Is MONOGOMY Unatural??
London

Memphis, TN

#1252 Apr 19, 2013
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>
London-"There are really only two groups who should get our unconditional love (no conditions or terms in which we act on their behalf) and that is parents and our own children."
Because you feel obligated to both,your parents for bringing you /caring for you,and you out of your own selfish/self based reason brought the child into the world..so youre obligated to take care and nurture it.
There is a natural connection to a parent or child because we are genetically connected. They hold puzzles to our own existence. It's a natural bond which is why we are extremely wounded as people when these natural relationships don't function as they should. It's not about selfish or unselfish. It's about what is versus what isn't.
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>

London"--I do not believe love between man and a woman should ever be unconditional."
That means youre only giving love as long as you're recieving it.
Love is an action. Love is also reciprocal. Therefore, man and woman can't have unconditional love (however lots of people disagree).
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>

That means youre only seeking that euphoric feeling and pleasure that "love"(those actions) is giving you.Isnt that called giving with strings attatched?
No because love is reciprocal anyway. It's an action. Love itself is tied closely to emotions, such as passion. But love itself is an action.
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>

Arent we supposed to give without expecting anything in return?(if its done from a pure heart)
You should only give when you aren't expecting anything in return. However, if you are the type of person who has to say this to yourself, you probably have a lot of problems anyway. However, the saying wasn't meant for emotions nor the act of giving love (which is reciprocal). You can't command emotions. You can only command an action.
Cap Black

Huntsville, AL

#1253 Apr 19, 2013
London wrote:
<quoted text> There is a natural connection to a parent or child because we are genetically connected. They hold puzzles to our own existence. It's a natural bond which is why we are extremely wounded as people when these natural relationships don't function as they should. It's not about selfish or unselfish. It's about what is versus what isn't.
<quoted text> Love is an action. Love is also reciprocal. Therefore, man and woman can't have unconditional love (however lots of people disagree).
<quoted text> No because love is reciprocal anyway. It's an action. Love itself is tied closely to emotions, such as passion. But love itself is an action.
<quoted text> You should only give when you aren't expecting anything in return. However, if you are the type of person who has to say this to yourself, you probably have a lot of problems anyway. However, the saying wasn't meant for emotions nor the act of giving love (which is reciprocal). You can't command emotions. You can only command an action.
London--"Love itself is tied closely to emotions, such as passion. But love itself is an action."

Love is an action fueled by passion and emotions(according to you) you said in your post. So your love is fueled by the passionate and emotional feelings that other person who you initially chose because they met your personal physical looks preferences.
London

Memphis, TN

#1254 Apr 19, 2013
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>
London--"Love itself is tied closely to emotions, such as passion. But love itself is an action."
Love is an action fueled by passion and emotions(according to you) you said in your post. So your love is fueled by the passionate and emotional feelings that other person who you initially chose because they met your personal physical looks preferences.
Actually I said love is an action and the feelings closely related to the action of love such as passion are often confused with love itself. Love is an action and a choice and in order to be with someone in a romantic sense, we must make the choice to love them regardless of the feeling of the moment we are choosing to love them. This is what separates us from animals. However, the choice to love should not be unconditional when it's in a romantic sense because romantic love is reciprocal love. It's not about self gratification, it's about the ability to love and also accept love which is not easy because it's a will issue. You have to choose to love for the reward of it.
Cap Black

Huntsville, AL

#1255 Apr 19, 2013
London wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually I said love is an action and the feelings closely related to the action of love such as passion are often confused with love itself. Love is an action and a choice and in order to be with someone in a romantic sense, we must make the choice to love them regardless of the feeling of the moment we are choosing to love them. This is what separates us from animals. However, the choice to love should not be unconditional when it's in a romantic sense because romantic love is reciprocal love. It's not about self gratification, it's about the ability to love and also accept love which is not easy because it's a will issue. You have to choose to love for the reward of it.
Love is an action and a choice and in order to be with someone in a romantic sense, we must make the choice to love them regardless of the feeling of the moment we are choosing to love them

This sounds like unconditional love,which you dont believe in.So how can you love someone "regardless of the feeling of the moment we are choosing to love them",unless you love them unconditionally?(which you dont believe in).You contradict yourself again.

London--"You have to choose to love for the reward of it."

