOPLE HAVE SO LITTLE SUB-SAHARAN DNA?????????

The MOORS WERE NORTH AFRICAN BERBERS/ARABS!!!!!!!!!!

www.spanish-web.com/history/moors.php
KiloEcho

Kinshasa, Congo, The Democratic Republic of the

#17871 Oct 7, 2013
African AE said

Nope, not really! The majority of the Moors were North African Berbers and Arabs with some Africans!

The majority of Sub-Saharan Africans carry E1b1a.

North Africans carry E1b1b and some Berbers who carry North African E1b1b look like Europeans!

KiloEcho replies

The word moor predates Islam by at least a thousand years

Have you ever heard of Saint Maurice or Saint Maurus?

All African men of Christian faith and they were called Moors LONG before the advent of Islam or the Arabo-Berber conquest of Iberia

You don't seem to understand that the E haplogroup and all its subclades, including the E3b aka e1b1b haplogroup originate in East Africa, located in Africa south of the Sahara.

The place of origin of the E haplogroup and ALL its subclade , including e1b1b is Africa south of the Sahara, in ETHIOPIA

http://www.genebase.com/learning/article/2

The origin of this E Y-chromosome is most likely in East Africa, near Ethiopia.

North Africans carry the e1b1 they inherited from their East Africans ancestors, who are dark brown skinned, that is, Black people.

Unmixed North Africans, including unmixed Egyptians and Berbers, do not look like Europeans.

Those who look like Europeans are hybrids with a lot of European admixture.

Their European ancestors were settlers, invaders, and slaves, like the Mameluks, the Janissaries, the Saqaliba, the less known Punic slaves, the Barbary slaves, Morean Greeks sold in Ottoman Egyt on public markets as late as 1828.
African AE

Durban, South Africa

#17873 Oct 7, 2013
KiloEcho wrote:
African AE said
Nope, not really! The majority of the Moors were North African Berbers and Arabs with some Africans!
The majority of Sub-Saharan Africans carry E1b1a.
North Africans carry E1b1b and some Berbers who carry North African E1b1b look like Europeans!
KiloEcho replies
The word moor predates Islam by at least a thousand years
Have you ever heard of Saint Maurice or Saint Maurus?
All African men of Christian faith and they were called Moors LONG before the advent of Islam or the Arabo-Berber conquest of Iberia
You don't seem to understand that the E haplogroup and all its subclades, including the E3b aka e1b1b haplogroup originate in East Africa, located in Africa south of the Sahara.
The place of origin of the E haplogroup and ALL its subclade , including e1b1b is Africa south of the Sahara, in ETHIOPIA
http://www.genebase.com/learning/article/2
The origin of this E Y-chromosome is most likely in East Africa, near Ethiopia.
North Africans carry the e1b1 they inherited from their East Africans ancestors, who are dark brown skinned, that is, Black people.
Unmixed North Africans, including unmixed Egyptians and Berbers, do not look like Europeans.
Those who look like Europeans are hybrids with a lot of European admixture.
Their European ancestors were settlers, invaders, and slaves, like the Mameluks, the Janissaries, the Saqaliba, the less known Punic slaves, the Barbary slaves, Morean Greeks sold in Ottoman Egyt on public markets as late as 1828.
Well the whole of North Africa is mostly mixed. The Kabyle Berbers look just like Europeans but carry E1b1b as their main Haplogroup so are INDIGENOUS to North Africa:
www.missalgeria.tripod.com
African AE

Durban, South Africa

#17874 Oct 7, 2013
The Kabyle Berbers have Haplogroup J as their second Haplogroup. A lot of North Africans are related to Middle Eastern Eurasians:

www.comlive.net/Miss-algerie-2007,114652,160....

“DANGER!!”

Level 8

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#17875 Oct 7, 2013
DISASTER LOOMS wrote:
<quoted text>
i don't think many 'moors' meaning those responsible for the muslim domination of southern europe ended up in WA and on the slave ships.
but the original moors and berbers were for the most part black africans who mixed with eurasians.
Sorry, buddy, but you're wrong about the Moors having been mostly or even significantly 'Black'.

http://www.plosgenetics.org/article/info%3Ado...