And tell me what are these "rewards"? Getting ate out and fcked in the middle of the night when youre horny?,having someone to take trips with you so you wont be bored or feel alone?.I thought "Love" was for the other person.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1256 Apr 19, 2013
__jaz__ wrote:
<quoted text>
because you're only quoting half of the definition..
selfish:
(of a person, action, or motive) Lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.
if i were seeking a partner to benefit myself and only myself then yes i would be selfish..to not be concerned with your own needs at all is unhealthy and foolish, in fact it is necessary to be concerned with yourself to some degree in order to survive and live healthy..that's common sense..ppl have preferences and hangup for a reason.can some of those preferences be rooted in selfishness?? yes, but those preferences can also be for good/logical/healthy reasons..besides, you're assuming a lot about me and my life..you don't know me.
But you lack consideration for those men that dont fit your physical requirements as far as looks or personaolity.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1257 Apr 19, 2013
The moon is in leo.The sign that governs the 5th house of romance,love affairs/flings and children.Theres a reason why sex for pleasure and children are both in the same house. Can anyone honestly say that they love someone unconditionally. If conditions weren't placed on who we love and involve ourselves with, we simply would love the first person we interact with. We all want and desire certain qualities in partners(physical, personality and moral preferences,styles,appeal,etc) and will reject those that don't poses them. It is chiefly a quest to please ones need of companionship or to attain what one admires and respects, even if we receive satisfaction from pleasing the ones we love,( opposed to shunning others). Why do we love one person opposed to someone else, we don't love for no reason? Satisfying the selfish want or desires in a partner can only be the answer.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1258 Apr 19, 2013
Many scientist consider parental love (mother or father and a baby more specifically) to be more of an obsession. No conditionals are obviously placed on babies when they're born, but they are loved and admired because (they are an extension of the parents, are innocent and helpless, etc). Science supports this as well as it occurs in a different part of the brain than romantic love.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1259 Apr 19, 2013
__jaz__ wrote:
<quoted text>
because you're only quoting half of the definition..
selfish:
(of a person, action, or motive) Lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.
if i were seeking a partner to benefit myself and only myself then yes i would be selfish..to not be concerned with your own needs at all is unhealthy and foolish, in fact it is necessary to be concerned with yourself to some degree in order to survive and live healthy..that's common sense..ppl have preferences and hangup for a reason.can some of those preferences be rooted in selfishness?? yes, but those preferences can also be for good/logical/healthy reasons..besides, you're assuming a lot about me and my life..you don't know me.
Then why love one opposed to another? If not to fulfill ( or attain)a selfish desire, want etc. We all have preferences, we don't love anyone just to love them, there has to be some reward or gain in making the decision in the first place.

If it isn't unconditional means that it's selfish. I know we would sacrifice ourselves for the ones we love ( a selfless act per say), but only because we receive some selfish reward or enjoyment from their existence or interacting with them. Which is why we wouldn't do the same for random strangers.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1260 Apr 19, 2013
Capricorns see things for what they are,in an earthy/natural way. Sometimes considered cold for that reason. But it is what it is.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1261 Apr 19, 2013
This is why they left sad when Jesus told them to leave everything behind,all their worldly possessions(desires/attachment s)and come follow him.They all walked away sad.

"The husband says to the wife, "I love you," but in reality he simply uses her. The wife says she loves the husband, but she is simply using him. The husband may be using her as a sexual object and the wife may be using him as a financial security. Pleasure makes everybody cunning, deceptive.
Pleasure is not and cannot be the goal of life. The second word to be understood is happiness. Happiness is psychological, pleasure is physiological. Happiness is a little better, a little more refined, a little higher, but not very much different from pleasure. You can say that pleasure is a lower kind of happiness and happiness is a little higher kind of pleasure -- two sides of the same coin.

One day you are running after a man or a woman and the next day you are trying to find an excuse to get rid of the other. The same person, nothing has changed! What has happened meanwhile? You are bored with the other, because the whole pleasure was in knowing the new. Now the other is no longer new; you are acquainted with the territory of the other. You are acquainted with the body of the other, the curves of the body, the feel of the body. Now the mind is hankering for something new."--Osho the zen master
London

Memphis, TN

#1262 Apr 19, 2013
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>
Love is an action and a choice and in order to be with someone in a romantic sense, we must make the choice to love them regardless of the feeling of the moment we are choosing to love them
This sounds like unconditional love,which you dont believe in.
I never said I don't believe in unconditional love. I said I don't believe unconditional love between man and woman exists (nor should it). I would never ask a man to love me unconditionally. He's not my dad..he should have expectations of me as I will surely have for him. There are different types of love. I'm not going to go to my husband for the type of love I expect from let's say, my parent.