"Author Summary

Proposed migrations between North Africa and neighboring regions have included Paleolithic gene flow from the Near East, an Arabic migration across the whole of North Africa 1,400 years ago (ya), and trans-Saharan transport of slaves from sub-Saharan Africa. Historical records, archaeology, and mitochondrial and Y-chromosome DNA have been marshaled in support of one theory or another, but there is little consensus regarding the overall genetic background of North African populations or their origin and expansion. We characterize the patterns of genetic variation in North Africa using ~730,000 single nucleotide polymorphisms from across the genome for seven populations. We observe two distinct, opposite gradients of ancestry: an east-to-west increase in likely autochthonous North African ancestry and an east-to-west decrease in likely Near Eastern Arabic ancestry. The indigenous North African ancestry may have been more common in Berber populations and appears most closely related to populations outside of Africa, but divergence between Maghrebi peoples and Near Eastern/Europeans likely precedes the Holocene (>12,000 ya). We also find significant signatures of sub-Saharan African ancestry that vary substantially among populations. These sub-Saharan ancestries appear to be a recent introduction into North African populations, dating to about 1,200 years ago in southern Morocco and about 750 years ago into Egypt, possibly reflecting the patterns of the trans-Saharan slave trade that occurred during this period."

“DANGER!!”

Level 8

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#17876 Oct 7, 2013
CuloHecho wrote:
The word moor predates Islam by at least a thousand years
Have you ever heard of Saint Maurice or Saint Maurus?
All African men of Christian faith and they were called Moors LONG before the advent of Islam or the Arabo-Berber conquest of Iberia
You don't seem to understand that the E haplogroup and all its subclades, including the E3b aka e1b1b haplogroup originate in East Africa, located in Africa south of the Sahara.
The place of origin of the E haplogroup and ALL its subclade , including e1b1b is Africa south of the Sahara, in ETHIOPIA
http://www.genebase.com/learning/article/2
The origin of this E Y-chromosome is most likely in East Africa, near Ethiopia.
North Africans carry the e1b1 they inherited from their East Africans ancestors, who are dark brown skinned, that is, Black people.
Unmixed North Africans, including unmixed Egyptians and Berbers, do not look like Europeans.
Those who look like Europeans are hybrids with a lot of European admixture.
Their European ancestors were settlers, invaders, and slaves, like the Mameluks, the Janissaries, the Saqaliba, the less known Punic slaves, the Barbary slaves, Morean Greeks sold in Ottoman Egyt on public markets as late as 1828.
You mean St. Mauritius, and he was NEVER referred to as a "Moor" until the 13th Century, after German Crusaders built a church in Germany dedicated to St. Moritz and made an icon supposedly of the saint which was crudely fashioned somewhat after the Ethiopian Christian knights with whom, alongside, they had fought, but even the Ethiopian knights were not nearly as 'Black' as that ridiculous 'Black Sambo' saint's icon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Saint_Mauri...

•••

The name, "Mauritius", was a common name throughout the Roman Empire and had originally meant only that someone was from Maghribíya or Mauritania.

In the 3rd Century AD, the name Mauritius had already been around for about 4 centuries and had become so widespread in use amongst all of the Empire's subjects that even an Egyptian from Thebes would easily have been given that name.

Thebes was part of (((LOWER))) Egypt and St.Mauritius and his fellow Roman/Egyptian Legionaries were far more likely to have been overwhelmingly Caucasian.

Other artists did not depict that saint as a 'Black' man:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:St_Maurice_...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Smaurice.jp...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Elgreco50.j...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Holy_Trinit...
motts

UK

#17877 Oct 7, 2013
Statue of Saint Benedict the Moor in the Franciscan church in Santiago de Compostela, Spain

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3560/338451882...

THE SPANISH KNOW BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE WHAT THE MOORS LOOKED LIKE

&fe ature=watch_response
motts

UK

#17878 Oct 7, 2013
Vacuous Me, his BFF Barros and their science fiction 'study' have been wrapped up neatly and put to bed by Clyde Winters!
'BLACK AFRICANS' AKA 'TRUE AFRICANS 'AKA 'AFRICANS', HAVE BEEN IN NORTH AFRICA FOR OVER 40,000 YEARS.
'In summary Sub-Saharan Africans have been in North Africa for the past 40ky- not 1.2ky [1,3] as claimed by Henn et al. These Sub-Saharan Africans carried haplogroup L3(M,N)[2,10]. The fact these populations crossed into Iberia across the Straits of Gibraltar make it clear that Sub-Saharan Africans were already in North Africa before this exit into Europe this makes Sub-Saharan Africans indigenous to North Africa.'

'The North Africans who carry Levantine and European genome probably result from the Vandal invasion of North Africa, and Greco-Roman colonies established in North Africa over the past 2ky. Most European females entered during the Vandal period and Ottoman slave trade. The Ottoman Turks mainly imported European females into North Africa—not Sub-Saharan females. This would mean that they introduced these genes to North Africa'

http://www.plosgenetics.org/annotation/listTh...

References:&#8232;&#82 32;

[1] Winters C . The Gibraltar Out of Africa Exit for Anatomically Modern Humans . WebmedCentral BIOLOGY 2011;2(10):WMC002319 . http://www.we bmedcentral....

&#8232;&#8232;[2] Caramelli,D.,Lalueza-Fox,C., Vernesi,C., Lari,M.,Casoli,A., Mallegni,B.C., Dupanloup, I., Bertranpetit,J., Barbujani,G., Bertorelle,G.(2003). Evidence for a genetic discontinuity between Neandertals and 24,000 year-old anatomically modern Europeans. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A.,100 (11):6593-6597.

&#8232;&#8232;[3] Winters C.(2008). Aurignacian Culture: Evidence of a Western Exit for Anatomically Modern Humans. South Asian Anthropologist , 8(1):79-80.

&#8232;&#8232;[4] Winters C.(2010) Origin and Spread of Haplogroup N. Advances in Bioresearch 1(1): 61-65. http://www.soeagra.com/ab...&#8232;&#... ;

[5] Gonder MK, Mortensen HM, Reed FA, de Sousa A, Tishkoff SA.(2006). Whole mtDNA Genome Sequence Analysis of Ancient African Lineages. Mol Biol Evol. http://mbe.ox fordjournals...&#8232; &#8232;[4]Boule, M., HV Vallois .(1957). Fossil Man . Dryden Press New York&#8232;&#8232;[5] Diop, A.( 1991 ). Civilization or Barbarism. Lawrence Hill Books .&#8232;&#8232;
motts

UK

#17879 Oct 7, 2013
motts

UK

#17881 Oct 7, 2013
THE EUROPEANS KNOW WHAT MOORS LOOKED LIKE, WHILE YANKEE EURONUTS PRETEND THEY WERE WHITE LOL!

THE MOORS
Moor figure in sanssouci potsdam, Germany
http://wikimapia.org/17270480/Moorish-Rondell...

Moor figure in scauffhausen, Switzerland (copy and paste, all one link)
http://www.myswitzerland.com/en/infra_anlagen...

Statue of Saint Benedict the Moor in the Franciscan church in Santiago de Compostela, Spain
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3560/338451882...

Another image of a Black Moor can be seen on the Coat of Arms of His Holiness Benedict XVI.:

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xv...

The following link show a statue of BLACK AFRICAN MOORS in Venice Italy

http://www.shutterstock.com/pic-83388826/stoc...

Moor sculpture in Memmingen, Germany
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Memmin...

The Coburg Moor
http://www.flickr.com/photos/zsenya/499998250...

St. Mauritius the Moor
http://www.taneter.org/moors.html

A MOOR on the COAT OF ARMS of CORSICA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Coat_of_Arm...

4 MOORS on the COAT OF ARMS of SARDINIA
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Coats_of_ar...
Image of Gannibal the Moor of St Petersburg

http://bulletsandhoney.wordpress.com/2005/08/...
motts

UK

#17882 Oct 7, 2013
A MOOR ON EXHIBIT AT THE PHILADELPHIA NUSEUM OF ART.

The EURONUT trolls will say the museum is Afrocentric LOL!

http://www.philamuseum.org/collections/perman...

This is one of my favourites.
AN EXHIBIT ON DISPLAY IN MUNICH, GERMANY.

http://www.muenchner-stadtmuseum.de/en/muench...

ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL!
motts

UK

#17883 Oct 7, 2013
BLACK MOORS IN EUROPEAN ROYALTY

Take a look at the first Duke of Florence..
Alessandro de' Medici (1511-37) of Black Moorish descent or should we say 'Moorish descent' as the 'Moors' were BLACK.
The Medici, an Italian family of merchants, bankers, rulers, patrons and collectors, dominated the political and cultural life of Florence from the 15th century to the mid 18th century.
So even after the Moors were defeated they were still held in high regard all over Europe in many royal families.

http://www.google.co.uk/search...
motts

UK

#17884 Oct 7, 2013
HOW THE BLACK MOORS CONQUERED, CIVILISED AND EDUCATED SPAIN……and you think they would be grateful….well, kind of.

http://ixwa.hubpages.com/hub/The-History-And-... #

The trolls can never explain this dish LOL!
Moros_y_Cristianos or Moors and Christians.
AKA.. BLACK BEANS and WHITE RICE!!

The SPANISH people of Valencia just love it!! It's part of their BLACK ROOTS!!