Because love is an action, there is always a choice to be made to love or not to love. Passion however goes up and down (for most of us anyway) but the choice to love remains.
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>

So how can you love someone "regardless of the feeling of the moment we are choosing to love them",unless you love them unconditionally?(which you dont believe in).You contradict yourself again.
Because I'm not choosing to love someone based on the feeling. I'm choosing love based on action.
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>

London--"You have to choose to love for the reward of it."
And tell me what are these "rewards"? Getting ate out and fcked in the middle of the night when youre horny?,
LOL. You don't need to love anyone in order to get some dear.
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>

having someone to take trips with you so you wont be bored or feel alone?.I thought "Love" was for the other person.
But you don't have to love anyone for these things.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1263 Apr 19, 2013
London wrote:
<quoted text> I never said I don't believe in unconditional love. I said I don't believe unconditional love between man and woman exists (nor should it). I would never ask a man to love me unconditionally. He's not my dad..he should have expectations of me as I will surely have for him. There are different types of love. I'm not going to go to my husband for the type of love I expect from let's say, my parent.
Because love is an action, there is always a choice to be made to love or not to love. Passion however goes up and down (for most of us anyway) but the choice to love remains.
<quoted text> Because I'm not choosing to love someone based on the feeling. I'm choosing love based on action.
<quoted text> LOL. You don't need to love anyone in order to get some dear.
<quoted text> But you don't have to love anyone for these things.
London--"Because I'm not choosing to love someone based on the feeling. I'm choosing love based on action."

Youre choosing love based on condition.Or what "action" that other person can do for you(according to you)
your love is a decision based on personal/selfish choices.
London

Memphis, TN

#1264 Apr 19, 2013
Capricorn Black wrote:
<quoted text>
London--"Because I'm not choosing to love someone based on the feeling. I'm choosing love based on action."
Youre choosing love based on condition.Or what "action" that other person can do for you(according to you)
your love is a decision based on personal/selfish choices.
If you are "loving" someone based on what they can do for you. That isn't love because IT IS ROOTED IN SELFISH DESIRES/WANTS/NEEDS.

If you are loving someone simply because you can for the reward of love itself, THAT IS LOVE. That is not selfish but unselfish.

Best definition of love imo:

Love is when you put the wants and
needs of others before your own wants
and needs.

MEASUEMENT OF LOVE

-How much you are willing to sacrifice for the welfare of another person.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1265 Apr 19, 2013
London--"Best definition of love imo:

Love is when you put the wants and
needs of others before your own wants
and needs."

Look how you contradict yourself..:

London--"Because I'm not choosing to love someone based on the feeling. I'm choosing love based on action."

Here you contradict yourself when you say you're choosing love based on action(what they can do for you).That goes against Your definition of "Love", which is to "put others needs first before your wants". Dont you see that?
London

Memphis, TN

#1266 Apr 19, 2013
Capricorn Black wrote:
London--"Best definition of love imo:
Love is when you put the wants and
needs of others before your own wants
and needs."
Look how you contradict yourself..:
London--"Because I'm not choosing to love someone based on the feeling. I'm choosing love based on action."
Love itself is an action. You can't give nor receive love but act in opposing way to it (cheat on them etc). When you make the choice to love, you must submit your will to another person. You must take action in order to love.
Capricorn Black wrote:
Here you contradict yourself when you say you're choosing love based on action(what they can do for you).That goes against Your definition of "Love", which is to "put others needs first before your wants". Dont you see that?
Sir you must do something in order for love to exist. That is the definition of love.

Capricorn Black

“Thy rod and thy staff ”

Level 6

Since: Aug 11

they comfort me

#1267 Apr 19, 2013
London wrote:
<quoted text>Love itself is an action. You can't give nor receive love but act in opposing way to it (cheat on them etc). When you make the choice to love, you must submit your will to another person. You must take action in order to love.
<quoted text> Sir you must do something in order for love to exist. That is the definition of love.
London-"Sir you must do something in order for love to exist."

No,you mean the action is proof that love exists,right?(according to you,Love is an action(an action that pleases your selfish needs).