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres...
motts

UK

#17885 Oct 7, 2013
BLACK MOORISH ROYALTY IN MOROCCO

Moulay al-Rashid (1631-1672)(Arabic:&#1605; &#1608;&#1604;&#15 75;&#1610; &#1575;&#1604;&#15 85;&#1588;&#1610;& #1583;) was Sultan of Morocco from 1666 to 1672.
Mawlaay or Moulay al-Rashid is called the founder of the Alaouite Dynasty.

this is how Mulay al-Rashid was described at the time: "He is of middle size; his face is long and thin; his beard, forked and white, his color, almost black with a white mark near the nose" - Abbé Busnot, Histoire de Regne de Mouley Ismael, Roven, 1714

http://moorishpac.com/moulay-al-rashid-sultan...

http://www.aucklandartgallery.com/the-collect...

BEWARE OF FAKE WHITEWASHED IMAGES POSTED BY EURONUTS!!
motts

UK

#17886 Oct 7, 2013
MOOR = BLACK

"Snowden (1970) and Desanges (1981) reference various writers’ physical descriptions of the ancient Maghreb’s inhabitants. In various writers’ physical descriptions of the ancient Maghreb’s inhabitants. In addition to the presence of fair-skinned blonds, various “Ethiopian” or “part-Ethiopian” groups are described, near the coast and on the southern slopes of the Atlas mountains.“Ethiopians,” meaning dark-skinned peoples usually having “ulotrichous”(wooly) hair, are noted in various Greek accounts and European coinage (Snowden, 1970). Hiernaux (1975) interprets the finding of “subsaharan” population affinities in living Maghrebans as being solely the result of the medieval transsaharan slave trade; it is clear that this is not the case. Furthermore, the blacks of the ancient Maghreb were apparently not foreign or a caste." (S.O.Y Keita, "Studies of Ancient Crania From Northern Africa," American Journal of Physical Anthropology, 83:35-48 (1990).

 Joseph Vogel stressed: "Populations and cultures now found south of the desert roamed far to the north." (Encyclopedia of Precolonial Africa by Joseph O. Vogel, AltaMira Press, Walnut Creek, California, 1997, pp. 465-472).

"Except for the Zandj (black slaves) from lower Iraq, no large body of blacks historically linked to the trans-Saharan slave trade existed anywhere in the Arab world ... The high costs of slaves, because of the risks inherent in the desert crossing, which would have not permitted such a massive exodus ... Until the Crusades the Muslim world drew its slaves from two main sources: Eastern and Central Europe (Slavs) and Turkestan. The Sudan only came third." - Africa from the Seventh to Eleventh Century, UNESCO, 1988.

CONFIRMATION OF WHAT WE ALL KNOW …MOORS WERE BLACK.

Ish Tov
Level 3

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#17888 Oct 7, 2013
Nope. You're showing in Morocco almoravid or almohade rulers, who were from south of the Atlas Mts. They overran Morocco as well as Spain. those were the black Moors.

The fact remains that most Moors in Iberia were Berbers, not black Africans.

the Moors were slavers, including the W African ones. Unsavory bunch... pirates, parasites, plunderers

not to mention Moslems

“DANGER!!”

Level 8

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#17889 Oct 7, 2013
moot wrote:
Statue of Saint Benedict the Moor in the Franciscan church in Santiago de Compostela, Spain
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3560/338451882...
THE SPANISH KNOW BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE WHAT THE MOORS LOOKED LIKE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =7frbDr6CbtkXX&feature=wat ch_response
Wrong again, FÓÓL.

The misuse of the word, "Moor", in the case of this Saint is purely the fault of Sicilian Italians who were ignorant of the proper use of the word, "Moro", which was neither a Roman or Italian origin word.

The closest grammatically correct word in Italian would have actually been Mauro or Mauritio, meaning from Mauritania, but the Italians foolishly became used to the improper use of the Spanish word, "Moro", and that misuse was in that they foolishly took the meaning of the Spanish word, "Moro" to mean 'Black African', possibly because Sicily saw the Moorish invasion on THEIR land to be highly represented by the 'Black' Haratin slave conscripts.

In Spain, however, the word Moreno never really meant anything other than SWARTHY COMPLECTED and, originally, the word, "Moro", also merely meant someone from Maghribíya or, that is, the Mediterranean Mauritania.

That is ALL that it ever REALLY meant, but, later on, the name, "Moro", was mostly given to any Muslim invaders regardless of their origin, with only a few maverick word users who would from time to time follow the Italian conventional misuse of the word.

We weren't dealing with people who necessarily adhered to any scientific discipline here, so any exception to which you may choose to cling is purely out of shear ignorance on your part, FÓÓL.

In Spain, "Negro", meant black and 'Black' People were referred to as "NEGROS".

It was never really considered grammatically correct to refer to non-Muslim 'Blacks' as "Moros" even though some misuse may have occurred because of the foolish Italian influence.

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