I have to first be hungry(or have the desire),before im moved to eat.Me lifting the spoon to my mouth(by my action)is proof im hungry.You're loving that person for a reason(for yOur personal benefit).
London

Powell, OH

#1268 Apr 19, 2013
Capricorn Black wrote:
<quoted text>
London-"Sir you must do something in order for love to exist."
No,you mean the action is proof that love exists,right?(according to you,Love is an action(an action that pleases your selfish needs).
A need isn't about selfish or unselfish. It's about what is versus what isn't.
Capricorn Black wrote:
<quoted text>

I have to first be hungry(or have the desire),before im moved to eat.Me lifting the spoon to my mouth(by my action)is proof im hungry.You're loving that person for a reason(for yOur personal benefit).
Hunger isn't based on desire. Hunger is based on the need to eat. If you don't eat, you will die. You lifting the spoon is proof that you can lift the spoon. It is not proof that you are hungry.
Cap Black

Huntsville, AL

#1269 Apr 19, 2013
London wrote:
<quoted text>Love itself is an action. You can't give nor receive love but act in opposing way to it (cheat on them etc). When you make the choice to love, you must submit your will to another person. You must take action in order to love.
<quoted text> Sir you must do something in order for love to exist. That is the definition of love.
But youre only submitting because it keeps you recieving that love.Youre giving love so that you can get it back.And if you stop recieving love from this other person,you stop loving them.Your love is selfish,based on conditions with strings attached.Its not unconditional.
You still havent answered your contradictions. You say you choose love based on action(or what the other person does for you)..yet you say the definition of love is "putting other needs first before your wants.". You are putting your needs first because you say you choose love based on the other persons actions(what they can do for you).
Cap Black

Huntsville, AL

#1270 Apr 19, 2013
Pluto is retrograde. Time to look within. Buddha did not believe in God, did not believe in prayer.

I want you to understand it: the moment God and prayer are discarded, the only thing that is left is to go in. Buddha also was from the warrior caste, son of a king, trained to kill. He was not a vegetarian. But when meditation started blossoming in him, just as a by-product the vegetarian idea came into his being: you cannot kill animals for eating, you cannot destroy life.

life is a wheel -- a wheel of birth and death. The wheel goes on moving and we go on clinging to the wheel. And the wheel is repetitive; again and again it will move on the same track. Nothing new will ever happen. Birth will come, you will become young, you will be full of sex and great desires, and then you will be spent and you will be old, diseased, ill sick, frustrated, tired. And then death... and again birth... and so on and so forth.

Each birth brings a death, each death brings a birth. It is a vicious circle, and the wheel goes on moving. In India the word for the world is SAMSARA. SAMSARA means 'the wheel'. Youth or childhood or old age are just spokes of the wheel. and we go on clinging to the wheel and the wheel goes on moving -- as everything else moves in the world. The earth moves around the sun, and the sun also moves around some unknown sun. And the moon moves around the earth, and earth and moon both move around the sun, and the sun around some other sun, and so on and so forth. And all the stars are moving.... And EVERYTHING IS moving in a circle! Seasons move in a circle.

Life is a wheel and the wheel is repetitive. You will never reach anywhere if you go on clinging to the wheel. In the East it has been a known fact that we have to jump out of the wheel -- only then are we free. To be free from this wheel of birth and death is to have freedom. Then you simply ARE. Then you are not moving. Then there is no past and no future but only the present. Then NOW IS the only time and here the only space.

That is the state of nirvana, MOKSHA -- freedom. That is the real kingdom of God.
London

Powell, OH

#1271 Apr 19, 2013
Cap Black wrote:
<quoted text>But youre only submitting because it keeps you recieving that love.Youre giving love so that you can get it back.And if you stop recieving love from this other person,you stop loving them.Your love is selfish,based on conditions with strings attached.Its not unconditional.
You still havent answered your contradictions. You say you choose love based on action(or what the other person does for you)..yet you say the definition of love is "putting other needs first before your wants.". You are putting your needs first because you say you choose love based on the other persons actions(what they can do for you).
No. I didn't say that. Love itself is an action. This means you can't say you love someone and cheat on them or beat them. If you do these things, it means it was in the absence of love, not because of the presence of it. Love works to the benefit of the person receiving love (meaning it is not rooted in selfishness) and it is reciprocal. The reward for love is love. You believe sex is love but if that's the case prostitutes wouldn't exist. As I've said before, sex is basic. Anyone can have sex and get there basic needs met. Love is on a much higher level.

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